X10 Community Forum

💬General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Tuicemen on December 19, 2013, 10:52:25 AM

Title: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on December 19, 2013, 10:52:25 AM
Many of you have read Authinx is working on a X10 Wi-Fi unit.
Many like my self are very excited about this unit and want to know as much about it as possible.
Some have posted questions on my site or other sites with concerns some even contacted me with questions.
I forwarded those questions which were then passed on to the manufacture.
The manufacture wishes to know why these are important to us?
Not that some aren't already implemented.
x10(Authinx) wants to know if there are any other questions /suggestions as well.
This doesn't mean all will be implemented as they don't wish to delay the release anymore then needs be.
So I asked to post this.
Please reply stating why each is important to you?
There is no name for the device yet so they are looking for suggestion there but want it simple
Also If you have any other suggestions please post them here as well I doubt I'll need to forward your suggestions or questions as the owner does read the forum.

Here are some of your Questions & my ideas for the reason:

Note: I'll update my list as users post with reasons and new suggestions.
Please reply as this will affect how powerful this device will be initially

The manufacture now has this list and we are awaiting feed back.
>!
  
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit (input requested)
Post by: Knightrider on December 19, 2013, 11:59:10 AM
I would like clarification: is this a replacement controller to the cm15? Will it have local storage to run. on its own without a pc?
I guess I was anticipating a wifi unit like a module that circumvented plc. Like a AM or LM that received commands through wifi instead of PLC.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit (input requested)
Post by: Tuicemen on December 19, 2013, 01:23:02 PM
My understanding is this is a controller and is not a replacement for the cm15 AHP
Although if it transceived RF and PLC to then it could replace the cm15
Update:
           I received confirmation this is a controller that presently relays commands via PLC. :)%
Title: Re: Make your wish a reality!
Post by: Knightrider on December 20, 2013, 09:08:54 AM
X10 NextGen Controller
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit (input requested)
Post by: bcwmachine on December 20, 2013, 09:38:23 AM
As my cm15a is a long way from my computer (by usb standards), a critter similar to the cm15 but wifi instead of usb would be great.
Bruce

name? Wi-Fi CM critter
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit (input requested)
Post by: Tuicemen on December 20, 2013, 11:11:04 AM
I've been informed that all ideas, suggestions and questions will be looked at and submitted to the manufacture next week.

Also although my list looks like I have all questions covered the manufacture has requested reasons.
The more reasons we can give the more likely it will be added as a feature.
So if you see a question but think of another reason for asking then post that so I can add it.
This also will show more interest in the product then me and the few that have already posted.
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit (input requested)
Post by: hawk1 on December 20, 2013, 04:12:47 PM
FIDELITY Controller!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit (input requested)
Post by: HA Dave on December 20, 2013, 07:06:43 PM
Many of you have read Authinx is working on a X10 Wi-Fi unit......

I like simple... how about the name:  X10 Wi-Fi controller.

  • Will it send AND receive both x10 RF/PLC?
    Reason:  this is important as X10 is a mix of RF and PLC.PLC isn't dead far from it.  The unit needs to be plugged in for power anyways as for RF it reduced the need for a transceiver and will allow it to interface with the security  and motion sensors
RF and PLC send and receive of course would be best... for more reasons than can be listed. AND... sending the power-mid devices RF would be a bonus as well. Because with the right accessory and/or software IR could be added by using the new controller to send directly to a power-mid receiver.

  • Will it have a Ethernet connection?
Connect to/through a router to dedicated DNS server for world-wide connection is a super advantage! Old X10 users knew some of that ability via the old semi-dependable servers. We used it with the my home plug-in (for cameras mostly). Now with smartphone remote connection is a MUST.

  • Will it have a USB connection?
    Reason:  this would allow an interface to a PC making updates easier? not really sure why this was asked
  • Does this just use the cloud like other failed launches?
    Reason:  we don't want to be tide to a outside server look what happened with X10 and AHP servers

USB would allow for a PC connection... a PLUS if running local sensors and/or software. BUT... cloud connections are also very much part of the setups of the future.
 
  • Will a SDK or API be released?
    Reason: This will make this unit desirable to other software developers increasing user demand for the unit

So important that others be allowed to expand... even FLOOD the market with desirable software. I myself bought the original CM15A so I could use a 3rd party software that required the interface.

  • Will it have a replaceable external antenna?
    Reason: Many users have issues with current X10 RF signals the ability to add a bigger eternal antenna would help with that issue
  • will this have local storage for events like timers and macros or will end users need a PC?
    Reason: many are looking for a stand alone unit for control, not having to be connected to a PC except maybe to upload info is a big plus
Big antenna or long range.... it's the range that's required. An antenna "plug" of some sort could fix ALOT for some users.

  • Is there plans to have this send Wi-Fi commands to other devices?
    Reason: Since new Wi-Fi controllable devices are coming on the market all the time It would be nice to have one unit that could talk to them. for example a thermostat (many brands), WeMo devices (Berlin) Wi-Fi LEDs (MiLight, Philips hue)
I've wondered.... what laws/restrictions apply to enabling control of other brands of devices. Could be a real bonus for users of mixed brands.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit (input requested)
Post by: BaBaLou. on December 21, 2013, 12:20:04 AM
I am still here..... :)+

Been watching from the sidelines while still giving resuscitation to both my AHP setups I have with thanks to iHouse and the EU version.

First of all a big THANKS!!! :)%  to Authinx for helping keep hope for a future for the  X10 for us. Many where on the verge of moving to something new including myself.

As for a name, my first thoughts are, -:) "Wi X10", "X10WiFiCommander"  or " X10AirFi".

All the options suggested so far have a very good array of choices and reasons for them of which I do agree with.  :)%

But one issue I did have in the past with the old X10 setup was the update heart beat that the AHP does. Cogeco Cable had many issues with me concerning the frequency of the communication with X10net and catagorized it as a behavior of spam action and occording to them the url was of suspcious address and so would cut my internet connection until I communicated with them. That all stopped back in the summer when X10 shutdown. >*<

I do question any connection or relation of X10 and Ip or network Cameras in relationship to the unit itself. As for software that is fine. Lets just keep it clean and simple, Home Automation.

I did not see it, but as for option in the software, just take Tuicemen's PCc and IHouse and go with that. Floor Plans, Macros, Voice commands etc.  :)%

All the best in this venture for all involved. You can count on me watching even closer now.

BaBalou. 

Ps, A very Safe and Happy Holiday season to all ya X10 kids. >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit (input requested)
Post by: JeffVolp on December 21, 2013, 12:42:53 AM

After the problems encountered by many folks when X10 Wireless shut down, I think the most important issue is that it should not be necessary to access external servers to maintain system operation or reinstall programs on a new PC.

Jeff
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit (input requested)
Post by: autom8r on December 21, 2013, 01:28:52 AM
Looks like you guys have pretty well covered my wish list.
I would only add that I hope this this and any other future X10 offerings tend to focus on quality, reliability, functionality ect. and not so much on price point. Its easy to be spoiled by high quality equipment from the likes of JVDE, and WGL. I sure would like to see more X10 equipment (modules,sensors ect.)offered with similar quality!
I am very excited for the future of X10! :)%
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit (input requested)
Post by: autom8r on December 21, 2013, 01:42:05 AM
Name hmm... CONX10-"AIR"    -:)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit (input requested)
Post by: HA Dave on December 21, 2013, 02:05:25 AM
After the problems encountered by many folks when X10 Wireless shut down, I think the most important issue is that it should not be necessary to access external servers to maintain system operation or reinstall programs on a new PC.
Jeff

I can't disagree... with the frustration felt when I realized that without X10 servers part of my system had already failed.... and it was heartbreaking knowing it was only a matter of time till the rest of my system would fail.

But... without DNS servers for software products like "my house"... for things like remote control, camera viewing, security alarm arming and disarming we'd be giving up too much. I can use my camera DVR software to place [motion detected] images on the cloud... as well as recorded to the DVR's HD. I really like the idea of controlling many home functions via my smart phone. Standard old downloaded software can't cut it in the modern world.

BUT... if the new X10 owner would give up on the idea of cashing in with software profits (which isn't likely a profitable idea anyway) and release source information that allows 3rd party code writers to flood the market with software/apps that runs on all [the flavors of] operating systems.... Then that would be a very desirable interface... AND product-line. I'd LOVE to see/use a HA PC.... that is really only a Android tablet!

I had the old CM11A and HATED it! I never really figured out how to make the old Active Home work well. I bought the CM15A... ONLY because I desperately wanted to use Voice Recognition Software. Bill had written BXVC (later called BVC)... and it required a running PC and the CM15A with AHP and smart macros.

I think other code writers could create the very same demand for an open sourced home automation controller. Heck... I just recently paid the ten bucks for Mellowares iPhone app that allows me to control my X10 from my phone. Heck.... just think about it. Maybe a 100 interesting (and some free) apps available for download to control functions of a home automation system. Could anyone BUY that kind of product advertisement?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit (input requested)
Post by: Tuicemen on December 21, 2013, 09:11:22 AM
I think I've got all questions, request, reasons and name suggestions so far added to the original post. If not PM me and I'll fix it.
With the demise of the old X10 the community has become more aware what a internet tied system is like when the servers go down even for a brief moment.
I think we need options with what ever is added to the Wi-Fi modules for connections.
Maybe a fail safe if their server goes down then use a direct connection or the ability to use a user definable DNNS not one hard coded.
I have a foscam that sends the IP address each time it reconnects to the internet.
This is a fail safe for me if the DNNS I use goes down.
which brings up another question
Will this send email alerts?
Many things can be added via a PC connection  heck I even thought of adding this option to PCC(and still might)
BUT... if the new X10 owner would give up on the idea of cashing in with software profits (which isn't likely a profitable idea anyway) and release source information that allows 3rd party code writers to flood the market with software/apps that runs on all [the flavors of] operating systems.... Then that would be a very desirable interface... AND product-line. I'd LOVE to see/use a HA PC.... that is really only a Android tablet!
This won't be such a big deal with this device but would simplify things.
Since it is relying on Wi-Fi it is possible to listen into what is sent over the home network and recreating that.
This doesn't mean it is not secure one would need to know your network encryption key  to hack a end users setup.
Looks like you guys have pretty well covered my wish list.
I would only add that I hope this this and any other future X10 offerings tend to focus on quality, reliability, functionality ect. and not so much on price point.
Since the new owners were the distributors for the pro line I think they are on top of the quality thing(time will tell).
it is important for end users interested in this product to post even if the post states "you guys have it all covered!" It shows the new owner and the manufacture there is a large interest in them getting this right the first time.
Software/firmware upgrades can improve a lot but not if the hardware isn't there to handle it. >*<
 >!

Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit (input requested)
Post by: ggaglio on January 09, 2014, 11:37:47 PM
How about beginning to abolish the negative impact X-10 has left in the market place?

Xtense-fi, extended coverage using Wi-Fi. I have been an Xten user for over 15 years, have had my ups and downs with
the equipment and accessories but overall, I reliable use it to control my home automation.

Hopefully Authentix will continue to improve the products and offer new options to revive the new company.

X-10 is dead but let its spirit live on!!

Gus
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit (input requested)
Post by: dhouston on February 25, 2014, 09:34:05 AM
  • Will it have a USB connection?
    Reason:  this would allow an interface to a PC making updates easier
    would allow for a PC connection... a PLUS if running local sensors and/or software
    it would allow future hardware expansion
A serial port would be more attractive than USB for those who might want to write software to support this unit. USB is an order of magnitude more difficult to code for. There are excellent USB-Serial adapters costing less than $10 for those who want to use it with a PC that lacks serial ports. And, embedded USB is very difficult because of the massive overhead USB imposes, making serial far more attractive for interfacing with embedded controllers like Arduino, Raspberry Pi, etc.

Also, given that it's WiFi, that could be used for communicating with any PC in the local network, obviating the need for USB.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on February 26, 2014, 08:58:23 AM
Also, given that it's WiFi, that could be used for communicating with any PC in the local network, obviating the need for USB.
So true.
These were only questions mostly put forth by members which I merely forwarded to X10 which were then pasted on to the manufacturer.
We are unfortunately still waiting for a reply back from them (the manufacturer) B:(
Doing some digging I found Marmitek has a similar unit (http://www.marmitek.com/en/product-details/home-automation-security/x-10-home-automation/transmitters-and-controllers/tip10rf.php)already available to the European market. ::) :'
I asked if the North American unit would be similar and was told it will be a different animal.
Of coarse it will be, ::)  the RF frequency has to be different as well as the power supply. :'
There is also a app available (https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.marmitek.x10remote)for it which I suspect will work with the new WI-FI. ::) :'
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on February 26, 2014, 09:46:10 AM
The Marmitek unit appears to be no more than a bridge between a wired network (home LAN) connection and the CM15Pro (or other RF transceiver) relying on the CM15Pro for macros, etc. And, if there's a WiFi router in the network, it would allow for communication with any WiFi enabled device that is allowed a network connection. But, it appears to be one-way, sending X10 RF but getting no feedback from the X10 system.

Based on the limited information we've seen so far, the new unit from Authinx appears to be more robust - perhaps eliminating the need for a CM15A.

However, if Marmitek has followed recent X10 designs, it may use third party RF transmitter/receiver modules. If so, adapting it for N. America would merely require replacing the RF modules and the power supply (or maybe just the power cord).
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on February 26, 2014, 09:58:29 AM
Based on the limited information we've seen so far, the new unit from Authinx appears to be more robust - perhaps eliminating the need for a CM15A.
True, we should get something more robust.
From what I've been hearing the initial release will not be a full featured device with everything users are looking for (eliminating the cm15a).
However it is hoped it can be expanded on.
We should start to see more info leaking out on this by mid March.
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: JeffVolp on February 26, 2014, 12:19:43 PM
Someone just posted this link on my own Forum:

    http://pj88global.com/?p=72

Is that perhaps the Wi-Fi unit that is being discussed here?  If not, is this another company that is entering the X10 arena?  They are based in Hong Kong.

Jeff
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on February 26, 2014, 12:48:17 PM
This states it is Bluetooth so it isn't the same. I will forward this link to Authinx to see what they have to say.
It looks to me like another company entering the arena as they have other modules  (http://pj88global.com/?p=75)which look similar to x10 modules but with a "IPCE" label. 
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on February 26, 2014, 01:06:07 PM
Apparently Authinx was approached by this company but ipce never came back with any more details. ::) :'
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on February 26, 2014, 01:22:13 PM
If not, is this another company that is entering the X10 arena?  They are based in Hong Kong.

There are a few companies in and around Hong Kong that have been making 230V X10 devices for the S.E. Asia/Australia/New Zealand markets. It would make sense for Authinx to work with one of them.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on February 26, 2014, 06:59:37 PM
And still.... we wait.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on April 11, 2014, 09:33:24 AM
And still.... we wait.
I had thought I/we would have heard more on this by now.
The last I heard a case was in the design phase.
I fired off a email to see if I can gain any more info to share with the community.
Hopefully I'll hear something shortly.
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on April 11, 2014, 11:26:23 PM
Hopefully I'll hear something shortly.

I saw they got IP cameras back on the X10.com Site. Was good to see a useable albeit older version of the AHP software up on an X10 server. It's nice to see progress. The successes gives everyone hope!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on April 14, 2014, 12:15:12 PM
Info Update:
A proto type Wi-Fi unit should be in testing by next week as it is in route to the owner.
Once Authinx has the unit for testing I may be able to supply some more info, ::) :'

This proto type unit is in a cm15 case but anything Authinx currently has tooling for and will hold it will work.
They don't feel the need to add extra tooling for a case as that would drive up the cost.
(I'll go over the list of available tooling to see what else may work)
Initial name for this is WiFi2X10 but this too isn't set in stone and names will still be considered until launch.
The unit will be capable of Wi-Fi to RF or Wi-Fi to PLC but not both as to signal command clash.(not sure if it will be selectable or based on the module it is sending commands to)
Mass production version will allow for timed macros without smartphone connection.
(it must have some memory)


 >!

Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on April 14, 2014, 09:05:02 PM
Info Update:
A proto type Wi-Fi unit should be in testing by next week as it is in route to the owner.

YEA!!!!!!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Noam on April 18, 2014, 01:49:25 PM
Initial name for this is WiFi2X10 but this too isn't set in stone and names will still be considered until launch.
As long as they don't call it a "CM15A" (or any other module name that has already been used), right?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on April 18, 2014, 04:50:02 PM
Initial name for this is WiFi2X10 but this too isn't set in stone and names will still be considered until launch.
As long as they don't call it a "CM15A" (or any other module name that has already been used), right?
I have been told unlike X10WTI all new devices will have new model numbers to avoid confusion.
This should hold true for changes made to existing modules  ::) :'
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on April 18, 2014, 10:09:20 PM
So is there anyway someone could pay to be part of this test?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on April 19, 2014, 08:00:34 AM
I doubt this first proto build as I'm told only one or two units are being sent.
I suspect this will be for the owner to review and give a stamp of approval.
However I will pass on your Question.
Maybe I can convince them of an prerelease (beta test) involving some active forum members. ::) :'
This would most likely be once the hardware and case are given approval but who knows ::) :'
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: ryann on April 19, 2014, 01:32:13 PM
Hi, When the new X10 WiFi unit will be available? I'm considering to replace my MC10A with a new controller that can work with my iPhone. I also found bluetooth controller (http://pj88global.com/?cat=4) that will be available early May, the company said WiFi version will follow 2-3 months later. I would like to see comments from the forum members before decision made. Thanks.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on April 19, 2014, 02:53:26 PM
I all new devices will have new model numbers to avoid confusion.
Yes! They need to do that to re-enforce the idea that this is "under NEW management". Otherwise there will be more of the idea that (new) X10 has the "X10" name so they have, or get to inherit, (old) X10 problems. So far, it seems (new) X10 is doing everything right. I'm rooting for a complete quality and profitability turn-around.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on April 22, 2014, 10:14:25 AM
Hi, When the new X10 WiFi unit will be available? I'm considering to replace my MC10A with a new controller that can work with my iPhone. I also found bluetooth controller (http://pj88global.com/?cat=4) that will be available early May, the company said WiFi version will follow 2-3 months later. I would like to see comments from the forum members before decision made. Thanks.

The new WI-FI unit is still a ways away, I suspect(hope) before ipce has one. In any case it will most likely be compatible.
The ipce Bluetooth unit will be obsolete once a WIFI version is made due to range I suspect.

The WIFI2X10 initial proto type was shipped to Authinx for approval.
Only one unit was supplied but I'm told it does work.
Quote
The operation is quite simple. You plug the unit in an outlet and then make a connection with an app on your phone. You then setup the modules and you can control it remotely
A report is to be sent to the manufacture at weeks end at which time I suspect an new build will be created.
There are issues to be worked out with the proto type unit.( I suspect to due with the case they placed it in)
Authinx quality standards must be meet and they suspect 2 to 4 more builds will be needed before that is the case and it is ready for mass production.
Also Apps for the different OS devices will need to be created which also must pass approval.

 
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on May 07, 2014, 01:02:37 PM
Modifications are currently being made to the case I'm told.
It currently appears it may be more in looks with the RR501 hopefully with a pass threw outlet.
I should hear more by the end of the week. >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on May 07, 2014, 07:31:10 PM
YEA!!!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: toasterking on May 10, 2014, 11:15:57 PM
I think it is fantastic that Authinx is putting some priority on X10 PLC/RF products and is working on this.  Wi-Fi control from a phone or tablet via a single embedded plug-in device is something that competing systems have already had for a while.  Some are even in retail brick-and-mortar stores.  I do hope Authinx is not trying to pack too many features into the initial offering, though.  I am all for getting the most bang for the buck, but scope creep is an ugly beast.  Developing more features takes more time, and if they are not given enough development time, bugs or design decisions are overlooked and the product performs poorly.  There were many examples of this in X10TWI's previous products.  I expect that first-time automators who want something more plug-and-play are choosing other HA systems every day because those systems work with their iPhone/Android/tablet out of the box and X10 does not.  X10 needs this as soon as possible and it needs to work as well as possible, but it should not try to be everything to everyone.  Establish a solid foundation and ship that, then build on it later with a follow-up product.

These are my suggestions for the initial product...
The possibility for firmware updates is a must, as is bidirectional PLC and RF communication.  The PLC absolutely needs to implement AGC, collision avoidance (politeness), and preferably collision detection (sensing a received "1" when it is sending a "0" and retrying).  It needs to allow the app on the controlling device (phone/tablet/whatever) to create a layout of rooms and devices matched with X10 house and unit codes and maybe 10 macros, and it would be nice for the controller to store that data itself and sync it to apps on other devices.  Everything else can wait for version 2.0.  Sure, I would ultimately want some more flexibility, and those of us who have used X10 a long time and have our own controllers and software tweaked just how we like it already know exactly what we want.  I am always looking to expand my system, but right now I am more concerned about it staying relevant as a serious platform on which vendors can continue to build and sell new devices.  The focus of this release should be about reducing the barrier to entry for X10 as a general consumer product.  In that area, X10 has some catching up to do.

I see that I may be a little late for the design as a prototype already exists, but hopefully this will be acknowledged as a general philosophy.  I have used X10 for many years.  Having modified the hardware in many modules and written some of my own software with the AHSDK, I would consider myself an advanced user.  But I won't demand that this product cater to all my wants and wishes.  Right now, I would be happy with just seeing X10's reputation repaired because that is the best way to protect my investment in the long term.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on May 11, 2014, 01:16:34 PM
Authinx doesn't plan to jam every thing into the initial release, they are already thinking about a version 2 so to speak.
I don't think you have to worry about the initial phone interface.
Having tested one of there new Airsight cameras they use a smartphone to get you up and viewing very quickly.
Software is easier to improve apon then hardware and since Authinx has always handled the Pro line they are more concerned with quality then quantitiy
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Noam on May 12, 2014, 01:53:00 PM
I second the vote for flashable firmware.
If this new device is going to act as a web server, then they need to include the ability for them to add features to it later.
It would be nice if they would open up the standards enough to allow the users to write custom programs for it at some point, as well. That should include all of the functions (especially the one to store macros and timers in the device).
If they went one step further and put the software specs out there for everyone, they can be pretty certain that the user community will put a lot of energy into writing an improved interface - which would allow them to focus more on hardware improvements.
X10WTI's model of charging for the software (or making it seem like they were) made no sense when the software only worked with the hardware, and you needed to get the hardware from them (or a reseller) anyway. Had they opened the software up from the beginning (or at least right before they went belly-up), then the user community would have been able to improve it, which could have led to an increase in sales.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: lsammarco on June 05, 2014, 02:54:21 PM
Any updates to the availability of this unit?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on June 06, 2014, 07:35:34 AM
Any updates to the availability of this unit?
The last I heard was the software was in development for it.
Unfortunately Holidays tend to slow interaction with the manufacture.

I have fired off an email requesting more info.
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tucson on June 13, 2014, 09:13:51 PM
I hope they do a better job on their Software than the INSTEON Hub.

There is no offset for a sunset/sunset. The SW does not support multiple commands as the same time, including sunrise or sunset. It does not support multiple time periods for the same device like on at 6 am, off at 9 am, on at 6 pm and off at 10 pm. Poor security - no login at all. If you port forward your router to the Hub anyone can change anything you have connected. Glitchy, buggy, not ready for prime time.

These are just a few of the problems with it.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on June 14, 2014, 08:34:17 AM
X10 still hasn't heard anything new back from the manufacture B:(
Being from China I expect some software glitches with the initial product.
However the new owners of X10 are more conscious of quality, this has slowed the release of some of the other new products.
 
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on July 02, 2014, 04:12:55 PM
Many have been looking for a update on this so here it is.

A new developer was hired to redo the interface the old one just wasn't up to pare for X10 or the manufacture.
Also some hardware changes were made to improve performance. I'm not sure just what that is but is on the Wi-Fi side of things.
A new sample should be ready for X10 testing and approval by the end of July.
The owner understands everyone's eagerness to get their hands on one of these but they want to make sure it is a quality piece of equipment.

 
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: JeffVolp on July 02, 2014, 05:35:25 PM
The owner understands everyone's eagerness to get their hands on one of these but they want to make sure it is a quality piece of equipment.

Quality is something people recognize, so it is worth waiting for.

Jeff
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on July 02, 2014, 07:50:35 PM
Sidebar question: This is to be WiFi to PLC or RF. Is there Android or iOS apps available, or are apps being developed concurrently?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on July 02, 2014, 09:22:29 PM
Sidebar question: This is to be WiFi to PLC or RF. Is there Android or iOS apps available, or are apps being developed concurrently?
I'm told the unit is to be both RF and PLC however initial release may only be PLC.
Originally apps for both Android and iOS were to be developed.However I'm unsure if this is still the case or if only the interface will be developed and you access it like many IP cameras with a browser.
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on July 04, 2014, 08:11:53 PM
Sidebar question: This is to be WiFi to PLC or RF. Is there Android or iOS apps available, or are apps being developed concurrently?
Originally apps for both Android and iOS were to be developed.However I'm unsure if this is still the case or if only the interface will be developed and you access it like many IP cameras with a browser.
Thanks Tuicemen,

But even accessing via IP address, wouldn't there have to be some sort of HTML page or program where you would list all your X10 address you want to control or monitor?

I am looking forward to getting one of these when they start shipping and am curious what to expect. I can currently control our house with "Droidseer" which interfaces to Homeseer. But the app is a little clunky.

Homeseer has it's own "Homeseer Touch" interface for Android which is very nice, but Homeseer's prices are way out of control. 

Thanks!!

Dave
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on July 05, 2014, 07:25:20 AM


But even accessing via IP address, wouldn't there have to be some sort of HTML page or program where you would list all your X10 address you want to control or monitor?
I believe that is what they are working on.
I suspect once it is released others will create something to talk to it.
Even if they don't release an API or SDK
Since it is Wi-Fi finding what is sent to control the unit will be a simple mater of playing with Wireshark.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on July 07, 2014, 06:27:03 PM
I suspect once it is released others will create something to talk to it.
Yes, I think this will be a popular product, which will likely spawn lots of app development.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on July 08, 2014, 10:57:24 AM
If not Wink compatible it will likely be DOA except for a handful of diehards here.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: fitbrit on July 09, 2014, 11:26:52 PM
If it is browser based with http commands, that would be awesome; it would mean that iRule integration would be possible out of the box.
This is exciting news to see on my first day back on the forums in months.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Mic_ on August 03, 2014, 11:38:07 AM
Forgive me folks if I am a bit late to this discussion...Correct me if I am wrong; the new X10 is working to release a new x10 wi-fi controller? when do you anticipate that such will be releales?
The name X10 wi-fi controller sounds simple and to the point
Will the new controller allow us to operate Active Home Pro remotely?
Will we be able to use functions like Active phone pro, garage, etc?
If the answer to the above is yes, I for one, will be ready to purchase when the product is released.
Right now I can controll my old X10 products from within the house with the fix that tuicemen put forward. I am not able to do the same while away from the house however
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on August 03, 2014, 12:07:49 PM
The latest on the Wi-Fi unit is the software has been completed. However during development of the software it became obvious of some hardware changes that needed to be done.
These changes should be done in a few days and hopefully another test build will be ready for trials.
Baring any issues a release build will follow shortly.
Will the new controller allow us to operate Active Home Pro remotely?
Not directly, however if you have macros created in Activehome Pro you will be able to trigger them with X10 signals.
Quote
Will we be able to use functions like Active phone pro, garage, etc?
You will be able to activate devices from your smartphones but Active phone , my garage etc. are AHP plugins and won't work directly with this hardware.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on August 13, 2014, 01:44:12 PM
I just stumbled across the following available in Europe:

http://www.haibrain.com/tip10rf-ip-to-x10-rf-transceiver-u-plug-p-676.html

How is this different than what X10 is planning?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on August 13, 2014, 04:21:02 PM
Haibrain took over Marmitec home automation and security line which had this for a while and is for the European market.

I'm told the new unit X10 has in the works is a different animal and will be capable of more. ::) :'
I'm told a RF transceiver won't be needed for it.
However until a release unit is available specifics are sketchy.
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on August 13, 2014, 08:52:38 PM
I just stumbled across the following available in Europe:

http://www.haibrain.com/tip10rf-ip-to-x10-rf-transceiver-u-plug-p-676.html

How is this different than what X10 is planning?

You know.... I think I might be pretty happy with that.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Mic_ on September 20, 2014, 02:17:09 PM
So, I am happy to hear that this X10 venture goes on. I went to the site listed above to check on the euro version listed there; was it just listed for reference purposes? It is all in German...
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on September 20, 2014, 03:28:54 PM
Mic,
Click the English flag, upper right corner of page.

Trouble is it only converts WiFi app commands to X10 wireless (433mHz for Europe system). I'm hoping for the new X10 WiFi before Christmas, but I have not seen anything that indicates a debut, a promise date, or even a "we are a year behind on this baby. don't hold breath" statement. Even a preliminary manual would get me so excited I will vibrate.  ;)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Brian H on September 20, 2014, 06:20:04 PM
After you pick English.
There is a link to the English version of the manual.
The web site Haibrain has bought out Marmitek
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on September 21, 2014, 02:53:07 PM
I've just received an email from the owner about this baby.
He has a unit and the mechanics are fine the issue is the software I'm told. B:(
They are still working on this software as it didn't live up to his expectations.
Something about not being as user friendly as they'd like.
The manufacture may need to get another developer for the software. That will be 3 different ones B:(
The owner has expressed his frustration with this and understands everyone else's frustration too.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: toasterking on September 21, 2014, 02:55:12 PM
Trouble is it only converts WiFi app commands to X10 wireless (433mHz for Europe system).

It looks like you could possibly combine it with a WGL V572AE (http://www.wgldesigns.com/v572.html - "International Model") if you connect the V572AE to a 110V AC power adapter and a TW523 or XTB523 (US version powerline interface) instead of the suggested XM10 (Europe version powerline interface).  Though it may not be officially supported, this should give you a bridge from 433MHz RF to 110V PLC.  It also says that the V572AE is designed for 3-phase systems, but I would think that the extra transmission bursts required for 3-phase would be solely handled by the XM10 and thus wouldn't be a concern.  I would confirm all of this with WGL first.

If you really want the Marmitek device to work in the US, this may be a solution, though you'd be adding a bit of cost and complexity.  I think I'd rather wait for the Authinx device, assuming it's still coming.

Edit: Mistyped a model number.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: toasterking on September 21, 2014, 02:58:53 PM
Thanks for the update, Tuicemen!  Let's hope that these are just growing pains and that once Authinx gets this sorted out, they will know exactly what their developer requirements should be in the future and this won't be a stumbling block again.  I, like many here, don't mind waiting for a product that will be of superior quality and utility, but I'd hate to see the X10 name slip even further behind in the market because of delays like this.   :-\
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on September 21, 2014, 03:36:45 PM
Trouble is it only converts WiFi app commands to X10 wireless (433mHz for Europe system).
It's hard to tell from the webpage or limited manual but it appears to use an external power supply with the unit itself running on 5VDC or 12VDC. If so, it might be simple to convert for 120V. I suspect the RF frequency can be changed with either a different transmitter module, crystal or SAW resonator. It would be nice to have a schematic. If reasonably priced, it might be worth ordering one to see whether it can be adapted.

The old Marmitek (now Haibrain) webpage has more complete specs. As I surmised, the voltage is no problem. I think it might be worth a flyer.
I'll investigate as it would make a transition from X10 to WeMo much simpler. If nothing else, it would be simple to convert a TM751 or even CM15A to receive 433.92MHz.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on September 21, 2014, 09:42:59 PM
I've just received an email from the owner about this baby.
He has a unit and the mechanics are fine the issue is the software I'm told. B:(
They are still working on this software as it didn't live up to his expectations.
Something about not being as user friendly as they'd like.
The manufacture may need to get another developer for the software. That will be 3 different ones B:(
The owner has expressed his frustration with this and understands everyone else's frustration too.

User friendly is a must! I hope they stick with it. Bill's (of BVC (http://wgjohns.com/bvc.htm)) was one of the few software products I found to really be really intuitive.

Hopefully they will be smart enough to realize the real value in the product is in it's flexibility. And they will leave the OS open enough that others can also create software to make the device even more desirable. 
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on September 22, 2014, 05:11:53 AM
The Haibrain TIP10RF is US$85 plus shipping.

I'll try to get a schematic before deciding to order one. If the conversion to 120VAC & 310MHz is simple, that cost is not too unreasonable but becomes prohibitive if the conversion adds much cost.

What do prospective users think a fair price for a network to X10RF bridge with iOS/Android apps?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on September 22, 2014, 07:46:56 AM
Hopefully they will be smart enough to realize the real value in the product is in it's flexibility. And they will leave the OS open enough that others can also create software to make the device even more desirable. 

Although I haven't seen screen shots for the software  from the email it sounds like it is the options that is causing the issue .
Kind a like the Smart macros for AHP (else, if conditions) some still have a problem figuring them out.

I asked about the software development so others could develop for it.
The manufacture isn't ready to share that info right now.
However since this is a Wi-Fi device commands sent to it will be able to be seen using other software.
Even if the manufacture holds back on the code someone could hack it easy enough and I don't expect it to be long before other software is available.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on September 22, 2014, 09:20:12 AM
The Haibrain (nee Marmitek) TIP10RF specifications and user manual link is here...
I have asked for a schematic and internal pix and have also requested details on how to order/pay.

It may be some time before I can follow up on this. I see a neurosurgeon next week and expect I'll be undergoing some rather radical surgery (540 cervical fusion) and may have a lengthy (or not) recovery. If someone else wants to explore this, I have 150-200 small, 4-pin, SAW controlled 310MHz transmitter modules like the TWS-DS-2 shown here...

OK. So far, no schematic but I am getting a TIP10RF on order.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on September 28, 2014, 07:19:34 AM
While looking for a European dealer who will ship the TIP10RF to the USA, I discovered another interesting product.
It is battery powered so the only issue would be converting it to 310MHz.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on September 29, 2014, 08:41:07 AM
I have a TIP10RF on order. I don't know how long it will take as it wasn't clear how it would ship. It's coming from the UK.

Once I have it I will evaluate how difficult it will be for a DIY conversion to 310MHz. If it seems simple enough I'll publish plans/photos for the conversion.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on September 29, 2014, 09:37:42 AM
I have a TIP10RF on order. I don't know how long it will take as it wasn't clear how it would ship. It's coming from the UK.
Once I have it I will evaluate how difficult it will be for a DIY conversion to 310MHz. If it seems simple enough I'll publish plans/photos for the conversion.

Very cool. That unit appears to be an efficient way of doing what I am doing now using (my Rube Goldberg (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rube_Goldberg) device) a smart phone, a small server laptop running XP, and a CM19A. 

Having a unit like that would be well worth your efforts. 
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on September 29, 2014, 11:18:26 AM
Very cool. That unit appears to be an efficient way of doing what I am doing now using (my Rube Goldberg (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rube_Goldberg) device) a smart phone, a small server laptop running XP, and a CM19A.  
Having a unit like that would be well worth your efforts.  
I suspect it has an IEC universal type jack for the power supply which is rated for 100-250VAC. If so a $5 (or less) IEC Class II C7 power cable will adapt it for 120VAC power. Then it's just a matter of finding the easiest way to convert it to 310MHz.

There are Android, iOS & Windows 8 apps that can talk to Belkin's WeMo. And, there are Android & iOS apps for the TIP10RF. I would like to find APIs for both so I can create integrated apps that speak WeMo & TIP10RF.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on September 29, 2014, 07:58:37 PM
There are Android, iOS & Windows 8 apps that can talk to Belkin's WeMo. And, there are Android & iOS apps for the TIP10RF. I would like to find APIs for both so I can create integrated apps that speak WeMo & TIP10RF.

That would be nice!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on October 02, 2014, 04:07:34 PM
Very cool. That unit appears to be an efficient way of doing what I am doing now using (my Rube Goldberg (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rube_Goldberg) device) a smart phone, a small server laptop running XP, and a CM19A.
I wouldn't consider your setup to be Rube Goldbergish - it's rather clever given what's available.

For those comfortable with (or willing to learn) Linux, replacing your laptop with a Raspberry Pi, running something like HomeGenie (http://www.homegenie.it) would be an inexpensive but flexible and power-sipping but powerful alternative. I believe bkenobi is already doing something along these lines. 

The Raspberry Pi folk are porting Android 4.0 to the Pi. When that's released I will hook up a WiFi-enabled Pi to my Vizio Smart TV via HDMI and control it with a wireless USB KB. I expect it to be far more powerful than the Android mini-PC I tried out earlier.
Given the popularity of the Pi I think it probable that we will see a lot of HA related projects and products providing apps for it. I think it's the near-perfect platform for this.

I should note here that the Pi is vulnerable to the Shellshock security hole so it would be prudent to wait for a patch before embarking on a Pi project.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on October 07, 2014, 02:19:21 PM
I finally received the TIP10RF and I don't think it's practical for the average DIYer to convert to 310MHz. While the power conversion is simply getting a 12V 2A power supply with a 2.1mm connector, the electronics employ extremely miniaturized surface mount components that are likely beyond the typical soldering skill-set. Changing the SAW resonator (and perhaps a capacitor) will convert the frequency, assuming I can find a 310MHz SAW resonator in the same package.  :-\
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on October 08, 2014, 01:28:16 AM
I finally received the TIP10RF and I don't think it's practical for the average DIYer to convert to 310MHz.

Bummer. Even if it doesn't work-out for the rest of us... I hope you can make it work for yourself.

I was in Best Buy today and noticed that they a pretty big selection of HA products. Most of witch are phone controlled or alert to the phone via email or maybe text. I think many devices work great with tablets as well.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on October 08, 2014, 06:33:57 AM
Bummer. Even if it doesn't work-out for the rest of us... I hope you can make it work for yourself. 
I'll probably just build a quick and dirty 433.92MHz to 310MHz repeater rather than try to find a SAW that fits. It's so small that I cannot read the lasered identifying marks on it, even under magnification.

I will suggest to Haibrain that a 310MHz version would have a market in N. America if they can price it a bit lower than the European price. This one cost me $106 although I would have saved about $25 had I waited a few days as the dollar surged against the euro a day or so after I ordered.

The design/build quality is very impressive when compared with X10 devices.

Being home-bound I really have no need of a smartphone but I'm looking at a cheapie with Android & WiFi that I could carry in my pocket. Tablets are too big for that.

If the new X10 is serious about going forward with the product line, they'll design an ethernet or WiFi enabled version of the CM15A as well as opening up the software/firmware so others can create Android/iOS/Windows apps for it. The TIP10RF uses a Microchip microcontroller which has most of the ethernet funtionality built-in, making it fairly elementary to design such a device.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on October 09, 2014, 09:28:34 AM
A fairly simple DIY solution just dawned on me.

Rather than change the TIP10RF, converting one of the newer TM751s to 433MHz is a simple matter of replacing the RF receiver module with a 433MHz RF receiver module. In effect, it's a quick and dirty cleaner 433MHz to PLC solution rather than the 433MHz to 310MHz repeater I had initially considered and this is a very simple through-hole soldering job that doesn't require the same skill-set as trying to replace the SAW resonator in the TIP10RF. I'll try to find an appropriate RF receiver module. I have a handful of E-MadeinCHN RM1SG in 433MHz. I'll try to install one in a TM751A (pass-through outlet) and post some pix.

In the meantime, see the TM751, SH Receiver pix here...
EDIT: I had forgotten that I had designed and prototyped a teeny (~1/2in. sq.) single-chip ceramic resonator controlled wide-band RF receiver. I think all it will need is a different resonator but I'll have to locate my records and documentation to be sure. (Yep, I did design a 434MHz version.) If there is any interest I may be able to make them available. I'll post a picture in a day or two of one installed in a TM751A. It's a much simpler conversion route.
 
Same for the CM15A but it makes more sense to just add a modified TM751 leaving everything else compatible with RF remotes, etc.

And, I just noticed this...
I might order one to see whether it also now uses the RF receiver module common to the CM15A and newer TM751. If so, it's the best choice since it's polite. Authinx says it is the old design so it's not a candidate.

Also, Haibrain has an API for the TIP10RF. I'll suggest they publish it. It's super simple.

My pending surgery may limit how much time I can spend on this but DIYers should be able to run with it. I'll try to create a Windows app for it but that's likely to be a few months down the road.

Finally, given that the TIP10RF uses a Microchip microcontroller with their proprietary ethernet stack, I doubt it introduces any new security issues to the home LAN.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on October 13, 2014, 07:37:00 AM
Since nobody appears to be interested, I'll wrap things up.  >*<

I probably was in too much of a hurry and could have saved a bit of money on mine. Do a web search using TIP10RF and you will find several dealers. You should not have to pay VAT. Ask whether they will ship to the US. I'd suggest dealing only with those who accept PayPal.

You'll need to replace the European power supply with a 12VDC 500mA supply with a 2.1mm connector. And you'll need to modify a newer TM751 for 433.92MHz by replacing its RF receiver module with a RM1SG.

The RM1SG is no longer listed on EBay but can be purchased on Amazon. See...
You do not need the transmitter but the price for both is the best I found

For installation in the newer TM751, you need to remove the 4-pin connector. The easiest method is to clip the pins with a small set of diagonal pliers near the plastic divider and then cut the plastic between the pins. Then you can desolder the pin stubs individually. Use solid bus wire to make the connections, follwing this CM15A thread.

CAUTION: Solder the antenna connections before soldering the module to the main board.

Android and iOS apps are available.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: toasterking on October 13, 2014, 05:58:12 PM
Dave Houston,

I expect that many people didn't respond because one of these categories applies to them:

I am in the latter camp.  However, I have been following your posts.  I was interested to see what challenges you would discover and what kind of solution you would come up with, and despite the proprietary design with SMT package components, you did find a solution!  You've also contributed something even more valuable.  Even though I have no need for a device that allows Wi-Fi control, I now know how to modify a TM751 receiver to receive European RF transmissions and repeat them to a North American power line.  I'm sure that will come in handy.

So, even though I didn't speak up before, thank you!  :)%
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Brian H on October 13, 2014, 06:02:53 PM
I would also suspect. Most of the X10 users may not have the electronic skill to do the modifications.

Thanks for the detailed information.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on October 13, 2014, 08:02:15 PM
Despite your detailed instructions, it appears to be too much work/too challenging/not worth the hassle to justify the outcome for them.

You've also contributed something even more valuable.  Even though I have no need for a device that allows Wi-Fi control, I now know how to modify a TM751 receiver to receive European RF transmissions and repeat them to a North American power line.

Most of the X10 users may not have the electronic skill to do the modifications.

The low cost of the RM1SG from Amazon and the fact that there are only 3 (+2 antenna) leads to be soldered may encourage more to give it a try.

I doubt the new X10 WiFi device will ever make it to market. If it does, it may (probably?) have Shellshock related security issues. And, I really question the need for it to be WiFi - it's far simpler to do as Marmitek did and just give it wired ethernet capabilities. As I noted earler, I expect the Microchip ethernet stack to be more secure than any open sores system. I suspect most of us have a WiFi router which will make the TIP10RF easily accessible via WiFi.

I've ordered an Android 4.2.2 miniPC w/AirMouse and will install it on my Vizio Smart TV. Then I'll install the Android app for the  TIP10RF to it. That will allow me to test the operation.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: toasterking on October 13, 2014, 08:44:09 PM
For you and me, it certainly doesn't need WiFi, but I think we need to consider how this new device could push X10 forward rather than how it will solve our own problems.  It's not that the TIP10RF isn't a feasible solution; it appears to be a very good solution for us diehards who already see the value of X10 and want more ways to control it.  I think the main thing is that adding complexity to the setup increases the barrier to entry.  Other automation firms are offering a device that is nearly plug-and-play -- plug a box into an outlet, install an app, pair them, and you're ready to control your modules.  If the "new" X10 device requires a separate WiFi router, cable to be run to the device, and a separate X10 RF-PLC transceiver, then it's already lost the battle.  We may scoff at how petty this seems and how it barely matters to those of us with the experience and familiarity, but if X10 is really going to compete with the newer systems, it needs to appear to be as streamlined, advanced, and user-friendly as the alternatives.  That may help stop the bleeding and afford less separation between the diehards and the newcomers.  Ethernet does offer more versatility, so in the long term I'd love to see the device come with both options, even if they're in separate models.

And I'm not saying your mod looks difficult.  It doesn't, at all, to me, and I would certainly try it.  But you tell some people that they'll be working around line voltage devices and voiding the safety certification on them and they'll say it's not worth the risk of getting electrocuted or burning their house down, no matter how extremely unlikely either of those is when they follow directions and practice common sense.

I'm still interested to hear your results with the Android app!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on October 14, 2014, 08:11:27 AM
I'm still interested to hear your results with the Android app!
While waiting delivery of the miniPC, I may try the TIP10RF app on a $50 Condroid 7" tablet. It's a PITA as it will not connect to a WiFi network unless the network SSID is broadcast. So, everytime I want to connect with it, I have to change my router settings.

I have an earlier MK808 Android miniPC which I did have connected to my TV.
Here's a thread where Tuicemen and I discuss these wee beasties.
It and/or the wireless KB had some issues which caused me to abandon it. It frequently froze, requiring a power cycle to clear. And, I found the KB touchpad madly frustrating. I now keep a laptop next to my recliner in case I want to access the web while watching TV.

Here's a link to the newly ordered miniPC...
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on October 15, 2014, 12:13:15 AM
...... Here's a link to the newly ordered miniPC...
  • http://www.gearbest.com/tv-box/pp_13657.html

I'd wonder if that couldn't be enough to operate/control/react with a CM19a (right out of the USB). With drivers and a decent app?!?!? I can't believe that the source code for X10 devices hasn't been spilled. Being able to have endless numbers of apps/programs/ and a means to control X10 could be a major help for the brand.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on October 15, 2014, 05:22:36 AM
I'd wonder if that couldn't be enough to operate/control/react with a CM19a (right out of the USB). With drivers and a decent app?!?!? I can't believe that the source code for X10 devices hasn't been spilled. Being able to have endless numbers of apps/programs/ and a means to control X10 could be a major help for the brand.
I've never used the CM19A so am unfamiliar with the X10 software for it. However, much of the CM15A communications protocol was reverse engineered by the Linux X10 community years ago. mochad supports the CM19A and it appears possible to port it to Android - source code is available.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on October 19, 2014, 02:51:28 PM
I added a picture to my website showing a TM751A with a 434MHz RM1SG superregenerative receiver replacing the superheterodyne receiver module.
However, I think there is one additional problem. The TM751A appears to have been a short-run model meant to dispose of some inventory that lacked relays. It's no longer listed. And I doubt there's any reliable way to determine whether a TM751 ordered today will have the superheterodyne receiver module or will have the old style superregenerative receiver.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Brian H on October 20, 2014, 06:05:45 AM
Yes. There was a new design electronics {superheterodyne} TM751A with no relay.
Sold by the old X10WTI for a short time. Maybe they ran out of relays and could not buy more.

They later again started selling them with the relay again. I believe they where still the new design electronics.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on October 20, 2014, 11:37:09 AM
I just bought (via Amazon) what was listed as a TM751. The front of the enclosure has no identifying marks other than Transceiver Module while the label on the rear says PAT02. (The box indicated it was from Authinx.) It has both a relay and RF receiver built-in to the main (only) circuit board using the same HiMark superhet chip as the separate module used in the CM15A and some TM751s. As it's not replaceable with the RM1SG I cannot recommend any transceiver model for the mod given the unpredictability of current stocks.

A 434MHz to 310MHz RF repeater appears to be the only viable alternative for using the TIP10RF in N. America.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Brian H on October 20, 2014, 02:53:01 PM
Thanks for the added data Dave.
Sounds like the TM751/PAT02 has been redesigned again.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on October 20, 2014, 04:54:12 PM
For the truly adventurous, the datasheet for the HiMark RX3310 gives component values for several RF frequencies, including 434MHz. Only 5-6 components need changing but I'm not sure how well the PCB will withstand rework.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: toasterking on October 20, 2014, 06:41:46 PM
I just bought (via Amazon) what was listed as a TM751. [...] both a relay and RF receiver built-in to the main (only) circuit board [...] As it's not replaceable with the RM1SG I cannot recommend any transceiver model for the mod given the unpredictability of current stocks.

So, in summary of all recent posts, your slick mod only works with a transceiver that includes a HiMark SH chip on a daughterboard, and as far as we know, that includes some TM751A units, but not all of them?  That seems like it would be fairly difficult to find and that's a shame.  But would this mod also work on any CM15A since it uses the same HiMark receiver?  Then you'd have a CM15A which would receive RF at 433 MHz, transmit RF at 310 MHz, and do PLC at 110V.  This would relegate the CM15A's RF to odd fringe cases like this, but anyone covering a decent sized area already needs/has a different solution for RF, and in most cases the TIP10RF and CM15A would probably both be located near the computer and thus near each other anyway.  Your thoughts?

Edit: spelling
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on October 20, 2014, 07:31:26 PM
I think it applies to all TM751A models and to some TM751 models. But the TM751A has apparently been discontinued and there's no reliable way to determine whether it applies to a specific TM751 without opening the enclosure. The one I just bought as a TM751 (with built-in HiMark SH receiver) has a Home Automation Store PAT02 label on the box which was partially covered with an adhesive label indicating it is a TM751. There is a 13E20 date sticker on the module.

It will work with all CM15As unless there are new models with the receiver built-in a la the TM751/PAT02. There is already a thread showing how to replace the CM15A HiMark SH RF receiver module with a 315MHz RM1SG in order to better deal with poorly tuned X10 transmitters. I referenced it above but here's the link again.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: toasterking on October 21, 2014, 12:32:28 AM
Thanks for clarifying that, Dave H.!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 06, 2015, 09:27:17 AM
In Dec 2014 the owner of the new X10 went to China in order to light a fire under the manufacturing side.
Quality was number one on the discussion list.
And manufacturing he hopes now understands X10WTI quality standards are too low for them.

He expressed to me his frustration about the time this is taking to come to market.
However he says they are more concerned about quality then profit. (Something businesses seldom practice )

He stated the software side is coming together nicely now but didn't comment on a release date as yet.
He stated:
Quote
it would have been more frustrating to release it early and have to deal with the disappointment of the users. Overall a good productive trip!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on March 17, 2015, 03:14:31 PM
With the Chinese new year manufacturing grinds to a halt in China for a month.
This slows down any development process. B:(
I just received a bit of feed back on the Wi-Fi module and it appears the android software is in the final stages of development.
I'm not sure where the Apple software is (no mention of it)
This is the third rebuild of the software and is suppose to have a good bit of end user customization available.
However just what this is was not expanded on.
It sounds like the software has exposed some areas for hardware improvements or the meeting in Dec convicted manufacturing to beef up quality as a new prototype is expected by end of the month.
The plan is to test the new software and interface together for functionality and user experience in April.
No word on if there will be a beta  test group or it will just be tested in house.
I've been promised some screen shots of the software once management is satisfied with it (probably once tested in house with the new proto type).
Posting any pictures now would be pointless (not that I have any) as it has already been changed twice.
I've also requested a picture of the unit However I may not have that to post until I have a unit. :(
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on March 17, 2015, 08:15:58 PM
Put me on the "I want one" list, please. ;D
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on April 09, 2015, 06:17:42 PM
I realize many are growing impatient with the length of time this is taking.
The owner expressed his own frustrations with this mater to me many times.
I myself created a free program Ultralight (a webserver) to tie me over.

I am in constant contact with Authinx on this, (almost weekly) and I do get updates on what is going on.
The owner is very prompt at returning my emails. :)%
However I don't always post this if there is no real news.
That being said I just received some feed back and there is little in the way of really good,exciting news :(.

Authinx is still waiting on the next proto type (expected to be a release candidate) Time will tell if this version will meet quality expectations!

Here is what I know is planed if this new unit is up to par. ::) :'
1: A in house test with the new software (there was no word if they actually have that yet either). ::) :'

2: If #1 passes, A request for a small shipment of test units for beta testing..
I have requested past X10WTI beta testers that are currently active (at least visiting the forum) and were actively participating in the last  test, to be put on the top of any beta test group list.

3:  If no hiccups in the testing, Production to start early summer.

4: With no issues in production, a release date of early fall.

I'm hopeful that I'll hear something more exciting in the next week or two but this has been a very slow go. :'(
I'll continue to press for info on this as I know everyone is very interested in this new module as am I.

Please don't email or PM me on this as I can't add anymore to this then what I post.
 >!



Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: JeffVolp on April 10, 2015, 09:52:43 AM
I realize many are growing impatient with the length of time this is taking.

Having created MANY devices from scratch over my career, I know how much work it can take - especially something as complex as a WiFi automation controller with all the necessary supporting software for scheduling, macros, etc.  It took me two summers for the XTBM-Pro development, and the XTB-IIR evolved to its present state over several years.

Jeff
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on April 10, 2015, 10:57:32 AM
Maybe this is common knowledge or it's not released...I'm not sure.  I was under the impression (from memory of what's been released) that this controller was intended to complement the CM15A.  Is this more of a replacement for the AHP controller or is it intended to work in conjunction?  I see benefits to either.  I'm not sure I need a new controller, but if it had the right features I'd certainly consider it!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on April 10, 2015, 02:24:00 PM
This is designed to be a stand alone controller.
It is to have its own memory for timers and macros, that being said it will work along side the Cm15 and AHP.
Since it sends out X10 signals the cm15a would see those and AHP could act on them.

Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on April 10, 2015, 02:35:43 PM
So it's fair to say that it's a networked PLC controller?  It won't have RF, so the CM15A would still have a place, right?  The biggest thing would be for the programming of timers/macros to be open source so we didn't have to rely on X10 to fix their buggy software and just let us use the hardware to its fullest.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on April 10, 2015, 03:44:29 PM
Originally this was to be RF and PLC, Wi-Fi based unit as far as I know this hasn't changed but I'll ask about that.
The Marmitec unit was RF only I believe, and Authinx wanted to do it one better.

The Manufacture doesn't want to share the source at this time, that has been the biggest setback as they have engineers writing the code not programmers.
However since programing is done via WI-FI it should be easy to figure out using Wireshark (https://www.wireshark.org/).
The firmware (onboard software) is another story.

Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on April 10, 2015, 04:30:32 PM
The Marmitec unit was RF only I believe, and Authinx wanted to do it one better.
The Marmitek TIP10RF receives user commands via Ethernet and sends X10 RF to transceivers like a
CM15 or TM13 which send the PLC commands.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on April 10, 2015, 06:21:11 PM
Wireshark probably works for this, just not my area of knowledge.  I wasn't expecting open source software, just a full documentation of the communication protocol.  If communication is via API commands, it may not be an issue either way since one can just watch network traffic to see what's sent.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on April 10, 2015, 07:16:24 PM
Wireshark basically watches network traffic and captures it for you to view later.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on April 27, 2015, 01:30:12 PM
The newest WI-FI module build still hasn't arrived @ Authinx.  :(
They must have put it on the slow boat. rofl

I was however able to gather a bit more info.
The manufacture changed the IC from the original design, in doing this the WI-FI became unstable thus the new hardware build.
This also meant a software rebuild (I believe that's the 4th software change) :(
I've also learned this will not have RF capabilities only PLC.
I'm told the PLC will feature the reliability enhancements destine for all module rebuilds
I'm also told RF may be added to a future model.
So it looks like for now,this will not replace a CM15A
Hopefully the testing Phase will go a little smoother.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: -Bill- (of wgjohns.com) on May 01, 2015, 02:04:22 AM
So...  No X10 RF.  No X10 Security RF.  Still no Powermid RF.  We  hope the end product will at least be able to receive PLC.

So what I'm hearing is we're getting a (hopefully sophisticated) programable timer / scene controller that turns your smart phone into a X10 remote.

Definitely not a good substitute for the CM15A.

Might make a good paperweight?  ???

Sorry.  Just a little disappointed.   :(
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on May 01, 2015, 07:34:48 AM
The no RF features is a major disappointment for many.
I myself was sure this was to be a major part of this module. :(
Cost was the main reason this was not included however I feel not including RF makes this less of a must have.

I'm still trying to get more info on this but I feel the owner doesn't wish to reveal to much without the next proto type in front of him.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on May 01, 2015, 07:40:20 AM
So...  No X10 RF.  No X10 Security RF.  Still no Powermid RF.  We  hope the end product will at least be able to receive PLC.
I am developing an Arduino shield that does all the above (except Powermid RF) and a bit more. See...
http://davehouston.org/ultimate-X10.htm (http://davehouston.org/ultimate-X10.htm)
I hope to order prototype PCBs next week.

The initial release will be an Arduino UNO R3 clone with the PLC shield. An Arduino mega2560 R3 + megaShield will come a bit later. The megaShield version will have some 50 unused Arduino mega2560 pins so adding Powermid RF and other features will be possible. (I had not thought of Powermid RF prior to your post.)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: -Bill- (of wgjohns.com) on May 01, 2015, 11:03:33 PM
The no RF features is a major disappointment for many.
I myself was sure this was to be a major part of this module. :(
Cost was the main reason this was not included however I feel not including RF makes this less of a must have.

I'm still trying to get more info on this but I feel the owner doesn't wish to reveal to much without the next proto type in front of him.

I suppose I shouldn't be too disrespectful, since at least they're trying, and I have no idea who they think they are marketing to.  But, like most here, I was really hoping for a modern version of the CM15A with some better specs and wifi connectivity.  Not even including features the CM15A already has just seems like a step backwards.   B:(
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: -Bill- (of wgjohns.com) on May 01, 2015, 11:14:49 PM
I am developing an Arduino shield that does all the above (except Powermid RF) and a bit more. See...
http://davehouston.org/ultimate-X10.htm (http://davehouston.org/ultimate-X10.htm)
I hope to order prototype PCBs next week.

The initial release will be an Arduino UNO R3 clone with the PLC shield. An Arduino mega2560 R3 + megaShield will come a bit later. The megaShield version will have some 50 unused Arduino mega2560 pins so adding Powermid RF and other features will be possible. (I had not thought of Powermid RF prior to your post.)

Sounds like an interesting project for us hardware / software hackers.   >!  Probably not for the plug-n-play crowd though.   :'
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on May 02, 2015, 07:37:20 AM
Actually, the UNO version will be pretty much plug'n'play but will lack expandibility. The mega2560 version will still be plug'n'play for the X10 functions but allows for lots of expansion by "hardware / software hackers". One caveat - any RF transmit capabilities require a bit of hacking because of FCC rules requiring expensive testing in an FCC-approved lab.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on May 02, 2015, 09:45:48 PM
....... But, like most here, I was really hoping for a modern version of the CM15A with some better specs and wifi connectivity.  Not even including features the CM15A already has just seems like a step backwards.   B:(

Agreed
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: -Bill- (of wgjohns.com) on May 02, 2015, 11:14:27 PM
One caveat - any RF transmit capabilities require a bit of hacking because of FCC rules requiring expensive testing in an FCC-approved lab.
I thought part of the reason for buying the prebuilt RF modules was that they were already certified.  Am I mistaken in that assumption?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on May 03, 2015, 07:06:19 AM
I thought part of the reason for buying the prebuilt RF modules was that they were already certified.  Am I mistaken in that assumption?

Yes, you are mistaken. AFAIK all transmitters and super-regenerative receivers still require certified testing in their production form and all transmitters require an antenna that is difficult to change/modify. They get an FCC ID number. The rules have been relaxed for superheterodyne receivers to allow self-testing. They get a "Tested to comply..." label. X10 went to superheterodyne a few years ago in the TM751 to save on testing. End users can have 4-5 DIY transmitters which must comply with sound engineering practices.

For example, the 4-pin transmitter module from Wen Shing sold by Spark Fun and many others might be used here, in Europe which allows about 10x the power, or in Australia which allows about 10x what Europe allows.
https://www.sparkfun.com/products/10535  (https://www.sparkfun.com/products/10535)

DIYers can change the SAW resonator on the 315MHz transmitter if they want to do X10 RF.
http://www.cdadapter.com/sr310.htm (http://www.cdadapter.com/sr310.htm)
DIYers outside N. America can buy 433.92MHz transmitter modules off-the-shelf.

One more caveat - the PLC Interface and PLC Amp require user assembly for the same reason Jeff Volp requires a liability waiver for his assembled units - UL testing is far beyond my means. And, my spinal cord injury makes it difficult for me to do any assembly beyond prototypes. And, for those allergic to solder, the controller can be used with the TW523/PSC05 or equivalents (e.g. XTB-523, XTB-IIR).
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on May 04, 2015, 03:52:47 PM
On the topic of hacking, I recall that several years ago, an X10 user in S. America published plans for converting several modules to 230V. I suspect it would be equally easy to convert a universal plug version of the 230V XM10 (similar to TW523 functionally) to 120V.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on May 08, 2015, 12:50:22 PM

Sounds like an interesting project for us hardware / software hackers.   >!  Probably not for the plug-n-play crowd though.   :'

I do have an earlier design (CM15A2Z) which I deep-sixed when X10 went belly-up. It is a daughterboard that replaces the Cypress MCU in the CM15A and has the same feature set as the Arduino shield design. Users would have to desolder the MCU and EEPROM, replacing them with the daughterboard and 128KB EEPROM. It is certainly not plug-n-play but avoids UL issues.

Now that they are again selling the CM15A, I may exhume the CM15A2Z design after I get the shield versions released.

After sleeping on this I realized that, since my CM15A2Z daughterboard included an RS232 port (in addition to the USB port), it could support external serial devices like the ESP8266 WiFi module or the HC-05 Bluetooth module. The external devices would need their own 3.3V power supply since the FTDI FT230X USB/SER converter used on the daughterboard cannot supply 3.3V let alone the rather high current needed by the WiFi module..

As there already are interface boards available for both the WiFi and Bluetooth modules, this comes closer to being a Plug'n'Play solution (especially if Authinx would supply the new CM15As with a socketed Cypress MCU). It's likely to appeal to more users than either PLC Shield or mega PLC Shield versions. Authinx is welcome to the design should they like to build them right from the start. A minor tweak of the CM15A PCB to relocate the RF transmitter would allow a larger daughterboard that could directly accommodate the ESP8266 and a 3V3 regulator, thus WiFi enabling the CM15A. (I'll demonstrate this with one of my CM15As.)

I've done a quick edit of the CM15A2Z webpage I created a couple of years back. See...
http://davehouston.org/cm15a2z.htm (http://davehouston.org/cm15a2z.htm)
And, since I already have a handful of bare daughterboards, all I need is a few components to build & test this idea. So, stay tuned.

EDIT: On second (make that third or fourth) thought, I can do this with no changes to the CM15A - although supplying it with a socketed MCU would make this an easy task, even for those with a solder allergy.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on May 14, 2015, 06:46:02 AM
I'll be sending the redesigned, ESP8266WiFi-ready daughterboard to the PCB manufacturers today/tomorrow. I expect to have a few daughterboards ready for initial testing in 10-12 days.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on May 19, 2015, 09:16:45 AM
Double ouch!

Ouch #1: I never realized prices had skyrocketed but PCBCart's quote for five assembled PCBs (1/2"x1-1/2") was $750 + shipping. This for a fairly simple PCB shown at... http://davehouston.org/cm15a2z.htm (http://davehouston.org/cm15a2z.htm)
I expected about one third of their quote. Bare PCBs are reasonable so I may try the assembly myself but need to think things through. The shield for the Arduino clones are easiest to assemble so I may do those first along with the PLC Interfaces as originally planned...http://davehouston.org/ultimate-X10.htm  (http://davehouston.org/ultimate-X10.htm)

Ouch #2: While bending down to put on my shoes this AM, something popped in my lower back. So, I now have both a severe problem with my cervical spine and a new one with my lumbar spine. Unless it eases soon I'll have to go to the ER so all's on hold for now.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: JeffVolp on May 19, 2015, 05:14:24 PM
Ouch #1: I never realized prices had skyrocketed but PCBCart's quote for five assembled PCBs (1/2"x1-1/2") was $750 + shipping. This for a fairly simple PCB shown at... http://davehouston.org/cm15a2z.htm (http://davehouston.org/cm15a2z.htm)  I expected about one third of their quote.

About 8 years ago I received a quote of $90 each to assemble the XTB-IIR at 40 units.  The setup charge for robotic assembly needs a volume of 1000 units or more before that becomes a viable option.

Jeff
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on May 19, 2015, 06:01:56 PM
About 8 years ago I received a quote of $90 each to assemble the XTB-IIR at 40 units.  The setup charge for robotic assembly needs a volume of 1000 units or more before that becomes a viable option.
Two years ago I had quotes for 25 units of another device that were very reasonable. I was expecting something about 1/3 what I was quoted this time.

I'm surprised by the high prices. 40 years ago, I was the National Service Manager for a French company that made rather large machines that we sold to aerospace companies and other sheetmetal fabricators (e.g. the company that made prototype IBM PC cases). I can recall being mesmerized watching a Singer machine that assembled (through-hole) PCBs at a Singer plant in Binghampton, NY (where they also made Link trainers for the airlines - also mesmerizing to watch).
I would have expected economies-of-scale to have continuously reduced assembly costs.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: JeffVolp on May 19, 2015, 11:33:13 PM
I would have expected economies-of-scale to have continuously reduced assembly costs.

It is the up front programming and setup costs that are the killer.  They get pretty cheap once the crank is turning.  But it takes a lot of pieces to amortize those costs.  Our volume can't get there on the PCB assembly.  It even hits us pretty hard on the Polycases, which is why I machine the round holes myself with various jigs.

Jeff
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on May 20, 2015, 06:27:16 AM
But it takes a lot of pieces to amortize those costs.
My expertise was in the machine tool industry where computer controls made short runs economical. I helped develop computer controls for our machines and went on to run the company's US operations, establishing a near monopoly among aerospace companies (e.g. Learjet, Boeing, McDonnell-Douglas) where short runs were the norm. So, I'm baffled. With 3D printers under $200, it's a mystery to me why electronic circuit boards cost so much.
http://observer.com/2015/05/kickstarted-at-3m-how-tiko-is-set-to-be-the-best-and-cheapest-3d-printer/ (http://observer.com/2015/05/kickstarted-at-3m-how-tiko-is-set-to-be-the-best-and-cheapest-3d-printer/)
Also, I would expect 5 prototype boards to be manually assembled and cannot imagine that costing $125 per piece.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on May 26, 2015, 03:00:42 PM
Back to the drawing board. My PCB design used an ATmega328P-AU and an FTDI FT230X USB-Serial converter. Both have extremely closely spaced pins and I was hoping to avoid assembling (i.e. soldering) them myself. In essence, the same major components are used on the Arduino nano R3 which I can buy (assembled w/other needed components) on eBay for less than $5 each. I'm going to see whether I can piggyback the nano on a carrier board that plugs into the CM15A board. It may mean eliminating the socket to keep the height within the available space but, if it fits, will give us a very affordable brain transplant for the CM15A.

I will need to modify the nano so it connects via the CM15A USB port but I suspect that will be doable.

I will also move ahead on the Arduino UNO shield version and PLC interface and hope to have those in a few weeks.

EDIT: At first glance, it looks possible but there is one difficulty to surmount. The nano has a surface mount miniUSB socket which is far too small to modify. I think I can design a carrier board that will put the miniUSB socket where the current USB socket is. I'll have to find a way to close the gap around it - wish I had a 3D printer.

Alas, nearly all of the components and traces that I spent an enormous amount of time placing/routing will be surplus.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on May 27, 2015, 07:35:31 AM
I have a solution that keeps the USB socket as it is. The Arduino mini v3.0 does not have an onboard USB-Serial chip. I can add that (using a chip that is easy to solder manually) on the carrier board, connected to the existing socket.

I'm ordering a new CM15A to see what may have changed. Once I have that I can finalize the PCB layout and get bare PCBs on order.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on May 28, 2015, 06:18:15 PM
It is the up front programming and setup costs that are the killer.  They get pretty cheap once the crank is turning.  But it takes a lot of pieces to amortize those costs.  Our volume can't get there on the PCB assembly.  It even hits us pretty hard on the Polycases, which is why I machine the round holes myself with various jigs.
I could have had 5 prototypes assembled in Canada for about half what the Chinese company quoted. So, I'm still somewhat baffled.

Anyway, I've redesigned it so that even a gimpy geezer (like me) can assemble them - the issue is moot at this point. Hopefully, I'll have working prototypes by mid to late June.
http://davehouston.org/cm15a2z.htm (http://davehouston.org/cm15a2z.htm)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on May 29, 2015, 01:35:03 PM
I'm ordering a new CM15A to see what may have changed.
I'm glad that I ordered the new CM15A. I received one with a datecode of 13J24. If I remember how to decipher X10's  datecodes, that means it was built 2 years ago. In any event, it is a total redesign from earlier versions with nearly all the logic components converted to SMD and moved to the bottom of the PCB, leaving the power components topside. It's a much cleaner, safer design.

So, I can stop wasting my time as the board I designed will only work with the older versions.  :'

I will proceed with the Arduino shield versions.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Brian H on May 29, 2015, 04:05:27 PM
Thank you for the update on the CM15A design.
I know other modules also where redesigned with surface mounted components.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on May 29, 2015, 04:39:50 PM
The schematic is probably much the same as before. The RF transmitter and receiver are now integrated on the main board. The receiver uses the same HiMark chip. The Cypress MCU is the same - but is now the SMD version. UL probably likes this version better with line voltage components on one side of the PCB and the 5V logic on the opposite surface. It could probably fit into 1/3 the space but that would have meant new plastics.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on May 31, 2015, 03:25:11 PM
So...  No X10 RF.  No X10 Security RF.  Still no Powermid RF.  We  hope the end product will at least be able to receive PLC.

So what I'm hearing is we're getting a (hopefully sophisticated) programable timer / scene controller that turns your smart phone into a X10 remote.

Definitely not a good substitute for the CM15A.

The no RF features is a major disappointment for many.
I myself was sure this was to be a major part of this module. :(
Cost was the main reason this was not included however I feel not including RF makes this less of a must have.

I share the disappointment and frustration. I was really hopeful that I could modify the CM15A to provide open source programming and add WiFi & Bluetooth but the redesign of the CM15A put an end to that. After I finish the Arduino shields, I'll likely still modify one of my original CM15As for my own use.

It would help immensely if Authinx would publish the communications protocol for the CM15A. I'm sure there would be a few developers who would respond with open source applications. When it was first introduced, I looked into a developers license for the Cypress MCU but the cost was prohibitive.

The current CM15A hardware design is a big improvement and it has send/receive for both PLC and RF. With the redesign, the cost of adding WiFi would have been much lower than developing a totally new WiFi unit that only does PLC.

Finally, an excellent RF receiver requires one SOIC-8 chip, a ceramic resonator and 3 capacitors. A transmitter is equally simple. So, I don't buy that adding it was too costly unless they are talking about the FCC testing required for the transmitter (which is a one-time expenditure).

Hmmm. This is likely above my skillset but it might be possible to use a WiFi dongle to interface with the CM15A.
http://www.walmart.com/ip/Edimax-EW-7811Un-150Mbps-Wireless-11n-Nano-Size-USB-Adapter/17419471 (http://www.walmart.com/ip/Edimax-EW-7811Un-150Mbps-Wireless-11n-Nano-Size-USB-Adapter/17419471)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Noam on June 04, 2015, 02:46:22 PM
I could have had 5 prototypes assembled in Canada for about half what the Chinese company quoted. So, I'm still somewhat baffled.
and you could call it the CM15-eh ;-)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on June 04, 2015, 06:13:21 PM
Had I gone with the Canadian company, I would have let Tuicemen name it.  :P
Gee thanks! ::) :'
I'll just be happy to see something materialize from someone,(the name isn't important), the community has been waiting for something along this line for some time now. >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on June 30, 2015, 12:02:35 PM
Progress Update:
The newest Wi-Fi module Authinx is working on is said to be running well without any issues.
There were several changes made over the last 6 months ( however no word on what these were)
Developers are currently working on the macro feature and I'm told they are looking for feed back. ???
 So it sounds like it is in some sort of in house Alfa / beta test. It also sounds like only an android app is currently being developed as I'm told a IOS version will be created once the macro feature is complete.
It isn't expected to take to long after that.  :)%
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: BaBaLou. on July 01, 2015, 06:14:44 AM
Finally some good news, :)% more than ready to help get this thing off the ground.
  Have been waiting soooo long for the next step in this chapter.
    Holding on with only threads of decent functionality.

     Thanks very much for the update. Have been checking daily for something. And now something, I hope :'.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on July 01, 2015, 04:49:39 PM
The great sucking sound you hear is me inhaling to hold my breath. I'm so excited I'm vibrating.   :)%
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: builtospill on July 04, 2015, 01:52:53 PM
You think this new wi-fi module is going to work with security sensors/remotes?  Only want it so I can be notified on my iPhone when a zone gets tripped, aka window/door sensor, motion sensor etc
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on July 04, 2015, 08:14:05 PM
You think this new wi-fi module is going to work with security sensors/remotes?  Only want it so I can be notified on my iPhone when a zone gets tripped, aka window/door sensor, motion sensor etc
Word is the Authinx (x10) module is currently only PCL so, NO it won't work with the security sensors or remotes.
They are hoping to add RF ability in a future model and that should work with the security sensors and remotes.
However given the length this unit is taking to come to market I wouldn't count on it being created any time soon. :(
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: toasterking on July 05, 2015, 12:51:33 PM
You think this new wi-fi module is going to work with security sensors/remotes?  Only want it so I can be notified on my iPhone when a zone gets tripped, aka window/door sensor, motion sensor etc
There may be a workaround, but it requires a PC. I have never tried this and have no security modules with which to test, so I am not positive that this is doable, but it may be worth some investigation. ActiveHome Pro with the OnAlert plugin should be able to process security messages. If you can use that to trigger a macro based on security events, the macro could turn on a dummy module (one that does not physically exist) via PLC and the new X10 WiFi unit should be able to see the state change.

The ActiveHome Scripting SDK also can receive the X10 RF security messages, so if you write your own program using the SDK, this and more becomes possible even without AHP support! However, both of these workarounds depend on you having a PC running 24/7 that has both an RF and a power line interface (i.e. CM15A or both a CM11A/XTB-232 and CM19A).‎

You could also write a standalone program that uses the ActiveHome Scripting SDK and either a CM15A or CM19A to receive the X10 RF and just sends you an email when a specific X10 RF security message is received. You could receive the email with your iPhone and this would not require the new X10 WiFi unit at all.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: builtospill on July 05, 2015, 02:02:58 PM
Yeah, but at that point Active home with On Alert plug in would be on an internet connected PC that could relay an email to a text message.  Was just hoping they would make something that eliminates the use of the PC.  Might consider getting one of those little single board x86 computers that are size of a router and running Active home on that to monitor motion and door sensors.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on July 06, 2015, 06:51:10 AM
  Might consider getting one of those little single board x86 computers that are size of a router and running Active home on that to monitor motion and door sensors.
That is a possibility, I currently run AHP on a HP Thin client at my off grid place and can control things remotely over the net.
But I have controlled my set up from an Android mini TV stick using HomeGenie.
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: builtospill on July 08, 2015, 07:58:59 PM
What is this HomeGenie and Android stick you speak of?  Is this better than AHP running on a PC? And will it work with X10 security sensors?
I am assuming HomeGenie software runs on android TV stick, and it interfaces with a CM15A?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on July 08, 2015, 08:40:23 PM
HomeGenie is an automation program that worls on pretty much any system that runs .NET.  So, the list includes Windows, Android, Linux (PC, Mac, RPi, etc), and others most likely.  I have run it on a win7 and winxp for testing and have it running on my RPi for the actual installation.  HG is one of the few I found that will work with the CM15A (not the built-in macros though).  It's very expandable if you know any coding (C#, Python, etc) but can be coded with a simple wizard language much like AHP macros if desired.

I wanted something better than AHP with a small form factor that would work with my current HA and allow expansion to other systems on a remote enabled platform.  Check it out if those things interest you.

www.homegenie.it
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on July 09, 2015, 09:05:12 AM
Here is a write up which explains the Android mini PC stick and 6 best uses for one.
http://blog.laptopmag.com/android-mini-pc
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: builtospill on July 27, 2015, 01:37:59 PM
Yeah, unfortunately I do not have any coding experience.  I am just looking for something plug and play with simple software configuration- that behaves just like Active Home Pro On Alert, minus running a computer 24/7. I just want something that can notify me at least via text message on when a zone is triggered and also have power sirens/lights go on. Don't want to pay monthly fee for something like Simplisafe when I already have tons of x10 gadgets laying around.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on July 28, 2015, 07:29:34 AM
Unfortunately such a device isn't available for the North American market.
The simplest thing right now world be a mini PC running AHP or Homegenie.
There are several Mini PC manufactures  around now so prices have come way down.
You can even find them on EBay.

I picked up a HP Thinclient which runs at my off grid place running Windows 10 and all my HA software.
I have it behind my LED TV which is used as its monitor when I need to configure something.
I was hoping for the new WI-fi module to be able to replace this but since it doesn't look like the initial release will have RF capability that won't happen.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on July 28, 2015, 12:44:13 PM
Authinx module Update:
I just got finished a Skype  chat with Authinx's owner and a designer about this module.

Just when they think they have good communication with the manufacturer they get thrown a curve.
One hold up with releasing these to the market is Authinx's quality standard and convincing the China manufacture that Better doesn't mean cheaper. B:(
With this miss understanding finally resolved ( hopefully)  :', they are now thinking about a second version of this module.
The first version will plug into an outlet and communicate to your router via Wi-Fi the second version will plug into ones router directly, this will benefit those that don't have Wi-Fi and provide better connections for those that have Wi-Fi issues.

Second hold up has been with the software developers.
Minor improvement they are told, are a total software rewrite ??? ::)
Rewrites take weeks if not longer B:( a minor improvement should only take a few minutes to hours.
The Android software is ready though I've yet to see it.
Hope it doesn't need a "Rewrite"  rofl
Authinx plans to make the source code available so others can create programs/apps for it. This too is proving to be a issue however I don't feel it will be a big issue as tools are available to sniff out Wi-Fi activity.

I'm hoping to get one of these first version test units to give a test run shortly. (Currently I'm told there are only two of these) I'm getting the owners module so I'm feeling real lucky. ;)
I'm told there may be still some tweaking to be done on the software but baring that a IOs version should be ready in a few months (at the latest)
Authinx is please with the look of the unit and it works fine in their testing's.
I'll provide a picture once I have the unit.
Real world performance may reveal some needed improvements but hopefully it will be just a software improvement.
There always seems to be a software bug that someone finds. rofl





 
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Dan1 on July 30, 2015, 01:17:40 PM
I'm a x-10 'consumer' user, not at the technical level of a lot of the people on this board. Still using a few X-10 lamp, switch and appliance modules from different manufacturers like Magnavox and Radio Shack. I hope that we really will see a wi-fi module soon. My simple need is just to be able to control a few lamps via wi-fi.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on July 30, 2015, 04:30:21 PM
Welcome aboard Dan1,
The owner is very anxious to get this to market as doing so has taken far longer then he imagined.
He is concerned that many may like you, have doubts that this really exists.
I'm assured this animal does in fact exists and I should have one shortly.
I hope by next week but it is coming snail mail. :(
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on July 30, 2015, 05:54:48 PM
He is concerned that many may like you, have doubts that this really exists.
Yeah, me also. And I'm the one holding my breath. I'm getting a little blue. This one product would help put Authinx on competitive footing with the likes of all these smartphone controlled devices I see in Verizon, ATT, Menards, Lowes, Home Depot, Best Buy, etc. This thread is a year and a half old. Yeah, I can control our home with my smartphone, and tablet,  but the WiFi module would make the process less expensive and easier which should put it back in the hands of the casual HA enthusiast. Authinx really needs to learn how to deal with the Chinese manufacturer. Maybe they should have kept a couple of the old WTI management staff as consultants as they was one of the first US companies to use Chinese manufacturing.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on July 30, 2015, 06:23:32 PM
Authinx really needs to learn how to deal with the Chinese manufacturer. Maybe they should have kept a couple of the old WTI management staff as consultants as they was one of the first US companies to use Chinese manufacturing.
Maybe they need a translator or they finally found one! rofl
The old WTI management most likely wouldn't have helped here as we probably would have had the first proto type or worse the second in our pile of useless X10 devices.
The first proto type Authinx receive was very quickly put together since their using the same manufacturer X10WTI used you can imaging the quality of this first build. And since the manufacturer was use to "make it better" meaning "make it cheaper", the next build was worse. ::) :'
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on July 30, 2015, 06:35:27 PM
Since making the above comment and having thought about it, I should walk it back. I worked for Motorola at an engineering, design, and manufacturing center in south Florida for 28 years and a 2 year product development cycle was not unusual. I guess I am just too anxious.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on July 30, 2015, 08:37:09 PM
I guess I am just too anxious.
As are we all!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: JeffVolp on July 31, 2015, 07:11:16 AM
a 2 year product development cycle was not unusual. I guess I am just too anxious.

Wow!  Back at the lab 6 months was more typical for clean sheet hardware and software development.  A development cycle over a year was a huge project.  (Read that as many-millions of dollars.)

Jeff
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Dan1 on August 01, 2015, 12:13:25 PM
I'm assured this animal does in fact exists and I should have one shortly.
I hope by next week but it is coming snail mail. :(

Will you be able to post a photo of the wi-fi module?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on August 01, 2015, 02:55:04 PM
Yes I will post a photo as soon as I get the module.

I have the Android app installed now on my phone and added some devices for testing when the unit arrives.
The app has basic devices, rooms, timers and scenes.
You need to add devices first then you can create rooms and place the devices in a created room.
Timers require a connection to the module to setup as I assume do scenes.
Once I have and can run the unit I'll post a review.
The app Looks OK so hopefully it doesn't have any major bugs.
I do see some areas for tweaking but these are minor and shouldn't need to be done before a release, which would hold that up.
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on August 02, 2015, 04:45:13 PM
a 2 year product development cycle was not unusual. I guess I am just too anxious.

Wow!  Back at the lab 6 months was more typical for clean sheet hardware and software development.  A development cycle over a year was a huge project.  (Read that as many-millions of dollars.)

The longest cycle I remember was for the business/public safety bands  2-way portable radio that made the transition from transistors and through the hole technology to replaceable, hybrid, modulerized portable, sporting PLLs, op amps, Mylar flex circuits, high level encryption, etc. (Late 70s and 2 grand base price ). It took GE five years to catch up with a competing product. 
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: joe s. on August 04, 2015, 05:03:33 PM
Ahhh....the MX series portable.  I remember it well - I was 20 years with Motorola.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Brian H on August 04, 2015, 06:01:26 PM
I was with one of the Motorola Local repair shops.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on August 05, 2015, 05:02:27 PM
Ahhh....the MX series portable.  I remember it well - I was 20 years with Motorola.
The man wins a prize off the top shelf!  ;D
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on August 05, 2015, 07:08:08 PM
Seems when ever I wish to get my hands on something quickly there is a hiccup! B:(
My test unit sailed threw customs but an address (postal code) miss print has delayed every thing by a week. :'(
Finding a correct postal code only takes seconds ::) :' Discovering a wrong one takes days to a week? ::)

Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Dan1 on August 06, 2015, 09:50:47 AM
My test unit sailed threw customs but an address (postal code) miss print has delayed every thing by a week. :'(
Finding a correct postal code only takes seconds ::) :' Discovering a wrong one takes days to a week? ::)

Typical government agency nonsense. Too lazy/stupid to put down coffee and look up proper postal code on computer. Why is the postal code so important to (assuming Canadian) Customs? US Customs is a bureaucracy too but I don't think a bad zipcode would hold them up.

(Off-topic but it's a shame we can't seem to build gadgets like this in the US or Canada anymore.)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on August 06, 2015, 12:41:34 PM
Why is the postal code so important to (assuming Canadian) Customs? US Customs is a bureaucracy too but I don't think a bad zipcode would hold them up.
Customs wasn't a issue it was the postal service.
After getting the item I guess they just look at the postal so it got sent to the wrong city.
Funny how it got to that city in less then a day however it will take a week (their estimate)  now with the correct postal code for it to get to me.  B:(
At least I know it is for sure on its way. rofl
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Dan1 on August 06, 2015, 01:00:10 PM
Similar thing used to happen to me. I'd occasionally receive mail for a nearby medical office whose address was not even close to mine. Couldn't figure it out until I noticed that the mail had my 'zip+4' in the address. USPS reads it and sends the mail to my house based on that. I told my letter carrier and he took care of it.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on August 06, 2015, 05:55:27 PM
I've managed to take a few screen shots of the App.
Since this is requires the Module for setting up scenes and to work I can't comment to much on the workings.
Also this may not be the release version so things may change.
The Name of the app is also not final, though I'm told it will be ActiveHome related.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on August 06, 2015, 06:04:12 PM
Screens look good. Will the Device screen have indicators of what state it thinks each module is in?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on August 06, 2015, 06:26:12 PM
Currently I can only guess this would work similar to AHP However with out the module I can only Presume.
If it doesn't I'll make that suggestion.
here is a screen shot of the device setup page.
Note: Devices need to be added from the Device Page you can't do it from the Room page.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Dan1 on August 06, 2015, 08:15:38 PM
I don't own a smartphone. I hope there will be an option to set up and access the X10 wi-fi controller via a traditional PC.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on August 06, 2015, 09:56:46 PM
I don't own a smartphone. I hope there will be an option to set up and access the X10 wi-fi controller via a traditional PC.
This is something I'll work on once I have the module. ;)
I'll also see if X10 has plans for this or if they're hoping for someone else( a third party) to develop it.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on August 07, 2015, 11:47:47 AM
I like the layout and the general looks. I think they have a winner if they can just get it launched.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: BaBaLou. on August 07, 2015, 12:45:06 PM
Just to confirm this is the Android based app, available with the new WiFi unit ?

Looking good to me so far. :)%

 Ready  >! and waiting to get my hands on the new stuff.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on August 07, 2015, 01:47:37 PM
Yes, this is the Android App I'm told the iOS app will be similar but hasn't been created yet but will be shortly after releasing the module.
I'm waiting word on a windows app creation.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on August 08, 2015, 09:48:17 AM
Latest word on a Windows app is that X10 wants to wait to see the communities response to the Android app first. ::) :'
Seems they plan to market this as a phone control first and Windows phones have a low market share I guess.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tucson on August 08, 2015, 06:43:29 PM
Looks good, will the timer allow you to offset a time from sunrise and sunset.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on August 08, 2015, 07:05:34 PM
I won't know the workings of the timers until I have the module.
The app will not go to a timer setup without a connection.
The module is set to be delivered Friday baring no more delays.
Once I have it setup I'll be able to supply more info. ;)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on August 14, 2015, 02:21:45 PM
I received the Wi-Fi test unit today and was going to post a few snap shots.
However note: this uses a prototype RR501 RF case and there are some things which will change.
I'm told the code wheel will be removed and I presume some of the text on the case will be too.
The pass threw outlet I assume will stay as it does work.
There is a led light which turns blue once it has connected to your router. This is located where the 1- 9 switch would be
I'll comment more on the workings and its operation in a review thread but for now here is a teaser:
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: BaBaLou. on August 14, 2015, 02:31:03 PM
Thanks for the Teaser.  :)%
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on September 23, 2015, 02:46:57 PM
I just realized I hadn't checked how much power this thing used.
I had suspected it to be using just a bit more then the cm15a since it has Wi-Fi running.

I pulled out my Killawatt meter (http://www.samsclub.com/sams/kill-a-watt-electricity-usage-monitor/prod1170442.ip) and compared the two.

CM15A
Amps: .05
Watts: steady 2
VA: 06
Hz: 59.9
PF:  .43 to .46

Wi-Fi module
Amps: .05
Watts: 1 to 2
VA: 06
Hz: 59.9
PF:  .31 to .34

These reading were made with both units sitting idle.
Cm15a was connected to the PC
The Wi-Fi unit had connected to the router
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on October 20, 2015, 01:17:39 PM
I'm told the Authinx production hardware build is ready.
It is based off the PAT03 similar to the proto type.
However the code wheel and antenna have been removed.

Seems the prototype was hand made and the RF board wasn't fully removed this is why I was able to have RF abilities.
In my tests RF only worked for the house code the wheel was set to. B:(
So it doesn't appear that this will have RF when released :'( But I've been wrong before.

The developer it sounds like is in the final stages of getting a new software ready as graphics where asked for to be added to the app.

Will we see this for Christmas 2015?  ::) :'
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Dan1 on October 20, 2015, 01:34:00 PM
'Will we see this for Christmas 2015?'

Christmas is only 2 months away, that sounds very optimistic. Any idea of what the pricing will be?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on October 20, 2015, 01:48:48 PM
'Will we see this for Christmas 2015?'

Christmas is only 2 months away, that sounds very optimistic. Any idea of what the pricing will be?

Stranger things have happened  rofl

No word on pricing, chances are you'll know that before me anyways. I never hear what is released till after the fact and usually its when I check the X10 site. ::) :'
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Dan1 on October 21, 2015, 01:55:13 PM
I know the wi-fi unit is designed for the smartphone user but were you able to access it via a computer?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on October 21, 2015, 06:20:25 PM
To be honest I've not tried very hard yet.
I hope to be able to spend some time  playing with this once the next version of the software is out.
The current version only allows one device to connect currently if you connect with another device you loose your settings (timers, devices & rooms) ::) :'
Since I wanted to expose as many flaws as possible with the software, I only tried connecting once with another device.

I did try some capturing with Wireshark however I'm not very experienced with it.
I also tried an Android emulator but the one I tried would not use my Wi-Fi.
The emulator route would be the way to go If you could find one that can access your network.
I believe I had one on my development PC that I could connect to the internet with but I believe I deleted it. B:(


Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on November 09, 2015, 11:49:21 AM
I've been told the Android software version is finished although I've yet to see it  ::) :' ( to be fare I was away for a few weeks)
I'm not sure even if the new software will work on my prototype.

The go ahead was given for the iOS version to be developed this is to be identical in looks and performance I was originally told.

Also the tooling has been approved and production has started on the unit.
I guess I'll need to go talk to Santa! ;)
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on November 09, 2015, 05:25:25 PM
I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED.  (pant pant) I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED.  :'
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on November 09, 2015, 05:27:44 PM
 rofl
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tucson on November 10, 2015, 12:26:28 PM
Does the software allow you an offset from sunrise and sunset?

Also way too soon but it would also be cool if it would interface to Amazon echo.
 
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on November 10, 2015, 12:59:19 PM
I haven't seen the latest software build the scenes needed a lot of work in the initial release and didn't have offsets then.
I doubt it will interface with Amazon echo thought Authinx has stated they will release the Protocol.
When that happens there should be no shortage of ways to connect.
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Knightrider on November 10, 2015, 05:58:57 PM
I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED.  (pant pant) I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED.  :'

ALL WORK AND NO PLAY MAKES DAVE A DULL BOY.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on November 11, 2015, 09:14:23 AM
I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED.  (pant pant) I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED. I WILL NOT GET EXCITED.  :'

ALL WORK AND NO PLAY MAKES DAVE A DULL BOY.
Knight! Have you been talking to my wife?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on November 11, 2015, 11:59:39 AM
I received the new software version today and it looks the same.
I've requested info on the scenes settings as they aren't set up like AHP macros which is confusing me as to how they should work.
There is a timer option for each device you add to the scene but I'm unsure if this is a delay or a time for the device to switch to the opposite state.

I've also requested what is the min android build this will run on as my Airpad will not install it. B:( :'(
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on November 13, 2015, 02:32:42 PM
I feel we have all waited long enough for this and the Authinx owner agrees.
The software still needs work however the manufacture was looking after this and the developer paid.
Authinx has got a new developer to work on the next version of the software which won't be out till after initial release.

The current software is very powerful in the Scene area though it is very confusing to setup so I suspect lots of questions.
It took me several attempts to create a complex scene with timers and I made several suggestions to make this less complex.
The owner is hoping to have an initial limited shipment in before Christmas. So some of you lucky ones may snag one if you visit the sales page regularly.
Also watch the announcement section in the forum as I'm trying to get something special put together for forum members.
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Dan1 on November 14, 2015, 01:16:01 PM
Great that the wi-fi unit is finally in the pipeline.

I also tried an Android emulator but the one I tried would not use my Wi-Fi.
The emulator route would be the way to go If you could find one that can access your network.
I believe I had one on my development PC that I could connect to the internet with but I believe I deleted it. B:(

I installed the 'Bluestacks' http://www.bluestacks.com/ (http://www.bluestacks.com/) free wi-fi emulator. It's a bit slow and because it's free you have to occasionally download a few free game apps. I installed my thermostat control app and it worked, so it does connect with wi-fi.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: toasterking on November 14, 2015, 01:25:19 PM
I installed the 'Bluestacks' http://www.bluestacks.com/ (http://www.bluestacks.com/) free wi-fi emulator. It's a bit slow and because it's free you have to occasionally download a few free game apps. I installed my thermostat control app and it worked, so it does connect with wi-fi.

Thanks for the tip!  "Helpful Post" from me!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on November 14, 2015, 01:26:09 PM
Thanks Dan,
I believe that is the emulator I originally played with on my development PC.( at least it sounds familiar >!)
I'll reinstall it and see how it goes!
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on November 14, 2015, 02:04:49 PM
Yep that was what I had used Prior.
The Wi-Fi app will connect to the Wi-Fi module and control devices. :)%
WireShark also shows info being past to it  :)%
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Dan1 on November 14, 2015, 02:18:50 PM
Excellent!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: nyc2 on December 27, 2015, 02:17:38 PM
I guess not for Christmas, but hopefully early in 2016. Nothing official on x10 site.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on December 27, 2015, 05:08:27 PM
We were all hoping for a Christmas release :'(
Sadly I haven't heard anymore other then a small initial shipment will be flown in and those who have requested a promo code will get first dibs at securing one.
http://forums.x10.com/index.php?topic=29322.0
Hopefully I'll hear something shortly.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on December 28, 2015, 02:39:33 PM
This is all so cruel. "Oh, the humanity of it all!"    rofl
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: nyc2 on December 29, 2015, 08:43:28 AM
We were all hoping for a Christmas release :'(
Sadly I haven't heard anymore other then a small initial shipment will be flown in and those who have requested a promo code will get first dibs at securing one.
http://forums.x10.com/index.php?topic=29322.0
Hopefully I'll hear something shortly.

I guess these things take time, especially when dealing with a Chinese manufacturer. The x10 people should at least put up a 'coming soon' item on their website with some specs, photo, model#, etc.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on December 29, 2015, 10:06:24 AM
I know there are a few items that they were hoping to have out for Christmas.
One they actually have the hardware ready to go. However the software end of it didn't get done in time.
With the Wi-Fi module there may be another software update before the actual release. ::) :'
Unless it is the same developer B:(
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 04, 2016, 03:51:11 PM
I just got a update on thie Authinx wi-fi module.
There is good news bad news! ::)

Bad news: :'(
 The release date has been set back once again B:(
 The owner wishes to express his apologes on this and due to the Chinese new year it looks like the earliest release will be March.
 The reason, TI the chip manufacture discontinued the chip the Wi-wfi module was to use.
A small quantity of 100 or so was found but rather then build a obsolete product Authinx decided to go with a new chip.

Good news: :)%
TI the chip manufacture is working with Authinx to get the new chip ready which should speed up things.
This new chip will allow options the other didn't and means the second version of the wi-fi module is what will be released.
I had asked about the software as well and it looks like it will remain the same.
However the protocol is different with the new chip which will mean a minor rewrite.
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on January 04, 2016, 05:19:22 PM
I see they are still using engineers who trained to drive trains.  :(

The ESP8266, introduced about 18 months back has been a huge success in IoT. It sells for less than $1 in any quantity, has 100m+ transmit range, and is essentially a plug'n'play solution to WiFi. There is open source code for it in C (Arduino code) as well as 2-3 versions of Basic. Any company designing a new WiFi enabled device that doesn't use it, have their collective heads up their asses.

Given yet another delay, I'll go ahead with my mod for the older, through-hole CM15A which adds WiFi, a better RF receiver, a better antenna system, a serial connection, an open source communications protocol, open source firmware for the hardware, etc.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 04, 2016, 07:45:41 PM
I see they are still using engineers who trained to drive trains.  :(
It appears so
I'm realy surprised they stuck with this manufacture given their mentality was the same as X10WTI.
Authinx has tried to change them but it looks like it is going to be a long road if they continue working with them. :(
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on January 04, 2016, 07:54:36 PM
I'm realy surprised they stuck with this manufacture given their mentality was the same as X10WTI.

I suspect this manufacturer's ownership is the same as X10WTI.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: nyc2 on January 11, 2016, 02:04:34 PM
I just got a update on thie Authinx wi-fi module.
There is good news bad news! ::)
Bad news: :'(
 The release date has been set back once again B:(
 The owner wishes to express his apologes on this and due to the Chinese new year it looks like the earliest release will be March.
 The reason, TI the chip manufacture discontinued the chip the Wi-wfi module was to use.
A small quantity of 100 or so was found but rather then build a obsolete product Authinx decided to go with a new chip.
Good news: :)%
TI the chip manufacture is working with Authinx to get the new chip ready which should speed up things.
This new chip will allow options the other didn't and means the second version of the wi-fi module is what will be released.
I had asked about the software as well and it looks like it will remain the same.
However the protocol is different with the new chip which will mean a minor rewrite.
 >!

Understandable delay, things happen. But it's taken so long (at least 2 years based on this thread) to develop this product.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 11, 2016, 04:31:13 PM
Authinx isn't happy with the delays either. I think they figured it would be easier to do then it panned out.
But then again if they had went with the initial unit using old X10wti standards we would have seen this the 1st year
I just hope the product works as well as the proto type. Actually I hope it works better and they can add all improvements suggested which they said will be in the second generation unit.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on February 01, 2016, 03:29:47 PM
News is a iOs app is near completion for the Authinx Wi-Fi module.
With the factory building the module  like most factories in China will shut down starting tomorrow for CNY.
However progress is being made on reprogramming the chip.
Things are looking good for a March release.
Unfortunatly we've all seen delays before ::) :'
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tucson on March 03, 2016, 11:11:22 PM
 Time for the monthly update
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on March 04, 2016, 08:13:18 AM
Time for the monthly update
Yes it is!
As most know China basically shuts down in February for new years celebrations.
I do know there was a scheduled meeting with the manufacture and a X10 team set for yesterday.
However I have not heard anything else as yet.
I suspect it won't be till next week before we hear anything, cross your fingers that the X10 team brings back a plane load of these units.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on March 18, 2016, 12:57:36 PM
Ok here's the latest on the Authinx unit.
Some hardware modifications needed to be done to comply with the new chip.
This apparently has been done and a unit has been (or will be shortly) sent to the software developer so the new code can be added to work with the new chip.
It is now looking like 2nd week of April before we'll hear anything on a release.
I'm unsure if I'll see this beast before a release but if I do I'll be sure to post about it.
I was beginning to think this was dead but I'm assured it is still in the pipeline.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: nyc2 on March 19, 2016, 02:49:02 PM
Ok here's the latest on the Authinx unit.
Some hardware modifications needed to be done to comply with the new chip.
This apparently has been done and a unit has been (or will be shortly) sent to the software developer so the new code can be added to work with the new chip.
It is now looking like 2nd week of April before we'll hear anything on a release.
I'm unsure if I'll see this beast before a release but if I do I'll be sure to post about it.
I was beginning to think this was dead but I'm assured it is still in the pipeline.
I know Authinx is a small company but they need to do a better job of marketing. Simple stuff like a Facebook page or Twitter account don't cost anything and are a good way to announce new products.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on March 19, 2016, 03:26:01 PM
The wifi unit isn't yet a new product.
Since X10WTI gave X10 such a bad rep and Facebook and Twitter basically killed it, I'm not surprised they don't use either.

Posts made on the forum are not meant to act as any form of marketing unlike what X10WTI did prior.
The thread I created for getting a discounted Module was something I though loyal users and forum members deserved, it was not thought of as a marketing scheme. Thought the owner may have looked at it like that when I suggested a discount for us.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: racerfern on March 21, 2016, 11:45:03 AM
It must be getting close to release as the CM15A is currently unavailable. The big question is how will the new unit play with older modules and switches?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on March 21, 2016, 12:19:48 PM
I suspect it will play as well as the initial proto type did with it's last software update as the same Software developer is apparently  reviving the code to work with the redesigned chip.
The wi-fi unit is not meant to be a replacement for the CM15.
Authinx has stated modules will be updated when current stock runs out so it will be interesting to see what happens with the Cm15
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Knightrider on April 13, 2016, 04:49:36 PM
Time for the monthly update
We have got to be close to having these. I gave up on AHP and have been MANUALLY switching lights since December. 
Tell x10 to let me preorder. Take my money!!!!! Just hot ship me one. Don't even let it cool off from the slow boat from China.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on April 13, 2016, 05:37:35 PM
I ...... have been MANUALLY switching lights since December. 
APOSTATE! HERETIC! Knight, you have strayed.  :o
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on April 13, 2016, 06:44:57 PM
Time for the monthly update
We have got to be close to having these. I gave up on AHP and have been MANUALLY switching lights since December. 
Tell x10 to let me preorder. Take my money!!!!! Just hot ship me one. Don't even let it cool off from the slow boat from China.
I actually emailed the owner this morning requesting a update.
If I don't receive a response by tomorrow evening I'll fire off another request.
The last update I got stated it would be at least second week in April before we would possibly hear anything on a release.
A prototype was to have been sent to X10 for a final go ahead with the new software.
I have not heard if they even received this yet. B:(
The good news (if there is any Knightrider) is the owner plans to fly an initial shipment in so some of us won't need to wait for the slow boat.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: beelocks on April 13, 2016, 10:46:23 PM
have been MANUALLY switching lights since December. 

That sounds like an amazing concept. Could you post a link to the instructions?
How reliable is this method and what hoops need to be jumped when troubleshooting?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on April 13, 2016, 11:50:30 PM
.... have been MANUALLY switching lights since December. 

Oh my God Brian... you must be both exhausted... as well as frustrated. Is there anything we can do to help?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on April 14, 2016, 07:35:22 AM
.... have been MANUALLY switching lights since December.

Oh my God Brian... you must be both exhausted... as well as frustrated. Is there anything we can do to help?
[/quote]
Macros must be a real joy! I'm sure help can be used there!

How much weight have you lost Brian?
There may be a market for the X10 EP  (exercise program) rofl
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on April 14, 2016, 12:27:02 PM
.... have been MANUALLY switching lights since December. 

Oh my God Brian... you must be both exhausted... as well as frustrated. Is there anything we can do to help?
Knight, your buckeye brothern is right. I should be trying to help with encouragement and understanding. I apologize for calling you names and saying you have strayed....

luddite

Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Knightrider on April 19, 2016, 07:29:14 AM
I guess that the experience has been so exhausting, that I haven't been able to get on this forum very much!  It's actually the lamp next to the couch that gets me. Instead of using my smartphone or tablet or even my voice, (now get this) I have to EXTEND my arm aprox. 15 degrees IN THE AIR AT AN ELEVATION! and reach over about a foot to turn on the table lamp!!! I don't know how I will ever survive.

-Brian AKA the Knightrider
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on April 19, 2016, 09:34:14 AM
Sorry to hear your arms are getting so tired Brian. :'( Hopefully you'll soon be able to give them a rest

I heard back from the Authinx owner late Friday night seems he was just getting back from China from a meeting with the  engineers.
Not much info was forwarded to me other then the new TI Chip performs much better then the old chip.
He stated he would follow up with more details today or tomorrow.
Hopefully several units were flown back with him for an initial release. Keep your fingers crossed!
 >!



Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on April 19, 2016, 10:59:13 PM
I guess that the experience has been so exhausting, that I haven't been able to get on this forum very much!  It's actually the lamp next to the couch that gets me. Instead of using my smartphone or tablet or even my voice, (now get this) I have to EXTEND my arm aprox. 15 degrees IN THE AIR AT AN ELEVATION! and reach over about a foot to turn on the table lamp!!! I don't know how I will ever survive.

-Brian AKA the Knightrider

And we once thought sore fingers from button pushing was a lot to bare. If this automation-outage continues... I could mail you my "clapper (https://youtu.be/3lBWjLJeKkQ)". It works great for those single event situations like a couch lamp. Of course... if the lamp has a pull chain... who needs a clapper (https://youtu.be/jFLfgcoPB_w?list=FLwSIYbHjKdHux-_Rimhs2hg).
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Knightrider on April 19, 2016, 11:19:21 PM
Ahh, when my mistress was in my life. Here's an article from 4 years ago.
http://highlandcountypress.com/Content/Citizen-Journalist-Blogs-/The-Harwood-Housewife/Article/The-Other-Woman/12/226/12670
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on April 20, 2016, 02:54:57 PM
It looks like at least one or two more weeks before these are offered. B:(
The hardware is finished I'm told, however the issue remains to be a software issue.
The Issue is due to synchronization when another device connects.
The old design simply wouldn't allow a second connection this new chip allows that.
They can get multi connections but  synching multiple units without creating collision and long delays is a problem which they hope to have weeded out by next week.
It sounds like they are again using a new software developer.
The owner has stated he still intends to fly in a small shipment prior to the sales event.
I suspect these will be the discounted units planed for forum users.
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: nyc2 on April 22, 2016, 10:36:13 AM
Can we see a photo of the new unit?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on April 22, 2016, 02:07:50 PM
I don't have access to a unit yet and from the sounds of it neither does Authinx as they were working 20 days while in China last week.
However I'll see if the owner has something.
From what I was told prior, it will look similar to the prototype unit I posted pictures of less an antenna.
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on April 22, 2016, 02:57:28 PM
Update:
The owner doesn't have a photo however he did confirm that the form factor was that of the PAT01 less the code wheel and antenna.
With that in mind it should look similar to this:
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: BaBaLou. on April 26, 2016, 08:29:54 PM
Well it seems I am getting to that crossroad in my Automation heaven and the signs of frustration is starting to wear thin.
The X10 world that surrounds me at home and work is still functioning but with duck tape and bandages. Most hardware is working well with a combination of X10 and Insteon and the CM15a is still alive showing its age and besides I need something new. :)%.  
The software is a combination of iHouse and BlueIris to keep things alive. But at best all will function for a few days and then adjustments and resets  B:(. So my hunger for the new stuff is becoming somewhat desperate, so I make myself to believe  ;D, and so the new Wi-Fi unit has to start to fill the void. Have began the task of looking at other forms of automation with hope of compatibility with my present stuff and hoping its just short of a full overhaul of automation of which I am presently short a penny or two for that.
So a few question and review of what we have coming soon so far.
 First to confirm that this unit will function from a smartphone and maybe Tablet ? but no software for the pc. Can it be then accessed through a web browser so to control it from a remote location or the app can do that also?
The unit has RF or not, does it matter much any more thou?
Didn't see mention about macros but only timers and scenes, does that mean at the end of the day we live our live like we did with AHP in the older days, but no computer? Does the unit then hold the memory without the need of a computer running 24/7 for those security function and modules?
Can the unit send out any form of messages or connect to email or send some form of remote signal to the app?
Any antenna on this unit, or do I get a new hack ready for that part? -:)
So many more questions to ask and stuff to pock at. But soon we hope to be able to take the next step in X10 favor.
And just to make it clear, I am ready and able to handle anything new, please. No really PLEASE.....
BaBaLou. >!  
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: joe s. on April 27, 2016, 12:13:12 PM
Here's my story.  I too struggled with X10 reliability - so I opened my wallet over a year ago and made my current X10 setup (timers/macros, wireless, web & mobile device access) work solidly and properly (and for the long term) by purchasing high quality control equipment and software.

This is what it took for me to make everything solid and reliable:

XTB-IIR repeater (with TW523 port)
V572 RF Whole House Transceiver (connects to TW523 port on repeater)
XTB-232 RS232 Powerline Interface (connected to computer)
HCA 12 plus software (running in computer - now v13 is released) - which means I can use Web and/or WiFi Android or IOS, and of course limitless complex macros.

Everything works all the time / every time.

By using the HCA Software package, I also have the option of buying, controlling and blending new and old hardware such as:

X10
Insteon
UPB
Z-Wave
NEST or Insteon Thermostats
Elk
Marrick
Lightolier
Davis Weather Station
Amazon Alexa voice control

I haven't even added new hardware yet (some of my old hardware that I thought was broken even works) - but knowing that I can upgrade at any time is reassuring.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on April 27, 2016, 06:43:50 PM
 BaBaLou,
Not having seen the new unit or the revised software yet I can't be 100% correct on some things here.

1: Unit has no external antenna 100% sure of that as Owner confirmed that. internal one only
2: Unit has no Ethernet Cable option 100% sure of that as Owner confirmed that
3: Unit apparently has loads of memory ( more then the Cm15 ) I'm told.
4: Unit does have timers(scenes) 100% sure of that. I'm not sure if macros will be in this software but the unit has the memory for them if/when added
5: Unit will work with Android and Apple smartphones and tablets 100% sure of that.
6: Unit will work with a PC running an Android simulator 100% sure of that. I suspect someone will root out the protocol to make accessed through a web browser possible prior to Authinx releasing the Protocol.
7: Unit is Wi-Fi to PLC unsure if it will see PLC
8: I don't know if RF was added to this version (originaly it wasn't in the plan however I expressed the need)
9: I suspect this can send out a email as the chip is capable of that
10: the new chip makes it possible to have multiple connections like the  UPB gateway ( not sure if the issues have been worked out with the software for this yet)
11: the new chip allows for many more upgrades I requested from playing with the prototype  which the old chip didn't (exactly what or if they are all implemented with the new software update, I don't know)
12:This can be used in conjunction with the CM15 ( at lease the prototype could), this of course depends on how each was setup as to if conflicts occur

I am 100% sure that end users will discover possibilities of this unit which X10(Authinx) never envisioned! ;)
 >!

Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: BaBaLou. on April 30, 2016, 05:29:28 PM
Thanks joe s..
             I Have looked at HCA as an option and glad to see success on your end giving me the ammunition to head in that direction if needed but gotta admit that waiting for the New X10
                          direction is making me slowly turn to a new direction. Just a little bit longer. I hope. :-\.

Thanks Tuicemen
   I guess there is some hope to this never ending waiting for this NEW WiFi unit to be in our hands soon. But it also sounds like we will still have a hill to climb once it is out as new discoveries and abilities of the chip as well as errors we find and contend with  B:(.  I hope that does not come back to bite us. So the sooner the better.

So as stated before I am still waiting, and somewhat still patiently for now in hope of the soon release.
BaBaLou.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on April 30, 2016, 06:13:16 PM
I heard back from the Authinx owner late Friday night seems he was just getting back from China from a meeting with the  engineers.
Not much info was forwarded to me other then the new TI Chip performs much better then the old chip.

Do you know which TI chip they are using? My guess is either the CC3100 or CC3200 which cost 10-15x what the ESP8266 costs while having far less capability.
http://www.digikey.com/en/product-highlight/t/texas-instruments/cc3100-and-cc3200-simplelink-wi-fi-and-iot-solution (http://www.digikey.com/en/product-highlight/t/texas-instruments/cc3100-and-cc3200-simplelink-wi-fi-and-iot-solution)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on April 30, 2016, 06:34:44 PM
If you decide to look at another option, check out HomeGenie. I currently run X10 via CM15A with HG running on a RPi. It's not a professional product so it has bus pop up from time to time but has been very stable overall for quite some time. If I want to update systems, it can handle ZWAVE and a few others.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: BaBaLou. on April 30, 2016, 08:58:31 PM
Thanks guys. no worry I am very aware of all other types of systems and software out there and have had feedback on some in the past. This Forum has covered many other option in the past and have looked at them very closely.
IMO the MCA software is a much better option for me if I chose to head in a new direction. I have looked at HomeGenie in the past and did play a bit with it but had issues of install and connections.
For now its a wait and see what X10 has for us. Soon.  :'
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Dan1 on May 01, 2016, 11:38:56 AM
First to confirm that this unit will function from a smartphone and maybe Tablet ? but no software for the pc. Can it be then accessed through a web browser so to control it from a remote location or the app can do that also?

It's buried earlier in this thread but a decent android emulator is Bluestacks, available for free at http://www.bluestacks.com/. I used it on my old Windows 7 machine but have not yet downloaded/installed it on the Windows 10 machine I'm using now. It's a little slow but it does work.
(P.S. Windows 10 sucks.)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on May 01, 2016, 01:46:01 PM

Do you know which TI chip they are using? My guess is either the CC3100 or CC3200 which cost 10-15x what the ESP8266 costs while having far less capability.
I don't know which new TI chip the module is using.
I do know they were working closely with the chip manufacture to insure it would perform the way they wished. It didn't sound like it was something already available however it may have been and it just needed tweaking.

 Dan1,
I can confirm Bluestacks works from Windows X10, actually I find it faster then on my Windows 7 PC
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: joe s. on May 02, 2016, 01:14:38 PM
I'm sure you know this - but the XTB-IIR repeater makes the most of any/all X10 systems, regardless of the back end.  In truth, it was the first thing added to my unreliable system - and it made such a big difference, I felt confident to accumulate the rest of my "new" stuff.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Knightrider on June 06, 2016, 08:20:30 AM
Any update on the release?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on June 06, 2016, 12:47:37 PM
Authinx was to have received the final build and latest update software last week with any issues to be reported back by end of this week.
Baring no major issues a production run was to start next week.
However the owner had expressed some concern as it seemed every time he attempted contact there seemed to be a holiday in China. B:(
I'll see what new info I can get to pass on. ;)
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on June 06, 2016, 01:18:00 PM
Maybe we should forward him a LIST (http://www.timeanddate.com/holidays/china/)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Dan1 on June 06, 2016, 03:32:30 PM
However the owner had expressed some concern as it seemed every time he attempted contact there seemed to be a holiday in China. B:(
I'll see what new info I can get to pass on. ;)
 >!
This is starting to sound like a bad joke.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: janbo on June 08, 2016, 12:13:28 PM
Can someone tell me what the deal is with the Wi-Fi unit? What is it suppose to do?

Thanks
Ron
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Knightrider on June 08, 2016, 02:53:22 PM
Can someone tell me what the deal is with the Wi-Fi unit? What is it suppose to do?

Thanks
Ron

PLC modem that interfaces to computing devices through wifi, as opposed to usb or other serial interface.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: janbo on June 09, 2016, 11:57:06 AM
Is this like the X10 commander which allows one to control X10 devices with the Wi-Fi  with a smartphone or tablet?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on June 09, 2016, 05:51:02 PM
Is this like the X10 commander which allows one to control X10 devices with the Wi-Fi  with a smartphone or tablet?
This is to be a new device which will allow you to send x10 PLC commands via Wi-Fi using a smartphone tablet or even PC.
it talks to your router via wifi.
If the x10 commander your referring to is software then it isn't the same, as that requires a PC (running 24/7and a cm15 or cm19 the wi-fi unit doesn't require those however it will work with them.
This also doesn't require a PC at all it runs independent .
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Brian H on June 09, 2016, 06:29:21 PM
I don't remember a hardware X10 Commander.
I have both a VCR Commander and VCR Commander 2. That where hardware.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: racerfern on June 09, 2016, 06:37:43 PM
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.melloware.x10.android

It got me back into my house when I locked myself out since the garage door opener is on a UM506. Worth every penny.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on June 09, 2016, 11:52:25 PM
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.melloware.x10.android

It got me back into my house when I locked myself out since the garage door opener is on a UM506. Worth every penny.

I also use the Melloware software (on a tiny laptop with a CM19) and the app running on my iPhone. A great addition to my X10 setup.

I am also running the myQ (chamberlain) garage door and app on my iphone... and an accessory module. Also a handy add-on.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tucson on June 26, 2016, 05:11:10 PM
Authinx was to have received the final build and latest update software last week with any issues to be reported back by end of this week.
Baring no major issues a production run was to start next week.
However the owner had expressed some concern as it seemed every time he attempted contact there seemed to be a holiday in China. B:(
I'll see what new info I can get to pass on. ;)
 >!

Been a long week. Any new info.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on June 27, 2016, 08:33:44 AM
The owner has been out of the country and is due back later today.
I'm hoping to get some update before the weekend. ::) :'
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Dan1 on June 27, 2016, 10:49:47 AM
The owner has been out of the country and is due back later today.
I'm hoping to get some update before the weekend. ::) :'
Another holiday in China perhaps?
在中國也許是另一個假期?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on June 27, 2016, 10:59:03 AM
 rofl
Not sure where he was but if over there I suspect it wasn't a holiday for him. ::) :'
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on June 29, 2016, 10:51:19 AM
I received a email this morning from the owner.
The news wasn't what we were hoping for! :'(
The last test unit Authinx received had connection issues which frustrated everyone testing it.
The manufacture can't recreate these issues so Authinx has some other engineers looking into the cause.
It almost looks like the manufacture is dragging out the development of the unit on purpose. B:(
Unfortunately they don't expect the issue to be rooted out very quickly. :'(

There was some good news that came out of the testing.
Once connection was working the unit performed well making software updates and such a piece of cake.
Sounds like this may be cloud based firmware upgradable. ???



 
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on June 29, 2016, 12:07:49 PM
Cloud based?! Hmmm, I think I'm out.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on June 29, 2016, 01:36:47 PM
The software itself isn't cloud based.
Sorry about the confusion! My statement was in regard to the firmware upgrades only and that was a presumption on my part.

I quickly received a E-mail from the owner on that cloud based statement.
He wants to ensure everyone that the software is not cloud base as he realizes many users don't wish this.
This is the main issue with the Wi-Fi units development.
Many developers wish to do cloud apps as they are easier and more options are possible.
Getting them to do a non cloud based app and still get the manageability and options Authinx knows users are looking for has been a long process.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Knightrider on June 29, 2016, 07:58:11 PM
Powell Crosley recruited engineers from his local college (University of Cincinnati ). Hard to take your  vision to an established crowd set in their ways, even harder when there is a language barrier.
Oh, back to Powell. He set up a company making these new things called radios. When he found out they weren't selling, he created his own radio station, which at one time generated 1 million watts of Effective radiated power (war time) and had custom vac tube made that were water cooled to power his 500,000 watt rig. As I am right now in Mason Ohio admiring the diamond tower for 700 WLW, I am pleased that even though they are now cut to 50,000 watts, they are still heard in 38 states at night, and remain just a few with "clear channel" night time privileges.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on June 29, 2016, 09:04:59 PM
The software itself isn't cloud based.
.....  Getting them to do a non cloud based app and still get the manageability and options Authinx knows users are looking for has been a long process.

No offense to anyone... but why on Earth would anyone want to avoid technology... when developing a technology product?!?!?!

Authinx is apparently trying to replicate yesterdays technology. My house came with standardized (yesterdays) technology. Adding a remote so I can turn incandescence lights on and off (although almost magical in 1976) isn't such a big deal these days. Really useful technology requires computers with smart software that give the appearance of life-like thinking... period. To accomplish this we need really great software and a good internet connected computer running 24/7.... or we need a little processor and an app that connects to the cloud. There just ain't no other way to do it.

No wonder this program isn't getting finished. It has no vision. It has no direction.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on June 30, 2016, 09:40:04 AM
No wonder this program isn't getting finished. It has no vision. It has no direction.
Actually the program(app) is finished and ready to go, I'm told. ( however is any program ever really complete?)
The issue now is the unit which may just be a quality control issue (which wouldn't surprise me) since this is the same manufacture that x10 WTI used.
Authinx has been attempting to enable this software to do things only possible with cloud based software and have succeeded to a great extent which is great news.
Quote
To accomplish this we need really great software and a good internet connected computer running 24/7.... or we need a little processor and an app that connects to the cloud. There just ain't no other way to do it
This is not true!
It use to be only running a PC 25/7 was, now the cloud has expanded this.
Tinny little processors which run these little apps connecting to the cloud are in most cases more powerful then the PC you first used for HA running 24/7.
With progress possibilities get expanded sticking with the easy way (cloud based software) may progress things faster.
However the easy way is not always the best way.
Serves go down,slowdown, get hacked, in fact everything that can happen to your software can happen to cloud based software. When this happens thousands are affected and with no way to control any thing rendering your setup useless.
Hundreds of companies have had issues with cloud based software and yet they stick with because many think there is no other way!

I think Authinx has been listening to users and trying to give them cloud base functions with out a cloud based software!
This is something X10WTI didn't do (listen)! Kudos to Authinx for listening!

Now Authinix hasn't moved completely away from cloud based software, just look at their new Linked line cameras.
However these save images to a SD so if the server is down or the software crashes you still have access to your images.
In fact you can set these up to run totally off line too.




Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on June 30, 2016, 09:46:19 AM
As discussed before, cloud control isn't a negative as long as it's optional. When that is the only way to control your device and the cloud (or whatever)goes down, you may have worse than a dumb device. If the device has no local control, how do you control your lights, garage door, entry dead bolt, etc.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: JeffVolp on June 30, 2016, 10:34:09 AM
I agree with Tuicemen.  There is no way I would want control of my home handled by the cloud.  Look at the nightmare with ActiveHome Pro when the X10 WTI servers went down.  Who knows what will happen in the cloud over the next 10 - 20 - 30 years.  I want my automation system running on MY hardware and controlled by software in MY home that is not reliant on anything external.  Like other software I've purchased, each application should include a key that can be used to re-register the software if it is re-installed without requiring any external connection.

Jeff
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on June 30, 2016, 01:38:03 PM
There is no way I would want control of my home handled by the cloud.  Look at the nightmare with ActiveHome Pro when the X10 WTI servers went down.  Who knows what will happen in the cloud over the next 10 - 20 - 30 years.
And for those that have so quickly forgotten about AHP, look at Nest. Thousands woke up to freezing homes and the only way to get the device software to work again for many was to return the device for repair and software reinstall losing all settings.


Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Brian H on June 30, 2016, 03:16:54 PM
I have seen reports of large outages with the Cloud Based Comcast X1 System. When some major issues happened.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on June 30, 2016, 04:55:23 PM
There is no way I would want control of my home handled by the cloud. ......  Who knows what will happen in the cloud over the next 10 - 20 - 30 years.

And for those that have so quickly forgotten about AHP, look at Nest. Thousands woke up to freezing homes and the only way to get the device software to work again for many was to return the device for repair and software reinstall losing all settings.

I have seen reports of large outages with the Cloud Based Comcast X1 System. When some major issues happened.

You are all 100% correct! There is no way automation will EVER be completely fail-proof and absolutely reliable. For that matter... even my Electric Provider... fails me 3-4 days a year. What-to-do.... what-to-do????

We can pretend that without the latest technology... our automation will be just-as-good or good-enough. Or just pretend that good-enough really is... good enough. But if that was actually true.... we can still buy replacement parts and pieces.... so why are we here?

But even that... doesn't solve the problems of getting vendors to produce inferior (old technology) products. So... they drag their feet.... and wait for X10 to come around and realize what has to be done. While we wait.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tucson on August 07, 2016, 02:05:30 PM
I received a email this morning from the owner.
The news wasn't what we were hoping for! :'(
The last test unit Authinx received had connection issues which frustrated everyone testing it.
The manufacture can't recreate these issues so Authinx has some other engineers looking into the cause.
It almost looks like the manufacture is dragging out the development of the unit on purpose. B:(
Unfortunately they don't expect the issue to be rooted out very quickly. :'(

There was some good news that came out of the testing.
Once connection was working the unit performed well making software updates and such a piece of cake.
Sounds like this may be cloud based firmware upgradable. ???



 


Any updates
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on August 08, 2016, 04:39:48 PM
I fired off an email this morning asking for a update.
I also haven't heard anything since my last update noting a connection issue with the latest test module Authinx has.
It was tested in multiple locations to be sure it wasn't just the router.
The issue was the same running it in different locations.
As soon as I get a update I'll post it here!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on August 08, 2016, 06:24:53 PM
 B:(
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: racerfern on August 08, 2016, 06:32:24 PM
I hear splashes of water.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: timlight10 on August 17, 2016, 05:53:47 PM
Any updates on this Wi Fi module?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on August 18, 2016, 05:30:01 PM
By the time X10 gets this out of China, 2.4gHz WiFi will be obsolete, and the development process will start over.  >*<
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on August 24, 2016, 12:42:30 PM
I continue to nag the owner for updates so I haven't forgotten about this. There just isn't any thing to report, ironing out the connection bug was expected to be something that would take a while.
I'll post a update as soon as I hear, and hopefully that is before 2.4 GHZ is obsolete. B:(
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on September 14, 2016, 09:19:00 AM
This is becoming as elusive as the pot 'o gold at the end of the rainbow. In theory a WiFi gateway will stimulate sale of more, bread and butter, control modules. So one would think Authentix would be pushing hard.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on September 14, 2016, 01:49:06 PM
They are! They just don't wish the rep of x10WTI.
They want this to be rock solid and currently the connection issue makes the quality not up to par.
The owner hopes everyone understands and apologizes for the continued delay.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on September 14, 2016, 02:46:38 PM
This thread started nearly 3 years ago. The longer this takes the greater the risk that they lose their market. As it is, their market is mostly just us geezers with a long-term investment in X10 devices.

It's obvious that direct WiFi control of lights and appliances is the wave of the future. There are WiFi coffee makers, WiFi crockpots, WiFi plug modules, and TP-Link's $20 hubless WiFi LED light bulb makes more sense than an X10 switch or lamp module that relies on flaky (to most people) PLC control.

The latest Raspberry Pi 3 costs $35 and has built-in WiFi and things like the $5 Onion Omega and $9 Omega Plus (both with similar computing power to the RPi3 and built-in WiFi) almost guarantee that apps will appear that allow them to control the new WiFi enabled lights and appliances as well as interfacing with existing X10 controllers via USB, serial and RF links. The RPi3 and Omega Plus have microSD slots so they can store schedules, macros, etc. locally, meaning there's no need for cloud links although optional links are certainly possible.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: JeffVolp on September 15, 2016, 10:20:28 AM
It's obvious that direct WiFi control of lights and appliances is the wave of the future. There are WiFi coffee makers, WiFi crockpots, WiFi plug modules, and TP-Link's $20 WiFi LED light bulb makes more sense than an X10 switch or lamp module that relies on flaky (to most people) PLC control.

I recently watched a movie where a couple was moving into a new home where everything would be automated.  The husband was enthused by being able to lock or unlock the front door from his cellphone.  And recently I saw an advertisement bragging about the ability to control the car HVAC from a cellphone.  Wouldn't it be easier and less of a distraction to just reach over and turn the knob?

Jeff
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: JeffVolp on September 15, 2016, 10:33:29 AM
They want this to be rock solid and currently the connection issue makes the quality not up to par.

That can take a lot of work.  I spent a lot of time trying to make the simple RS232 interface on the XTB-232 as robust as possible.  I hit it with power glitches, X10 collisions, and noise bursts.  I could never get it to 100% because the PC program would lock up.  ActiveHome Pro was the worst, but even HCI could lose communication, and had to reconnect with the XTB-232 that was just sitting there waiting.  Sometimes HCA would reconnect by itself after a short interval, but ActiveHome Pro would have to be closed and re-started.

Jeff
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on September 15, 2016, 10:55:11 AM
Wouldn't it be easier and less of a distraction to just reach over and turn the knob?
Obviously, you're a stuck-in-the-mud X10 geezer.  :o

The latest generation were all born with smartphones in their hands.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on September 15, 2016, 11:17:01 AM
I can start my new truck from my phone.  It's far easier and more secure to turn on the phone, open the app, wait for connection, select "ON", wait for the start, insert the key, turn to run position.  I don't understand how people just insert the key and turn.  Crazy!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on September 15, 2016, 11:20:53 AM
I really haven't seen connection problems with WiFi. Once configured with the router's SSID & password, everything seems to connect rather quickly and seamlessly as they power-up.

I shut everything down at night and my SSID is not broadcast but everything connects smoothly when I start my day or start their day. That's 1 SmarTV, 2 Macs, 3 W10, 3 W7, 1 Dell laser printer, 1 RPi3, a 6TB HDD, plus a handful of ESP8266 modules in development projects. And, I expect Santa to bring me an Onion Omega Plus at year-end.

I did have one cheap Android tablet that would not connect to the hidden SSID. I solved that by giving it away.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on September 15, 2016, 04:06:56 PM
Wouldn't it be easier and less of a distraction to just reach over and turn the knob?
Jeff
No Jeff, this needed feature provides the ability to lower the cars temperature while furiously thumbing out texts. Your eyes never have to leave the phone screen.  rofl
(Actually I wonder if it isn't aimed at cars that can be remote started by a smartphone app(?)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on September 15, 2016, 04:15:08 PM
My truck can send txt if I pay for the feature. It can call someone hands free (space recognition) but speach to text is extra for some reason.  :o
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on September 15, 2016, 06:35:32 PM
My truck can send txt if I pay for the feature. It can call someone hands free (space recognition) but speach to text is extra for some reason.  :o
Will it automagically call the nearest Fire Department when your Samsung dumbphone self-ignites?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: toasterking on September 15, 2016, 08:23:20 PM
I recently watched a movie where a couple was moving into a new home where everything would be automated.  The husband was enthused by being able to lock or unlock the front door from his cellphone.  And recently I saw an advertisement bragging about the ability to control the car HVAC from a cellphone.
I don't understand why people so often seem to think remote control = automation.  Remote control can be handy in some circumstances, but it's a supplement at best.  My front door should lock itself when all humans have left the house and the car leaves the driveway.  It should lock itself when all bodies are on beds.  The car should recognize who is sitting in it and adjust the HVAC to their preference.  At the point that you no longer need the controls, local or remote, that is automation!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on September 18, 2016, 04:33:08 PM
http://futurism.com/images/the-house-of-2016-the-smartest-gadgets-in-the-rooms-infographic/ (http://futurism.com/images/the-house-of-2016-the-smartest-gadgets-in-the-rooms-infographic/)  8)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: JeffVolp on September 19, 2016, 09:46:05 AM
http://futurism.com/images/the-house-of-2016-the-smartest-gadgets-in-the-rooms-infographic/ (http://futurism.com/images/the-house-of-2016-the-smartest-gadgets-in-the-rooms-infographic/)  8)

I don't see how anyone can do without that $6400 automated toilet.   rofl

Jeff
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on September 19, 2016, 11:13:25 AM
Or a $11,000 bed for that matter.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: nyc2 on October 09, 2016, 05:41:21 PM
They are! They just don't wish the rep of x10WTI.
They want this to be rock solid and currently the connection issue makes the quality not up to par.
The owner hopes everyone understands and apologizes for the continued delay.
I'm sure Authinx is sincere in their desire to get the wi-fi unit on the market, but it's starting to look like a dead issue now.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on October 10, 2016, 11:28:29 AM
I'm sure Authinx is sincere in their desire to get the wi-fi unit on the market, but it's starting to look like a dead issue now.
I understand many users feel this way and I again questioned the owner about this.

 Although he is out of the office this week (may be in China? ::)) he did have someone reply.
I'm told this appears on track now for a end of year release (maybe for the holidays ::) :').
This sounds like the connection issue was routed out. :)%
I'm told they are continuing to work with the app developer to improve end user experience.
For those that have stuck with X10 and not moved on they (at Authinx) expect the X10 Wi-Fi module will be an exciting new product for those users.

 Like many, my HA set up is in need of a major overhaul and has been since the module development was announced.
A holiday release won't come at a better time as it will give me time to play.
I hope like many that there isn't another hiccup which delays this further B:(

 >!



Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on October 10, 2016, 05:01:45 PM
Since the announcement, I have upgraded my setup to move away from AHP completely but am still interested to see how this module improves things.  If the price was right, it might be worth a play though entry into my setup may not happen at this point.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on October 11, 2016, 11:35:25 PM
I held out until Apple entered into the HA market.

But even with some added "different flavored" HA products (My Q and ihome).... I still have bunches of X10 units both in service, held in reserve, or as spares. My X10 works fine... both by itself and without interference to or by the new homekit compatible products. So I am still interested in the New x10 Wi-Fi unit.

I see no reason why anyone would want to limit their HA setup to just one flavor/brand/type/protocol. Or... for that matter why any manufacture would limit their product line any more than is practical. It would be nice... if X10's new control unit could be flexible enough to be compatible with other HA flavors.

Maybe X10 could even be made compliant with Homekit.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on October 12, 2016, 10:58:12 AM
With the right HA software, everything will work together though.  HomeGenie doesn't have compatibility with everything, but it does X10, Insteon, ZWave, and a couple others.  If users were interested in putting in the time, other systems could be added.  That said, there are many others that do work with a wider array out of the box depending on needs.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on October 13, 2016, 01:25:25 AM
With the right HA software, everything will work together though.  HomeGenie doesn't have compatibility with everything, but it does X10, Insteon, ZWave, and a couple others. ......

And... I might continue to run some sort of HA PC... I have for about a decade now. But I really like that at lease some of my automation is controlled via a server somewhere. And I would welcome the idea of the HA PC... actually being my phone. As my phone is always running, close at hand, and unaffected by lighting and power outages.

Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on October 13, 2016, 10:47:54 AM
My HA system is (mostly) also unaffected by power outages though it doesn't matter since X10 is PLC and does nothing without power.  I run a RPi behind a UPS designed for a PC.  As a result, the RPi can technically run for hours without power.  It is a server that is accessible from anywhere in the world and functions autonomously with any rule set I ask it to.  It's also low enough power, it's effectively free and is guaranteed to have no fees ever and I don't have to worry about it being shut down unexpectedly.   8)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on October 15, 2016, 11:45:40 PM
...I run a RPi behind a UPS designed for a PC.  As a result, the RPi can technically run for hours without power.  It is a server that is accessible from anywhere in the world and functions autonomously with any rule set I ask it to.  It's also low enough power, it's effectively free and is guaranteed to have no fees ever and I don't have to worry about it being shut down unexpectedly.   8)

Your setup sounds really sweet.

I've looked at the Raspberry Pi stuff.... mostly in consideration of robotics. And have also looked at the mini, CE, and flash-drive sized windows OS devices... as well as tablets. I think my hold-back with some of the devices is it almost is like a whole-new additional hobby. I love voice control (I still use BVC along with Siri) and the wife and I are both hooked and dependent on the voice warnings and announcements.

I am NOT saying that coding our own devices/apps isn't a good solution. But it may be a little over my head and/or skill levels.

And now... automation has gone main stream. Home Automation isn't just a few hundred nerds with smart homes anymore. Amazon has sold 3 million Echo (Alexa) devices (http://www.geekwire.com/2016/report-amazon-sold-3-million-echo-smart-speakers-awareness-grows/). And my iPhone is now sold completely setup to easily connect to a whole host of automation devices.

So... if I already knew how to code... and enjoyed it... I'd jump on that Raspberry Pi/mini PC/or Android table route in a hot minute. But at this point... I think I'd rather automate the easy way (that's a joke) just using phone apps. I haven't bought an Echo yet... but I think one (or something like it) is in my future.

 
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on October 16, 2016, 12:28:38 PM
While they have spent 2 years developing a WiFi-to-PLC controller, they could have been adding this little critter to all of their switches and modules and then anybody with a smartphone/tablet or WiFi router could control them.
https://www.itead.cc/psf-b85.html (https://www.itead.cc/psf-b85.html)

And, a 310MHz or 433MHz RF receiver need not be much bigger or add significant cost.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on October 17, 2016, 12:15:42 AM
While they have spent 2 years developing a WiFi-to-PLC controller, they could have been adding this little critter to all of their switches and modules and then anybody with a smartphone/tablet or WiFi router could control them.
https://www.itead.cc/psf-b85.html (https://www.itead.cc/psf-b85.html)

And that does seem to be the way of the future. And hubs... are now allowing mix and match of systems.

And, a 310MHz or 433MHz RF receiver need not be much bigger or add significant cost.

I like the idea of retaining X10's RF and PLC abilities. IMHO... the more choices the better.

But whatever happens... with X10, apple, or any other particular Home Automation product or protocol. Recent events has reminded me.... that the only constant has always been and always will be... change. And I still believe that our limits with automation... will also always be limited to what we can imagine automation to be.

It felt really good to finally be able to make a small upgrade to my automation setup.... again. 
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on October 17, 2016, 12:06:18 PM
If this....
https://www.ray.co/ (https://www.ray.co/)
can talk to the ESP8285 used in this via WiFi...
https://www.itead.cc/psf-b85.html (https://www.itead.cc/psf-b85.html)
and talk to this via Bluetooth...
http://www.blumoo.com/ (http://www.blumoo.com/)
in addition to all the IR controlled TVs and other AV gear, it would go a long way towards being a truly universal (and totally awesome) controller.

Ray has a partners program for developers but I fear I'm too worn out (or worn down) to explore it.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: IPS on October 26, 2016, 07:32:02 AM
For the last few months my AHP system, after years, has started becoming less reliable. May be because I have replaced most bulbs with LED ones. So I too am seriously considering adding other home automation system. I have read about HomeKit and would like to try it out.
Would appreciate if you guys can give some input on the modules etc.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on November 08, 2016, 09:39:23 PM
......... I have read about HomeKit and would like to try it out.
Would appreciate if you guys can give some input on the modules etc.

The very day Apple updated to OS 10 (with ihome/homeKit) I ordered a couple modules. I love the iPhone apps and the way I can use "hey Siri commands" to turn lights on/off (from anywhere).

I plan on continuing using X10 (I have a large X10 setup)... and may even expand my X10. But I see nothing wrong with adding other automation flavors.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Knightrider on December 03, 2016, 08:49:10 AM
Any news? The End Of The Year Fast Approaches.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Brian H on December 03, 2016, 08:58:43 AM
Over in the JVDE Forums.
Tuicemen indicated the progress is not going the way they wanted it to go.
No estimates as each date seems to be missed.
Probably not this year and looks like Chinese New Year is again getting close.  B:(

Bottom of second page.
http://jvde.us/forum/index.php?topic=329.0
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on December 03, 2016, 10:22:51 AM
For God's sake... with all the new flavors of HA hubs on the market why doesn't the new vendors of X10 just make a deal with one of those venders. Get Samsung (or someone) to add the X10 (RF) protocol to their HUB/unit.... with a guarantee purchase of bulk batch of units!

 
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on December 03, 2016, 03:05:20 PM
I wouldn't advise anyone to hold their breath waiting for this one. :(
I think x10 should tell the manufacture and app developer to stick it.
They probably would have if they hadn't put so much into this already.
The really sad thing is once this comes to market just about everyone will have lost interest and found something else.
X10WTI went belly up using this manufacture I hope that doesn't happen to Authinx ::) :'
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on December 03, 2016, 04:19:01 PM
The really sad thing is once this comes to market just about everyone will have lost interest and found something else.
I am working on something else but it's a few months away. See...
https://www.laser.com/dhouston/ultimate-X10.html (https://www.laser.com/dhouston/ultimate-X10.html)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: beelocks on December 03, 2016, 06:45:14 PM
Any news? The End Of The Year Fast Approaches.

End of the Year?
We'll be approaching the next century before this thing surfaces :)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on December 04, 2016, 12:18:07 AM
I've accepted that X10 control is as it stands. I have no longer have a real expectation of any new advanced control system coming out of X10.

But... I'd think someone would program a USB toggle to function like a ZigBee stick... only using X10 RF. Maybe include an app with an annual app fee... that could also provide server (cloud) memory/programing as well as phone/tablet/PC access.

But if my X10 system remains no more than what is now... My X10 is still very useful and stable. And my iPhone enables me to add other flavors of automation (even my garage door).

I hope X10 finds its niche as it once did with the little cameras. I'd like to see X10 prosper. 
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on December 04, 2016, 06:48:17 AM
But... I'd think someone would program a USB toggle to function like a ZigBee stick... only using X10 RF.
Someone already has...
https://www.thehomeautomationstore.com/cm19a.html (https://www.thehomeautomationstore.com/cm19a.html)
but you're probably thinking more along this line...
https://www.intellihome.be/en/x10-marmitek-tip10rf.html (https://www.intellihome.be/en/x10-marmitek-tip10rf.html)
This could be easily manufactured to work with 310mHz transceivers (i.e. TM751, RR501, CM15A) but the crystal that needs changing is far too small for the transformation to be a DIY hack and Authinx apparently has no interest in working with Haibrain. At least, they never responded when I suggested they contact Haibrain, giving them contact information.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on December 04, 2016, 11:56:34 AM
But... I'd think someone would program a USB toggle to function like a ZigBee stick... only using X10 RF.

Someone already has...
https://www.thehomeautomationstore.com/cm19a.html (https://www.thehomeautomationstore.com/cm19a.html)
but you're probably thinking more along this line...
https://www.intellihome.be/en/x10-marmitek-tip10rf.html (https://www.intellihome.be/en/x10-marmitek-tip10rf.html)
This could be easily manufactured to work with 310mHz transceivers (i.e. TM751, RR501, CM15A) but the crystal that needs changing is far too small for the transformation to be a DIY hack and Authinx apparently has no interest in working with Haibrain. At least, they never responded when I suggested they contact Haibrain, giving them contact information.

Yeah... that 2nd link is closer to what I had in mind. I already have a CM19A (as well as a CM15A) in my X10 setup (I use a Melloware app on my iphone and it's server app on a CE laptop with the CM19A to have X10 phone control). But even a BT dongle that could commutate with both the router... and X10...along with my phone could be enough (with or without internal memory). If it could get directions from an external source. USB power sources are everywhere now-a-days.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: racerfern on December 04, 2016, 05:39:36 PM
Quote
I use a Melloware app on my iphone and it's server app on a CE laptop with the CM19A to have X10 phone control

I too use the Melloware app but with just the CM15A. It works fine within the confines of the home Wifi. However, accessing the home X10 system from miles away is a pain. I can manage to use the Chrome Remote Desktop to access AHP but it certainly isn't convenient, in fact a downright pain due to needed to scroll a large screen on a small device.

I'm still looking for a way my X10 system some other way.

Why would you have both a CM15A and a CM19A, for a different PC?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on December 04, 2016, 05:54:58 PM
.......
I'm still looking for a way my X10 system some other way.... Why would you have both a CM15A and a CM19A, for a different PC?

I have a decent sized X10 setup which I have setup so that an old XP laptop can operate the HA along with voice control... and voice alerts, warning announcements etc.. Which I run 24/7... completely off-line. That laptop is connected to the CM15A... plus voice input and speaker output. 

But when down loading the Melloware server exe.... I realized I'd have to at least connect to the "home network" (router). I did... but the laptop slowed noticeability and I later decided to instead run the Melloware server on a old little CE notebook I had come by (used). To simplify things I only installed the CM19A on the little CE notebook.

Not optimal. But they both set on a small wire shelf unit in my man cave and run fine.

I had often thought of installing XP on a more modern and faster laptop with plenty of RAM. Then incorporating everything on the newer laptop. (I also have two full sized backup PC's completely loaded and ready to run the exact setups that are on both units now.) But I also hoped that I could move the entire HA setup to a tablet... or even someday run through my phone.

But X10 folded.... and with them their servers. So I left what was... run as is.

I don't know how many hours of thinking, and searching, and reading I've done.... trying to figure a direction for my Home Automation setup. I think what has bothered me most... isn't the troubles with X10. . I have a lifetime of X10 product on hand and I can always add other brands/flavors of HA devices. But for a while... my setup stopped growing.

But lately... with the newer garage door opener, new streaming options like apple TV and Roku, and apple adding HomeKit... I am hopeful again. I've added a little ihome (two devices)... and I may add other flavors/brands of HomeKit compatible devices as I get new HA ideas/projects. I am thinking... an Amazon echo or dot device is mandatory. 
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: racerfern on December 04, 2016, 06:06:39 PM
Quote
I have a decent sized X10 setup which I have attempted to setup so that an old XP laptop can operate the HA along with voice control... and voice alerts, warning announcements. Which I run... completely off-line.

Understood. I have a palm sized HP which runs my security camera software and AHP as its sole purpose. I am on-line so as to send a camera feed to a useless cloud. However, I could just as easily take it offline, but then I couldn't use it from the outside, which is what I really want.

I just got back from visiting my son who setup zwave and he said to me, "I'll be picking up the kids from gymnastics, but when you get to the house, call me and I'll open the garage door to let you in. Because I can." Sigh...

But whether it's Zwave or some other protocol, the switches and controllers are far more expensive than X10 stuff, hence my hesitation to dump X10. XMAS timers, AWAY macros, I've got lots of time into this and really don't want to start again. Away for two days and now want to turn up the t'stat an hour or two before I get home. Not an unreasonable want.

But I digress.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on December 04, 2016, 06:55:31 PM
Someone send some YouTube links of Moe, Larry, and Curly Joe in action, to the Shenzhen manufacturer, maybe they will get the message.
Although Authinx management of their manufacturer on this product development has been pretty weak IMHO.
Just sayin.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on December 04, 2016, 07:00:13 PM
However, I could just as easily take it offline, but then I couldn't use it from the outside, which is what I really want.
You can access it without needing an umbrella. Ask your son (or a grandchild) how to do this.

I posted how to do it links in a recent post here but, right now, I'm busy with something else so I can't take the time to search my posts for the appropriate one.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: racerfern on December 04, 2016, 07:02:36 PM
I can access it from outside, easily, if I understand you correctly.

I meant from outside my little world as when I'm 25 miles or 2500 miles away.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on December 04, 2016, 07:11:56 PM
I meant from outside my little world as when I'm 25 miles or 2500 miles away.
Even from the moon or the ISS.

So that your grandkids won't think you're a totally clueless geezer...
    http://forums.x10.com/index.php?topic=29607.msg166659#msg166659 (http://forums.x10.com/index.php?topic=29607.msg166659#msg166659)

BTW, I'm 75 in January. :'(
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on December 05, 2016, 02:37:58 AM
....I just got back from visiting my son who setup zwave and he said to me, "I'll be picking up the kids from gymnastics, but when you get to the house, call me and I'll open the garage door to let you in. Because I can." Sigh...

But whether it's Zwave or some other protocol, the switches and controllers are far more expensive than X10 stuff, hence my hesitation to dump X10. XMAS timers, AWAY macros, I've got lots of time into this and really don't want to start again.

You can keep X10 and add zwave... or just the garage door opener modification... or all three and maybe something else too. I've never been a believer in everything having to be X10... or any other protocol.   
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on December 23, 2016, 07:44:12 AM
I'm concentrating on my Universal X10 Controller and don't want to get side-tracked...
https://www.laser.com/dhouston/ultimate-X10.html (https://www.laser.com/dhouston/ultimate-X10.html)

However, duplicating the Haibrain Ethernet to X10 RF transceiver (X10 Tip10RF) but making it a WiFi to X10 RF transceiver is about a $10 DIY project using a WeMos D1 mini ($4) , a WeMos D1 mini Protoboard ($1) and a 310MHz RF transmitter module ($5).
http://www.uk-automation.co.uk/marmitek-tip10rf-smartphone-to-x10-interface/ (http://www.uk-automation.co.uk/marmitek-tip10rf-smartphone-to-x10-interface/)
https://www.wemos.cc/product/d1-mini.html (https://www.wemos.cc/product/d1-mini.html)
https://www.wemos.cc/product/protoboard.html (https://www.wemos.cc/product/protoboard.html)

There is ESP8266 Arduino code for sending/receiving infrared on GitHub. This has been adapted for Basic4Arduino. (Both Arduino and Basic 4Arduino support the ESP8266.) This can be further adapted to just send the data envelope to drive the RF transmitter. Then all that needs to be done is send 2 bytes to the ESP8266 via WiFi which can then be relayed to a TM751, RR501, CM15A, etc.
https://github.com/markszabo/IRremoteESP8266 (https://github.com/markszabo/IRremoteESP8266)
https://www.b4x.com/android/forum/threads/ir-send-and-receive.69454/ (https://www.b4x.com/android/forum/threads/ir-send-and-receive.69454/)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Knightrider on January 17, 2017, 12:55:49 PM
Still holding my breath,  but honestly, my enthusiasm is waning.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: nyc2 on January 17, 2017, 12:59:04 PM
Still holding my breath,  but honestly, my enthusiasm is waning.

When a relatively simple product like this takes forever to come to market you have to assume that it's a dead deal.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 17, 2017, 02:35:10 PM
China basically shuts down for their New Years and is at a slow crawl leading up to it from Christmas from what I've noticed in the past.
Knightrider, you best take a breath as it is very highly unlikely :( we'll see anything till after the Chinese New Year.
I just hope when it comes out there is an Alexa skill for it ;)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: racerfern on January 17, 2017, 03:00:21 PM
Sometimes (usually) I enjoy being the cynical one; not this time. From just over a year ago. :-[

Quote
I just got a update on thie Authinx wi-fi module.
There is good news bad news! ::)

Bad news: :'(
 The release date has been set back once again B:(
 The owner wishes to express his apologes on this and due to the Chinese new year it looks like the earliest release will be March.
 The reason, TI the chip manufacture discontinued the chip the Wi-wfi module was to use.
A small quantity of 100 or so was found but rather then build a obsolete product Authinx decided to go with a new chip.

Good news: :)%
TI the chip manufacture is working with Authinx to get the new chip ready which should speed up things.
This new chip will allow options the other didn't and means the second version of the wi-fi module is what will be released.
I had asked about the software as well and it looks like it will remain the same.
However the protocol is different with the new chip which will mean a minor rewrite.
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 17, 2017, 03:08:35 PM
Yep I'm sure most of us weren't expecting it to take this long.  ::) :'
The owner has expressed his frustration on this to me and understands how everyone must feel.
He has asked me to pass on his apologies for the delays numerous times which I have failed to do each time :-[
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on January 17, 2017, 03:10:13 PM
it is very highly unlikely :( we'll see anything till after the Chinese New Year.

But, which year?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: solareclipse on January 17, 2017, 03:12:15 PM
If there isn't either a native Google Home/Alexa interface or IFTTT integration, I'm not investing in it.  I've already made the decision that I'm not spending more to simply get my X10 stuff to work like it should.  I'll spend on new capabilities if it extends the life of the stuff I already have, but otherwise I'm finding a new technology that has active development around it.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 17, 2017, 04:10:13 PM
 
it is very highly unlikely :( we'll see anything till after the Chinese New Year.

But, which year?
rofl
 B:(
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on January 17, 2017, 08:08:00 PM
If there isn't either a native Google Home/Alexa interface or IFTTT integration, I'm not investing in it.  I've already made the decision that I'm not spending more to simply get my X10 stuff to work like it should.  I'll spend on new capabilities if it extends the life of the stuff I already have, but otherwise I'm finding a new technology that has active development around it.

I am with you on wanting an X10 Hub as they call these things now. But I want to also retain the macro capabilities I have now. And seeing as I have 2 back-up CM15A's I should be OK. But... I am not seeing any of the new entries interested in much of anything like what we came to expect from X10.

Meanwhile.... I can operate everything from my phone. X10, cameras, ihome, wink, Alexa.... it is all integrated though the phone. Which ain't all bad.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: racerfern on January 17, 2017, 08:52:30 PM
it is very highly unlikely :( we'll see anything till after the Chinese New Year.

But, which year?
rofl
 B:(

It will be much sooner than next year, it will be any day now.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: solareclipse on January 17, 2017, 09:06:53 PM
I am with you on wanting an X10 Hub as they call these things now. But I want to also retain the macro capabilities I have now. And seeing as I have 2 back-up CM15A's I should be OK. But... I am not seeing any of the new entries interested in much of anything like what we came to expect from X10.

Lucky you...  I already bought one replacement off of ebay, but as my family members seem to be giving up on X10 for newer technologies, I might inherit a couple.

Meanwhile.... I can operate everything from my phone. X10, cameras, ihome, wink, Alexa.... it is all integrated though the phone. Which ain't all bad.

My phone seems becoming an integral component as well.  I'd like to see more robust macro capabilities from these companies themselves (Hue's capabilities still leave a lot to be desired) but apps like Tasker can pull the discrete components together.  It's just more work to set up.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on January 18, 2017, 02:14:23 AM
...... My phone seems becoming an integral component as well.  I'd like to see more robust macro capabilities from these companies themselves (Hue's capabilities still leave a lot to be desired) but apps like Tasker can pull the discrete components together.  It's just more work to set up.

I am afraid the little programs where the user has to add little bits of code in folders and such.... is a bit over my head. Which admittedly is frustrating.

My Home Theater Macros work fine with the old fashioned X10 remotes. As do the IR parts of the theater and X10 itself... so I can live with that part with no mods at all. And many other parts of my X10... run flawlessly with no added input from me whatsoever.

But I have one running macro... called "goodnight" that I'd really like to add to the DOT... along with another "new" macro... that I've thought of but also can't integrate yet.

I am NOT complaining. I love this stuff. These "problems" are like little puzzles that need to be solved. This new burst of change and progress in the HA sector.... is great entertainment as far as I am concerned. More and more the tag line I use (below) is more relevant. Our limits are more so than ever before... restricted only by our imaginations.     
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 18, 2017, 08:27:24 AM
I am afraid the little programs where the user has to add little bits of code in folders and such.... is a bit over my head. Which admittedly is frustrating.
Then contact the developer and state what you find confusing, most wish to increase their user base.
Making something easier to use will always get more people at least trying it.

Quote
But I have one running macro... called "goodnight" that I'd really like to add to the DOT... along with another "new" macro... that I've thought of but also can't integrate yet.
Is this is a AHP macro it is simple to do (no coding or moving files required)
Quote
I am NOT complaining. I love this stuff. These "problems" are like little puzzles that need to be solved.
Puzzles get solved quicker with more people working on them.
However a DIY project is most satisfying when you figure it all out your self! ;)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on January 18, 2017, 09:25:58 AM
Then contact the developer and state what you find confusing, most wish to increase their user base.
Making something easier to use will always get more people at least trying it.
This is the problem I am having with Logitech on the Harmony Hub. Their original X10 code library for the Hub was for the IR543A, so contained no House Code control. After some emails defining how the IR543AH worked, they down loaded the full X10 code library to my Hub. Everything worked great from the smartphone. But when I tried to set up a X10 "Activity" (Logitech's term for a Harmony Hub macro) for Alexa control, the Harmony app will not let me put an ON or OFF step in the Activity list because the Logitech "Activities" setup thinks the on-off commands control only the IR543AH, so "ON" is automatically sent at the beginning of any Activity using the IR543AH device and is not part of the step selection in building an Activity. l have not been successful in  conveying to Logitech that the IR543AH is only a continuously powered gateway and the ON-OFF code must be able to be transmitted throughout an X10 "Activity".  So close, yet so far.   B:(
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on January 18, 2017, 10:54:25 AM
Wow! I'm amazed that they updated the codes at all.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on January 18, 2017, 01:53:16 PM
Wow! I'm amazed that they updated the codes at all.
It surprised me also. However the Blumoo X10 code library always contained all X10 HCs. So Logitech just uploaded a different library to my Harmony.  I confirmed it worked in the smartphone. But then realized the power commands were not available when trying to build an "Activity". I just checked and it looks like they have uploaded the new full house code library, for all users. It is found under their "X10 Pro" manufacturer listing. Their "X10 Wireless" manufacturer listing still has the single house code "A" IR543A library. Perhaps they have fixed or will fix, the exclusion of the power commands...I will have to check.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on January 18, 2017, 01:54:21 PM
This is the problem I am having with Logitech on the Harmony Hub.......

Call the tech support number.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on January 18, 2017, 01:55:57 PM
This is the problem I am having with Logitech on the Harmony Hub.......

Call the tech support number.
I may not have to. It appears there is some action taking place.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on January 18, 2017, 04:34:54 PM
It is found under their "X10 Pro" manufacturer listing. Their "X10 Wireless" manufacturer listing still has the single house code "A" IR543A library.
Is there a library for any European IR7243** models? X10 Europe, Marmitek, etc. They copied Laser's IR543AH codes.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on January 19, 2017, 09:26:25 AM
Is there a library for any European IR7243** models? X10 Europe, Marmitek, etc. They copied Laser's IR543AH codes.
I will check this afternoon and post findings.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: toasterking on January 19, 2017, 04:25:35 PM
If there isn't either a native Google Home/Alexa interface or IFTTT integration, I'm not investing in it.  I've already made the decision that I'm not spending more to simply get my X10 stuff to work like it should.  I'll spend on new capabilities if it extends the life of the stuff I already have, but otherwise I'm finding a new technology that has active development around it.
I'm taking a dubious stance also but for different reasons.  My X10 stuff already works as I think it should and I'm not willing to compromise its functionality.  I doubt that this fabled WiFi device could replace the PC I'm using as a central controller, and even if it can, I don't wish to make all my automation control dependent on something as brittle as WiFi.  I'll be buying this, but just as a toy and a way to support the company.  It should be very useful to a lot of people, but my standards are pretty firmly set at this point.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: toasterking on January 19, 2017, 04:33:12 PM
...... My phone seems becoming an integral component as well.  I'd like to see more robust macro capabilities from these companies themselves (Hue's capabilities still leave a lot to be desired) but apps like Tasker can pull the discrete components together.  It's just more work to set up.

I am afraid the little programs where the user has to add little bits of code in folders and such.... is a bit over my head. Which admittedly is frustrating.

Tasker really isn't that difficult.  It has a menu-driven interface for selecting commands and adding parameters to build simple, proprietary scripts, but you don't have to actually write code in a text editor.  It's similar to creating Smart Macros in AHP but there are more commands, more options, and more to tinker with until you get things working right.  It's for Android only, though, and I know you're mainly an iOS guy.  If you have to use an additional phone to make it work, it's probably not the right solution.  :)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on January 26, 2017, 08:56:34 AM
Tasker really isn't that difficult.  It has a menu-driven interface for selecting commands and adding parameters to build simple, proprietary scripts, but you don't have to actually write code in a text editor.  It's similar to creating Smart Macros in AHP but there are more commands, more options, and more to tinker with until you get things working right.  It's for Android only, though, and I know you're mainly an iOS guy.  If you have to use an additional phone to make it work, it's probably not the right solution.  :)

I am an old windows guy actually. I have limited Apple experience... and about 4 years of apple phones. And I have an original airpad (android tablet)... as well as a recent 10" (android) tablet (with a keyboard).

Looking at "Tasker"... it appears to be little more than a android app for a phone.

I am looking for something that can connect/pair with either the Echo/DOT or a HUB (I have a wink) using a Android tablets Blue-tooth. Maybe pretend to be another device/hub. Then maybe use a CM19A (heyU drivers?) to send RF X10 commands. As cheap as these tablets have gotten... it might be a quick easy way to create an X10 hub/CM15A replacement.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 26, 2017, 10:40:39 AM

I am looking for something that can connect/pair with either the Echo/DOT or a HUB (I have a wink) using a Android tablets Blue-tooth. Maybe pretend to be another device/hub. Then maybe use a CM19A (heyU drivers?) to send RF X10 commands. As cheap as these tablets have gotten... it might be a quick easy way to create an X10 hub/CM15A replacement.
Currently the pairing of the echo/dot via Bluetooth seems to be only for the speakers, Wi-Fi connection is what is required.
I have been able to run a CM19 from an Android TV stick however that required switching the OS to Linux.
Your idea certainly won't be quick or easy for someone that is uncomfortable with anything above point and click.

I too am a old Windows guy and prefer it over Android and prefer Android over Linux.

Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on January 26, 2017, 10:13:46 PM
.... Your idea certainly won't be quick or easy for someone that is uncomfortable with anything above point and click.

I am fine with a lot more than point and click. But the little java scripts are a hobby in themselves. I have plenty enough little hobbies now. The last thing I need is to take up... yet one more... activity that would keep me inside and on the laptop/PC. I remember the HeyU guys. I always thought they were attracted to X10/HA only because it gave them an outlet to write useful code. And I still think I was right.

The really great thing about apps... are they have mandated a certain amount of finish and polish to tiny programs.

It's like with Home Theaters... many of the other Theater owners I've met are audiophiles. And the theater makes a great outlet for the audio hobby. In my case... my wife and I are movie enthusiasts and the theater is an outlet for movie watching (and collecting).

By the way.... I just added a Cree wifi/HA light bulb ($15 Home Depot) to my setup. Not a bad choice for a single bulb light setup. Of course my ihome setup doesn't allow for Cree... and for Alexa a hub is required. So the Wink Hub was really handy.

Now running 2-3 different brands of the X10 protocol devices
Alexa
Wink Hub
ihome, power plugs
Cree wifi/HA light bulb
My Q (chamberlain) garage and light/power device. I deliberately have avoided adding the garage door to Alexa. I don't think having a door anyone can open by telling Alexa to open it... is a secure idea. But it is still phone controlled.

If the was a reliable and reasonably priced hub out there that could control X10 (yes I know about the Insteon hub) I'd buy it. 

Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 27, 2017, 08:13:07 AM
You really should look at the HA-Bridge.
Even if you don't wish to use Alex10 the bridge is capable of running on many different OS.

I believe all your devices could be controlled with it. This doesn't have to use little Java scripts but it could.
I'm looking at a app that puts Linux on your Android device (no need to root) that way I could run the HA-Bridge on my TV box.
I attempted this on my AirPad but the I think I need to re image it as it has gotten very slow.

Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on January 27, 2017, 10:47:01 AM
You really should look at the HA-Bridge.
Even if you don't wish to use Alex10 the bridge is capable of running on many different OS.

But what about a CM15A... or maybe better... a CM19A

....I'm looking at a app that puts Linux on your Android device (no need to root) that way I could run the HA-Bridge on my TV box.
I attempted this on my AirPad but the I think I need to re image it as it has gotten very slow.

I think might work great! A $35 android tablet, and $20 CM19A.... a couple apps, some drivers... and we'd have an
DIY X10 Hub.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 27, 2017, 12:10:04 PM
I like the TV boxes my self they don't seem to heat up as much(no battery) and can be found just as cheep. ;)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on January 27, 2017, 01:05:21 PM
I like the TV boxes my self they don't seem to heat up as much(no battery) and can be found just as cheep. ;)

That make good sense. I remove the batteries from my HA laptops.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 27, 2017, 01:10:53 PM
Battery removal on a laptop is much simpler I also removed my wife's laptop battery as she tends to leave it plugged in and always on.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on January 27, 2017, 01:31:17 PM
wait, why remove the battery? I find a battery backup that's built in and knows how to handle a power loss correctly without any setup or extra expense is a good thing.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 27, 2017, 01:43:32 PM
Many of the cheeper  or older laptops tablets continue to charge the battery even after fully charged this shortens battery life and in some cases will over heat and can cause a fire.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: toasterking on January 27, 2017, 02:16:16 PM
And now many laptops are coming with nonremovable batteries, or at least not-easily-removable batteries.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on January 27, 2017, 05:39:30 PM
And now many laptops are coming with nonremovable batteries, or at least not-easily-removable batteries.
Laptops?  I can't imagine that being acceptable to anyone.  I have replaced the battery on my personal laptop 2x and it needs another replacement.  I can't imagine requiring me to buy a new laptop after 1-2 years because the battery is glued in place.  I'd never have purchased that model I guess.

Many of the cheeper  or older laptops tablets continue to charge the battery even after fully charged this shortens battery life and in some cases will over heat and can cause a fire.
That's a problem with some rechargable batteries, but Is that really an issue with laptops?  My work laptop lives in a docking station and is plugged in constantly.  My home laptop is either in use (draining the battery typically) or plugged in and inside a desk cabinet.

Both machines are Dell (one tech level and one entry level).  Both are ~2-4 years old.  Obviously the battery quality is different between the two since I've yet to replace the work laptop's battery and it still seems to last a couple hours.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 27, 2017, 06:40:25 PM
Many of the cheeper  or older laptops tablets continue to charge the battery even after fully charged this shortens battery life and in some cases will over heat and can cause a fire.
That's a problem with some rechargable batteries, but Is that really an issue with laptops?  My work laptop lives in a docking station and is plugged in constantly.  My home laptop is either in use (draining the battery typically) or plugged in and inside a desk cabinet.
My wife's laptop battery lasted less then a year being constantly plugged in mine is over 4 years old and battery still lasts 4+ hours.
The desk gets very warm when I use my laptop plugged in. Not warm enough to burn but I certainly wouldn't place it in a closed cabinet charging. The cooling fan isn't doing much good if it is sucking in warm air.
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on March 03, 2017, 09:18:13 AM
Any news on the illusive WiFi module?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on March 03, 2017, 10:15:09 AM
Any news on the illusive WiFi module?
http://www.yourdictionary.com/illusive (http://www.yourdictionary.com/illusive):)% rofl >*< >! #:)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on March 03, 2017, 10:43:10 AM
I expect to hear something next week.
The manufacture has in the past shut down for the whole month February.
Unfortunately I'm not expecting any good news :(
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on March 04, 2017, 12:04:24 PM
Unfortunately I'm not expecting any good news :(
Well poo
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tucson on April 14, 2017, 11:50:51 AM
First I want to say thank you Tuicemen for all your hard work on the forums and restoring the software, this was a lifesaver.  That's said I guess I'm ready for an update even if it is bad news.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on April 14, 2017, 12:07:44 PM
The last I heard the manufacture was debugging with the latest software. B:(
I know Authinx had gone through several software developers which were holding things up. However I'm not sure if this is a new software from a new developer or just a stall tactic from the developer. :(
Authinx was promised a final production test unit a month ago which never materialized. B:(
I'll press the owner first of next week once again,  >*< however he has stated several times he would keep me in the loop.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on April 18, 2017, 12:19:34 PM
The latest news is there is some progress, though I was hoping for better news.
Seems the issue currently is the software syncing which currently takes 8-12 seconds to display status (devices, scenes, rooms).
They want this to be down around 3-5 sec and are reworking the protocol in order to achieve this.
Apparently that is about 80% there. ::) :'

Authinx's position is:
Quote
"unless we can have a decent user experience it is not worth releasing this"
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on April 18, 2017, 05:21:02 PM
80% complete in only 3 years?  So only 1 more year and they might release it!   B:(
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on April 18, 2017, 06:00:34 PM
 rofl if we're lucky! B:(
With the amount of time spent on the app and the number of developers they've gone threw I hope it is idiot proof if/when they release it!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: racerfern on April 18, 2017, 06:32:32 PM
What ever happened to "an EXCELLENT user experience"?

3-5 seconds to do what? Figure out a light is on or off and set some icon or instruction accordingly?

And it's being re-worked not tweaked?? Isn't that the same as starting from scratch?

At least I know that at the end of a busy day, I can always visit here for giggles and a grin.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: solareclipse on April 18, 2017, 09:01:15 PM
Any word on Alexa/Google Home integration?  I think if not, this thing is DOA.  If there's ever an A.  rofl
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on April 19, 2017, 02:03:14 AM
Any word on Alexa/Google Home integration?  I think if not, this thing is DOA.  If there's ever an A.  rofl

I love my Alexa! And... I was promoting the cloud... LONG before it was cool. There are however.... a lot of people who aren't welcoming to cloud/connected devices. I don't think X10 has gotten a lot of encouragement to become cloud based or Hub centric.

I myself have not yet read even ONE WORD... of an X10 server setup.

There isn't anything wrong with RF remotes, and interfaces for timers and a little memory for programs. And for a lot of people... a remote control light on a timers with a dimmer... is home automation. But I myself want much, much, more. There isn't any reason X10 can't supply both customer types.

But my HA setup... has a life of it's own. And it's either growing... or it's dying. And right now... my setup continues to grow. I really hope X10 comes up with something... before there isn't anything left I need... for X10 to create.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on April 19, 2017, 11:38:06 AM
Wait, I'm confused now.  Are they saying that the latency between commanding an action (light on) takes 8-12 seconds?  Or are they saying that it takes ~0.5 seconds to send the command and have it take affect, but another 7.5-11.5 seconds before an icon in the dashboard updates to say it did something?  If it's the latter, I guess I wouldn't care as much.  If it's the former, they lost all their business.   :'
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: solareclipse on April 19, 2017, 11:55:04 AM
I love my Alexa! And... I was promoting the cloud... LONG before it was cool. There are however.... a lot of people who aren't welcoming to cloud/connected devices. I don't think X10 has gotten a lot of encouragement to become cloud based or Hub centric.

I don't think beyond the bunch of us old-timers who are familiar with how this stuff used to work without being internet-enabled that any company could release a new HA product that isn't capable of voice integration, or more generically, interfacing with other platforms.  That's a real narrow worldview and while some might opt-out of using the internet connectivity (as many of us opted out of using AHP's server-based components) to not have that as a feature would be a product killer.  You can't measure up against the competition without those features.  I probably wouldn't buy it and I'm already heavily invested in X10.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on April 19, 2017, 12:13:57 PM
Any word on Alexa/Google Home integration?  I think if not, this thing is DOA.
Oooh I would not hold my breath on this. I believe for Alexa control all X10 WiFi modules would have to talk to a server at Authinx which then talks to the Alexa servers at Amazon (Tuicemen, help, I'm over my head). With all the trouble Authinx has had getting this out to the field I have a feeling by the time Alexa can interact with the WiFi module, your five year old will be an experienced brain surgeon. Of course this is pure speculation.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on April 19, 2017, 02:06:16 PM
Actually if this ever materializes anyone will be able to create a skill to use Alexa, Google voice or any future VR service with it.
There will be no need for a server at Authinx, Skills use the amazon servers
Authinx has stated that the protocol would be released freely for it.

Since you can now control X10 with Alexa with a number of softwares and bridges adding the new protocol will be as simple as a URL call.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on April 19, 2017, 03:31:35 PM
There will be no need for a server at Authinx, Skills use the amazon servers
So,  when I tell Alexa to open the curtains Homeseer servers are not in the loop? I guess this does make sense because if I want to run an "Event" (Homeseer macro) directly via Alexa, I must tell Alexa to tell Homeseer to run the event. However if I only want to turn on a table lamp I only need to tell Alexa to turn on the table lamp.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on April 19, 2017, 03:43:48 PM
I'm not sure exactly how the Homeseer skill works.
However I suspect Alexa just tells the Homeseer hub what event to do the only cloud activity is from Amazon servers.
My understanding of how Alexa works is:
Alexa to amazon servers to Homeseer skill which is on the Amazon servers to homeseer hub to x10 device.
Homeseer hub tells amazon server command was sent, server tells Alexa what to say.

If Amazons servers are down or your internet Alexa won't work.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: racerfern on April 19, 2017, 03:47:30 PM
Quote
There will be no need for a server at Authinx

I'm not so sure about this. When I enabled the Homeseer skill the first thing I had to do was log in to the Homeseer server. From there, I believe Alexa checks in occasionally to check for status, new devices, etc.

As I think and type (not a good thing to do I realize) Alexa cannot access my settings and devices on my PC. It has to go to the Homeseer servers. Maybe once it has learned a device, it can bypass the Homeseer server but one thing for sure, it initially goes to the server and it goes occasionally to check for changes.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on April 19, 2017, 04:51:07 PM
I'm waiting on this interface.
https://techcrunch.com/2017/04/19/facebook-brain-interface/ (https://techcrunch.com/2017/04/19/facebook-brain-interface/)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: racerfern on April 19, 2017, 05:41:30 PM
Quote
I'm waiting on this interface.
https://techcrunch.com/2017/04/19/facebook-brain-interface/

I see two strange scenarios:
1) It might be here before the X10 WiFi unit is introduced.
2) Since it's for people with brains, I wonder how much of a demand there will be? Perhaps there will be different skill level sets. Oh the potential.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on April 19, 2017, 07:13:21 PM
Quote
There will be no need for a server at Authinx

I'm not so sure about this. When I enabled the Homeseer skill the first thing I had to do was log in to the Homeseer server. From there, I believe Alexa checks in occasionally to check for status, new devices, etc.

As I think and type (not a good thing to do I realize) Alexa cannot access my settings and devices on my PC. It has to go to the Homeseer servers. Maybe once it has learned a device, it can bypass the Homeseer server but one thing for sure, it initially goes to the server and it goes occasionally to check for changes.
As I stated I'm unfamiliar with the HomeSeer skill but there should be no need fore a server at HomeSeer if your using a HomeSeer hub you should only need to log into it.

Alex10 uses a Philips hue hub emulator (HA-Bridge) it doesn't use a Philips hue server only Amazons.
Currently I don't need an Authinx server for X10 now so I won't need one with the Wi-Fi Module.
The original proto type I tested didn't use a Authinx server, calls were made direct to it.
I still use it at my cottage I doubt Authinx would keep a server running for just me.
I have WeMo devices and I don't need to log into a Berklin server to use those with Alexa only the skill and Amazons servers.

It should be noted that the manufacture is calling this x10 Wi-Fi unit a hub and not a module.

Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on April 19, 2017, 09:15:33 PM
..... When I enabled the Homeseer skill the first thing I had to do was log in to the Homeseer server. From there, I believe Alexa checks in occasionally to check for status, new devices, etc.

Yes. Besides the license(s) check-in..... Homeseer has servers with other available software and OF COURSE... the regular updates we've all become accustomed to.

I guess servers.... aren't an absolute necessity. Oh let's get serious.... a tech company without servers? One of the great things about X10 right now... is you can automate a entire home with little more than an old XP dust collector. No smart phones or even an internet connection is needed. That's pretty darn cool!

But for many of us.... attracted to this automation stuff like moths to flame.... we want more. We always want more.

The actual "idea" of what HA is has even changed and evolved. Heck.... I am old enough to remember when putting that 150 watt bulb in the ceiling fixture in the center of the room on a rheostat... was cool enough to show-off to company. And if you had a Zenith space command "clicker" (they actually clicked).... you were living in the Atomic age for sure.

I am in the middle of setting up a CM15A to a HomeSeer HomeTroller.... compliments of the generosity and kindness of racerfern. Thank you racerfern. I just hope I am smart enough to master another system. But I should soon have full remote (and voice) control of the X10 devices I choose. AND... the wink hub along with the HomeSeer interface along with Alexa.... should allow me control of just about any device I might want to add/buy.

I know, for me..... the smart voice-interaction with a Web of information and entertainment media... is essential for my HA setup. I even need it in my car. 

 

 
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on April 20, 2017, 04:19:46 PM

I am in the middle of setting up a CM15A to a HomeSeer HomeTroller.... compliments of the generosity and kindness of racerfernThank you racerfern.

I just hope I am smart enough to master another system. But I should soon have full remote (and voice) control of the X10 devices I choose. AND... the wink hub along with the HomeSeer interface along with Alexa.... should allow me control of just about any device I might want to add/buy.

Well (thanks again racerfern.... I now have HomeSeer running with a CM15A. AWESOME! Of course.... it also was/is fully discoverable and functional with my Alexa DOT. So I've selected a few lights (particularly for the all lights ON function) and I think all the first floor lights. Most importantly.... I was able to integrate the "goodnight" macro trigger. It turns a small lamp ON... waits 3 minutes... then turns it off.  Makes it easier to shuffle off to the bedroom without a stubbed toe. All with a simple voice command (or two).

I still have remotes (old fashion palmpads) in the theater. And I plan to keep them too. Movies are too loud/noisy for voice control. But today.... I removed my last X10 remote from the living area.
 
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on April 20, 2017, 04:30:58 PM
Oh yeah.... HomeSeer is every bit as user friendly as X10. My experience with X10... the CM11A, the CM15A, along with the various software (including BVC). Mixed with my training and years of experience as a Network admin... really made setting up the Hometroller with a CM15A for X10 a snap.

I called their tech support team... and Taylor walked me through setup in no time.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: racerfern on April 20, 2017, 06:21:29 PM
@HA Dave, I'm glad you're enjoying your new electronic toy. You're the first person I "know" that has a zwave controller and no zwave devices. Who woulda thunk.

I haven't done much with Alexa since I really don't like Alexa. She's not very smart. So I'm saving up for Google Home since Homeseer works with the dedicated version now, hopefully soon it will work with the simpler version.

Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on April 20, 2017, 11:36:08 PM
....... You're the first person I "know" that has a zwave controller and no zwave devices. Who woulda thunk.

True... no zwave in the house... yet. But with both Homeseer (and it's ability to run X10 via a CM15A) and the WINK Hub.... I can run most flavors and brands of devices. Adding a Samsung Hub... could ensure complete compatibility

Looking (and reading) things over at the Homeseer forums... I am considering still running an old laptop connected to a CM15A and running BVC. I miss my Kate (Kate 16bit voice).

I haven't done much with Alexa since I really don't like Alexa. She's not very smart. So I'm saving up for Google Home since Homeseer works with the dedicated version now, hopefully soon it will work with the simpler version.

Google is a much smarter device! And much more conversational. But Alexa does have more skills. I tend to lean on Siri when I need real information. It's all a grab bag.

I am so happy with how well Alexa is working with (Homeseer) my old X10 stuff and the new stuff too.

The wife suggested an emergency lights command (emergency lights ON) which lights up everything. And now she thing an echo for her would be nice (maybe in-around the kitchen-dining-office area). This is real WAF.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: racerfern on April 21, 2017, 08:18:03 AM
Quote
This is real WAF.

And therein lies the most important consideration.

I had two manual dimmer switches in the LR that I changed out for Zwave dimmers. I had them in for about a month and WAF went down because the switches were hard to fine tune to her perfect lighting needs. Agreed. So I put the manual switches back in. It took about two hours for the request to put back the zwave switches because the manual ones had a cheap look and feel. Besides, she had to get up and manually adjust the lights.

What I really wanted to install was http://qubino.com/products/flush-dimmer/ because I can program the ramp rate up and down and minimum/maximum dim levels. But then I can't have a manual dimmer connected to it, just an on/off. I'm still searching for the solution to achieve total WAF.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on April 21, 2017, 11:35:30 AM
Yep.... pleasing the wife is always my number one.... secondary goal  :).

I grew-up with dimmers. Back in the 50's Dad stuck rheostats on most the ceiling lights. I never learned to appreciate light dimming. I have always opted to use things like indirect or back-wash lighting. Then I mix in good task lights.

The new LED low wattage lights have really been good for my lighting preferences. I can wash the walls with a couple of 4 watt LEDs and use one 8 watt LED bulb in a table light by my chair. So the room doesn't feel like a dark cave... I can read/see everything... and no washout of the TV (it still runs in low-power mode).

 
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on April 22, 2017, 12:23:31 PM
I see two strange scenarios:
1) It might be here before the X10 WiFi unit is introduced.
rofl
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Knightrider on June 03, 2017, 12:42:57 PM
bump this as i await impatiently.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on June 03, 2017, 10:20:15 PM
bump this as i await impatiently.

After I installed racerfern's old zwave hometroller....... I spoke with our friend Bill on the phone. As the hometroller is little more than a Raspberry Pi device (with cloud connectivity and software)..... I had some ideas

The bad thing about serious HA users (with YOU being the most serious one I know of)... is the investment in the setup. I've found it emotionally impossible to turn my back on X10. But the Zwave unit allows me to continue to... not just use... but integrate my X10 setup with new components and products.

I've lost NOTHING. And my setup has grown and improved. I am mixing brands, and flavors of HA. And they work fine together. 
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on June 04, 2017, 08:16:32 AM
bump this as i await impatiently.
There are few of us diehards left still waiting and hoping with fingers and toes crossed. ::) :'
Authinx has been in a battle over quality and performance not just with the module but the software as well :(
I believe the biggest issue being the software developers as they went threw several.
The last I heard was there was a issue with syncing the module status with the app.
In less the developer had two way devices this wasn't possible I stated.
I suggested they implement the same technique AHP use in that it reported the last signal sent and just attempt to poll for two way devices.
This idea was apparently forwarded to the developer and I'm told that helped (thought not sure what that means).

The last I heard as of Friday June 2nd Authinix had just received a new version of the module and was to run the new software over the week.
Usually I'm skeptical of in house testing but thus far it has stopped the x10 junk flow (at least in my opinion of the new devices)
I expect to hear results of the testing by weeks end.

I realize many have started to move away from X10 with newer Wi-Fi enabled devices.
And this is only my thinking, but the new Wi-Fi module( if it materializes) should be able to control these as well.
This will require some additions to the software I suspect but it is doable.
 >!

Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Knightrider on June 04, 2017, 08:33:50 AM
Yeah, I'm looking long and hard at wifi modules. May set up a separate router for device control. Philips Hue is where I'm going for lighting.
It's like my DJ business.  I started out spinning vinyl. Skipped case the and went straight to CD thinking it would be the next 50 year standard. Cheap digital storage trumped that.
I have no desire to jump on zwave or instead or whatever flavor. I'm betting wifi will be the next 30 year standard of HA.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: solareclipse on June 04, 2017, 08:45:43 AM
I'm up to 8 Hue lights (7 color bulbs and 1 Hue Go as an accent light).  I haven't pulled out any of my X10 stuff yet, but I'm not investing any more in it.  Still waiting to see if this new Wifi module ever sees the light of day, because I'd love to integrate it into my Google Home voice commands.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on June 04, 2017, 08:59:44 AM
I've implemented several Wi-Fi modules into my setup thus far.
Some are about as reliable as the old x10 stick a switches (which I never had much success with)
Others like the Sonoff modules from iTead (though their cloud based software was garbage) worked flawless.
I never jumped on the Philps hue band wagon and it is doubtful I ever will.
However I have moved to all LED lighting.
With devices like Amazons (echo, tap, & Dots) and Google home gaining popularity, Wi-Fi control is set to be the go to protocol. Several of the HA protocols have brought out Hubs (mini pcs) to allow this.
For those that haven't yet, luckily there is software that can make this happen ;)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on June 04, 2017, 12:40:57 PM
...... Philips Hue is where I'm going for lighting.
..... I'm betting wifi will be the next 30 year standard of HA.

Philips Hue has a hub and works with Alexa! I went with Cree [wifi lights] and added a Link brand hub. I am also using Chamberlain hub/interface and ihome control devices (through the links hub) for Alexa use... and direct control via my iPhone (and Siri). Everything seems very friendly... and willing to work together.

Your more of a gambler than myself. I am amazed all the Wifi remains backwards compatible after all these years. Here in the city... the bandwidth allowed for wifi... seems a bit crowded. Wasn't the idea of going digital with TV supposed to free-up VHF for broadband use?

I don't know what changes will take place in the coming years. The more I've read lately about the make-up of atoms... implies that the nucleus may be made of light.... which has no mass. And how (in heavens name) can we get mass for nothing? Which might mean this entire world of automation (and even this forum).... is merely a expression of our imagination. Which by the way..... could explain my tag line.

I am going to go with the flow. And use whatever I can to accomplish whatever I can dream-up to do. Maybe after all... there really is no spoon [matrix quote].

BTW.... I am not using Zwave. I am merely using their Internet control device and software to make my X10 compatible with cloud control and Alexa.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: BackAgain on June 05, 2017, 09:14:06 AM
Jumping in at the end here without really reading much.  I will NOT use any device that requires a centralized hub somewhere on the web.  Ain't a'gonna happen.

I would however be interested in something that uses an in-house hub and can be controlled by a PC, remote or other gadget.  I'm not at all interested in controlling anything while away from home since I very rarely am away from home.  Cost considerations are paramount though.  What I've seen so far is far too expensive for the payback.  I can use a CFL bulb and switch for a very long time as compared to a 'smart' LED bulb.  I have switched to dumb LEDs as I find them on sale for a couple of dollars.  But then there is the issue of compatible timers, photocells and dimmers.

A question I've never been able to get a real answer to .... how susceptible are 'smart' LED units to power surges and lightning strikes?  Blowing out a houseful of $20+ units could get rather expensive.

 
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on June 05, 2017, 09:31:36 AM
A question I've never been able to get a real answer to .... how susceptible are 'smart' LED units to power surges and lightning strikes?  Blowing out a houseful of $20+ units could get rather expensive.

Good question. As my LEDs are dumb, like me, I cannot answer but others here might have relevant experience.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on June 05, 2017, 11:58:01 PM
..... I will NOT use any device that requires a centralized hub somewhere on the web.  Ain't a'gonna happen.

Almost everything.... including access to this forum... requires a centralized hub somewhere on the web.

I would however be interested in something that uses an in-house hub and can be controlled by a PC, remote or other gadget.  I'm not at all interested in controlling anything while away from home

A lot of people have (or feel) a need to control lights using a remote control. The Clapper (https://youtu.be/3lBWjLJeKkQ) is one way (I own a clapper myself). There are many simple similar remote controlled devices sold in big box retail stores everywhere. They work great.

Many of the old left-overs here (like myself) prefer smart devices that aid in their own control... to benefit me and my life. The LAST thing I need is another device to control/operate.

I prefer my smart [centralized hub] to know when the garage door is opening after the sun has set.... so it can turn lights ON... so no one has to enter a dark home.

Cost considerations are paramount though.  What I've seen so far is far too expensive for the payback.

For the most part.... Home Automation is a luxury. Any "payback"... would be in convenience and safety in most cases. It might be cheaper (in actual nickels and dimes) to just leave a 5 watt LED burn 24/7.... than to mess with any switching and regulation.

A question I've never been able to get a real answer to .... how susceptible are 'smart' LED units to power surges and lightning strikes? 

Are you kidding? An average bolt of lightning, striking from cloud to ground, contains roughly one billion (1,000,000,000) joules of energy. This is no small amount. One backyard lighting strike.... could take your life, start a fire, or break every electrical device in your home. Or more likely.... only make a big noise.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on June 06, 2017, 02:38:51 AM
I'm not an EE, but I have worked with lightening testing in the past.  A direct attachment would render almost anything broken.  An idirect/induced voltage is likely to break most electronics. If you are worried about it, disconnect it or at least turn it off during a storm.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on June 06, 2017, 07:40:29 PM
..... A direct attachment would render almost anything broken.......... If you are worried about it, disconnect it or at least turn it off during a storm.

Yep. We know the risks and we take our chances. My experiences with smart devices is more than a decade. And I was an early adopter of both the CFL and LEDS. I've only had... ONE smart (Wifi) LED lightbulb (so far)... and been using it since maybe December.

Smart devices, CFL's, and LEDs all seem to last a few, or several years... IMHO and experience.

The only problem with "smart" devices are they are NOT plug-n-play. They require a little setup time. And... I don't stock extra smart (Wifi) bulbs like [I did] incandescent bulbs (in the ole days).
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on June 07, 2017, 11:30:34 AM
The only problem with "smart" devices are they are NOT plug-n-play. They require a little setup time. And... I don't stock extra smart (Wifi) bulbs like [I did] incandescent bulbs (in the ole days).

IMO, there are a few more problems, but that's another story.  I haven't used LED bulbs yet, but CFL don't last anywhere near as long as the package indicates.  They start to get pink and dim over time.  They flicker or don't start up as quickly when they get old too.  If I had the chance to get a CFL with HA built in, I WOULD NOT.  I would personally rather have the device control a dumb cheap bulb rather than tying the expensive part to a cheap component that should be considered replaceable.

I have 12v usb car chargers that have failed several times.  The reason they fail is the spring (which may be intended to act as a fuse since there isn't a replaceable one in the tip).  The tip no longer makes contact with the +12v and thus the whole thing is garbage over a $0.05 spring.  I paid $10/ea and can't find a replacement spring so the whole thing has to be dumped.  If some similar cheap component in an X10 device fails, I might be able to fix it (maybe).  If something in a HA bulb fails, it's garbage.  Just my opinion though.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on June 07, 2017, 12:27:29 PM
I wouldn't advocate smart bulbs. I've had dimmable Cree LEDs for a few years and all work well with X10 modules. It would be simple and extremely cost efficient for Authinx to add an ESP8266 WiFi chip to each of their modules and switches while retaining PLC. Tuicemen can speak to both the low cost and relative simplicity (once you navigate the learning curve).
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on June 08, 2017, 08:46:45 AM
Smart bulbs may be useful in some cases.
I experimented with several Mylight LED bulbs, both color and white, all now sit in their original boxes.
The idea with LED bulbs is energy consumption adding wi-fi to each bulb increases that.
Also using a network address for a simple light didn't make sense.

The  ESP8266 WiFi chip dhouston speaks of are very small. The Sonoff modules itead sells uses these and you can use those much like x10 lamp or appliance modules for under $10 each.
The chip its self uses 5 volts and itead has a low voltage module which runs on 5-24 volts so your not just limited to 110 volts for HA.
the itead software though is garbage and is limited to the cloud. Fortunately you can easily flash the ESP8266 chip so you can control thee modules locally without the cloud.

Although adding these to x10 modules is feasible I still prefer a hub which Authinx is working on (the Wi-Fi module).
I've read complaints that 256 x10 addresses weren't enough for some. ::) :'
With Wi-Fi your limited to 254 and less depending on how many laptops, PCs, phones,cameras ... are already configured on your network.
Plus adding the Wi-Fi chip to a module would cause each module to use even more power (sure it wouldn't be much but it adds up)
Adding a Wi-Fi/x10 combo module to the product line would be a better option then adding the chip to all modules (in my opinion)
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on June 08, 2017, 09:00:40 AM
Techically, you are limited to 254 devices if you choose to stick with a single router. If you add another router, you add up to 254 each.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on June 08, 2017, 10:05:17 AM
Techically, you are limited to 254 devices if you choose to stick with a single router. If you add another router, you add up to 254 each.
True but many have a difficult time with just one router. ::) :'
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on June 08, 2017, 02:53:04 PM
.....

I haven't used LED bulbs yet, but CFL don't last anywhere near as long as the package indicates.  They start to get pink and dim over time.  They flicker or don't start up as quickly when they get old too.  If I had the chance to get a CFL with HA built in, I WOULD NOT.

I agree! The CFL's were a huge disappointment. I still have a few CFL's in service but I am merely letting the price of their LED replacements fall while I wait for the CFL to fail.

Quote from: bkenobi link=topic=28628.msg168823#msg168823 date=1496849434If
some..... cheap component in an X10 device fails, I might be able to fix it (maybe).  If something in a HA bulb fails, it's garbage.  Just my opinion though.

Opinion or not... it's true! Lightbulbs are consumables. I stock lightbulbs to replace the ones that burn out.... just like I stock battery's for flashlights. But..... I haven't bought any smart LED light bulbs just to set in there package and wait.... yet.

I could add a near endless list of items/materials/consumables that I stock here at home or regularly buy at various stores. I am a consumer like nearly everyone else. I buy stuff. Some things I buy over and over again.

When I placed my 1st X10 order.... it was for my Home Theater.... I bought three diming light switches and a Palmpad remote control. I told my wife that would be all the parts/pieces I would need to add a "wow factor" (as well as convenience) to my Theater. When the parts arrived.... I soon realized I needed a (TM751) Transceiver to get the Palmpad signal to my powerline. After I ordered the TM751... I realized what I really needed was to order a CM11 (which I did). And so on... and so forth.

If no one else on this forum considers themselves as consumers of HA products.... I know I am.

But... like bkenobi I also fix and repair what I can when I can. I fixed my gasoline powered pressure washer this spring. I ordered a $20 part (uploader valve) online (Amazon) and fixed the thing myself.

I wouldn't advocate smart bulbs. I've had dimmable Cree LEDs for a few years and all work well with X10 modules........

My smart (Wifi) LED (I only have one) is a Cree. My other (dumb?) LEDs are cheaper. I am so-far happy with LED's. I'll admit my intro into smart bulbs was a bit of an experiment.... trying BOTH the wifi bulb and my Link Hub. But all is working fine.

But everyone is right. Sooner or later.... I'll throw that $14 smart bulb in the trash... and stop at Home Depot and get a new one. Or maybe order it on-line... whatever. But yes.... it is now and always has been cheaper to manually operate my lights. And deciding to "automate" was also a decision to become a consumer of HA products.

Everything.... comes at a price.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on June 08, 2017, 03:46:16 PM
It's really just a question of what part is the consumable. I don't think of HA as a consumable. I do consider bulbs, batteries, etc as consumables. Just like you don't the low away a lamp because the bulb burns out, I don't personally want to throw out a HA controller for the same reason.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on June 08, 2017, 11:50:10 PM
It's really just a question of what part is the consumable. I don't think of HA as a consumable. I do consider bulbs, batteries, etc as consumables. Just like you don't the low away a lamp because the bulb burns out, I don't personally want to throw out a HA controller for the same reason.

Actually... I have thrown away lamps. Once... I even took an old beater (automobile) I had been driving to a scrap yard... and sold it for it's metal value. They let me remove and keep it's battery.

I've owned a lot of cars since I started driving in 1968.... I'll bet most of them have been scraped... or thrown away. And cars are definitely hard goods (aka durable goods). Cheap electronics (HA products) don't meet that description.

From time-to-time I like to restore an old, classic, steel, bicycle. It's an enjoyable hobby. I like to think of myself as being very green and conservative steward of resources. I don't believe the big old clunky soldered together large-parts electronics were any less of a consumable than todays integrated micro-circuitry. Just MHO.



Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on June 09, 2017, 02:09:45 AM
I understand all that. My dad restored old cars that most would have crushed. My point is more that a light switch lasts as long as the user wants to keep it. A light bulb lasts a year. I wouldn't consider it acceptable to link the wall switch longevity to the filament. However, that's effectively what smart bulbs do. And yes, I understand that LED purportedly last 50 years. Maybe, but WiFi won't be around that long and so I wouldn't want WiFi as my primary means to operate the bulb. Maybe I'm just approaching geezer prematurely. Now, GET OFF MY LAWN!  ;)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on June 09, 2017, 08:46:13 AM
One advantage of WiFi is that many smartwatches include WiFi and can function as WiFi Remotes to send commands. Some of these watches can handle voice commands (OK Google) which might further simplify interacting with ones HA system.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on June 09, 2017, 05:08:27 PM
One advantage of WiFi is that many smartwatches include WiFi and can function as WiFi Remotes to send commands. Some of these watches can handle voice commands (OK Google) which might further simplify interacting with ones HA system.
Yep, I have a Motorola 360 II that connects Bluetooth to phone and Wifi to home router. But is now continually disconnecting from Bluetooth watch, since the recent Android Wear update. Nothing is ever smooth. As I have said before, this techno stuff is only temporary. It will all go away in a few years.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on June 09, 2017, 06:39:55 PM
..... I wouldn't consider it acceptable to link the wall switch longevity to the filament. However, that's effectively what smart bulbs do. And yes, I understand that LED purportedly last 50 years. Maybe, but WiFi won't be around that long and so I wouldn't want WiFi as my primary means to operate the bulb. Maybe I'm just approaching geezer prematurely. Now, GET OFF MY LAWN!  ;)

 rofl

I am well into geezer age. But professionally it was important for me to understand paradigms.... and actively dismantle them in my own environment. I myself found it difficult at first.... I took a couple classes and was dating a psychologist at the time... who was very helpful. But then when I finally came around... I found it enormously liberating.

You are right! As we age we create preconceived concepts, basic assumptions, ways of thinking, and methodologies AKA: Paradigms that form the way things must/should be..... in our own minds. In reality this hinders us. Our paradigms stifle our creativity and dwarf a lifetime of learning. Professionally our paradigms make our best and most experienced people... become obsolete.

Some of these Wifi LED bulbs are as cheap now as $8 on-line. The least I ever paid for a socket rocket was $5 (4 for $20... with a $50 order). And socket rockets usually went when the bulb burned out. Not much has really changed.     
 
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on June 13, 2017, 02:50:21 PM
I just got back word on the in house testing of the new Wi-Fi module.
The word is the testing is going well even better then expected.
Currently there is a issue where if connected and another user logs in it will boot the first user.
This is a issue I had experienced testing something else (thought exactly what slips my mind).
In that case it was a simple software code adjustment to allow multi users.
I'm not sure if many users would want the app on multi phones. ::) :' (enabling duelling x10 control  rofl )

So it sounds like the hardware is working up to par and just the software needs tweaking. :)%
Software tweaking is never done so I don't feel this is a game stopper.
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on June 13, 2017, 03:18:19 PM
..... testing of the new Wi-Fi module........it sounds like the hardware is working up to par and just the software needs tweaking. :)%

They should expect needed fixes and required updates AFTER the introduction... anyway. Here's to hoping they release SOON... and update frequently.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on June 13, 2017, 03:19:12 PM
P.S. I think many would be willing to pay for a chance to beta-test.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on June 13, 2017, 03:22:58 PM
 rofl I agree with you!
And I'll mention the beta testers option As the more initial eyes on it the better.
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: m82a1pa on June 13, 2017, 04:13:47 PM
I'm in, if it becomes an available option.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on June 13, 2017, 04:39:19 PM
The test unit they have was hand assembled and they are attempting to get another unit built for testing.
Once it is proven ready for manufacturing there will be a first run which I'm trying to get for beta testers.
However depending on the size of the first run we may all be beta testers. rofl
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: racerfern on June 19, 2017, 05:53:48 PM
So what does this have to do with the new Wifi unit? Is there a module that will connect to this mother ship?

https://www.thehomeautomationstore.com/wijit.html

And why is it not on the x10 website, as both websites are Authinx?

Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on June 19, 2017, 05:57:04 PM
I'm unclear how the fidget spinner will incorporate into an HA setup.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: racerfern on June 19, 2017, 05:59:06 PM
I'm unclear how the fidget spinner will incorporate into an HA setup.
I can't think of a serious thing to say. :)%
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on June 19, 2017, 07:25:41 PM
From what I understand several things were developed while they worked on the wi-fi module (x10 Hub).
A one way none x10 Wi-Fi module and hub were created.
This is a one way Wi-Fi module and isn't x10 compatible a sample unit is being sent me but I'm unsure if this is the device racerfern links to.
I should have the shipment tomorrow some time so I'll post then with more info.

Authinx was a bit concerned about releasing this as the price is more then many two way Wi-Fi modules currently flooding the market.
The fidget according to the web page is for fiddling, a kids toy, or to remove stress
( perhaps so you forget about your HA problems  :( )
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on June 19, 2017, 10:33:27 PM
So what does this have to do with the new Wifi unit?
https://www.thehomeautomationstore.com/wijit.html
....  both websites are Authinx?

This could be genius. For MOST households.... a Hub that interconnects three plugs with an iPhone..... this might be all they ever need. AND.... if it was made compatible with googles and amazons devices with a $29 price point.... everyone might try these.

Meanwhile.... if the same hub could be amazon and google hub compatible.... PLUS send X10 PLC's every X10 out here would try a $29 (or $39) set of 3 with a hub.   
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on June 20, 2017, 08:50:12 AM
I've asked for some more details on these new Wijit Wi-Fi modules as originally I wasn't given much info.

These aren't capable of sending or receiving X10 nor is the Wijit Hub.
The site states "Wijit is it's own technology ...."

Since the Wijit hub is connected via Wi-Fi it is conceivable someone could create an Alexa skill (thought there may already be one in the works)
It may be possible that the X10 Wi-Fi hub could send signals to the Wijit hub in the future though that is a presumption on my part.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: solareclipse on June 20, 2017, 09:16:46 AM
Hah...  I got the Wijit email and didn't realize it was Authinx.  Thought I'd come here to see if anyone was talking about it.

Getting the price down is a good goal for wider adoption, but I'm not sure one-way is the way to do it.  The expectation is already set that if you have wifi devices with app control that works outside of the house, you're going to be able to tell if the thing is on or off (otherwise, what's the point of the app working when you're not home?).

A little laugh from their Amazon description that pokes fun at their other product line:  "With Wijit, you control your plugins via our free APP from any WiFi enabled device (no cheap plastic RF remote that is easily lost)! "
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on June 20, 2017, 02:51:58 PM
My wijit shipment  has been delayed with a post office addressing issue. ??? ::) :'
In order to avoid confusion I started a new thread for them:
http://forums.x10.com/index.php?topic=29837.0
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Knightrider on August 15, 2017, 12:46:47 AM
July........August..... we are soon to say goodbye to the summer. Any word on the new unit?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on August 15, 2017, 07:15:36 AM
Seems every time I say it is close to a release something happens.
As you know the manufacture created the wijits which Authinx is distributing. They nor I had any input into these.
Having now given the opportunity to try them I asked if the same software developer was working on the X10 App.(it is) :(
the wijit app is terrible and needs lots of work. (The wijit hardware works)
Since the x10 module depends on the app to discover issues I was concerned the original x10 app(created by another developer) was light years better then the wijit app
If the manufacture would simply release the protocol issues would be easily found( maybe) ::) :'
At least we wouldn't have to wait for an app to find something.

I'm still trying to get a peak at things, word is the app is what is holding things up.
In my dealings with other manufactures from China that use apps for their products, these seem to take forever to get the simplest options coded.

I've been asked to supply more info about AHP and the cm15 so this may indeed be a complex unit & app. ::) :'
I know it was to have much more memory then the cm15 however not having RF will limit its abilities.
If the app reveals a major hardware flaw we may be looking at an even longer delay. B:(

Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Knightrider on August 15, 2017, 09:56:46 AM
I started cleaning out old hard drives of long  lost computers. In my days of dial-up Internet (late 2000s), I would get visual studio as an .iso file, burn image to cd, then install. I used a download manager to do this.
So far, I found an image for visual studio 2013 (I think) and 2006.
Still looking for that elusive 2003, but I might just have it.
Haven't tried these on anything yet, but if they might help, I could send them.
I will keep looking in my spare time, which isn't much.
Does anyone have the uncompiled c++ AHP project, or is that a closely guarded secret?
I know my kung fu is rusty, but after harvest, I may want to look at it.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on August 16, 2017, 03:56:43 PM
I actually have all the C++ code for AHP and a few other x10 programs that Authinx was able to scrap together.
I also was able to get a visual studio 2005 hoping to put something together but with the number of programmers X10WTI went through you need a road map to figure things out.
Some of the code relies on old obsolete Windows drivers B:(


Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: solareclipse on October 06, 2017, 01:02:38 PM
Time for the monthly quarterly  >*< update
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on October 06, 2017, 04:25:47 PM
Perhaps the name of the thread should be renamed.  I think calling this the "New" x10 Wi-Fi unit is a little misleading.  It's not a new product nor a new concept.  It is currently vaporware though!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Knightrider on October 06, 2017, 07:17:38 PM
I first caught wind of this in December of 2013, I think.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on October 06, 2017, 10:56:04 PM
Sometimes the best and fastest approach is to trash everything.... and start over.

Most of us here have tons of X10 products that we'd never want to think of as obsolete. I continue to use my BVC for voice announcements (even though Alexa is my current cyber-squeeze)... so of course I still use AHP. Actually the CM15A is still an impressive device IMHO.

But my HomeSeer (Arduino) makes my X10 work flawlessly with Alexa, or remote from my phone. A similarly created Arduino device/controller could easily replace the CM15A, PC, other Hubs.... everything. And could be sold at a great profit for likely less than $100.

Why on Earth would anyone screw around with a Chinese parts manufacture for a "specialized X10 device".... when this is a workable option? 
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on October 08, 2017, 03:32:47 PM
Time for the monthly quarterly  >*< update
:(
Sadly I don't have much more news the app is the hold up and when the manufacture contracted this out apparently they weren't clear on who would own the code.

I have requested some things be added to the last app design I seen which was as bad as the Wijit app.
This may have added to a delay but I feel the x10 app is useless with out knowing the last command sent if closing the app then reopening. And although Authinix currently doesn't sell two way devices that doesn't mean users don't have them.
I also requested the ability for the hub to be able to send web requests which would mean you could possible talk to other hubs or IP cameras among other things.
Extended command options were also missing which I stated was required though the manufacture stated nothing used them until I pointed out several.
I'm told these requests were doable and would be in place (hopefully for release)
 
I've requested several times a protocol or at least a list of what the hub is capable of to no avail.
Waiting for an app to test the hardware is a slow and in needed step(what if it reveals a major flaw in the hardware) B:(

Hopefully we'll see something before Christmas 2017 ::) :'
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: JeffVolp on October 08, 2017, 09:30:46 PM
Extended command options were also missing which I stated was required though the manufacture stated nothing used them until I pointed out several.

Not supporting extended commands would rule it out for us as we have Leviton wall switches that use extended commands.  I ruled out the JDS Home Runner RBI as a possible replacement for our Ocelot for the same reason.

Jeff
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Brian H on October 09, 2017, 06:48:16 AM
The not supporting Extended X10 Commands is scary.
The present owner of the X10 line. Don't even know their own products.
The Soft Start LM465 comes to mind as using Extended X10 commands and why the latest AHP has two modules lists for dimmers.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on October 09, 2017, 07:48:25 AM
>*< They could have simply added a $2.40 (retail) ESP8266 to the CM15A and have PLC send/receive, X10 RF send/receive, and WiFi send/receive in one universal controller.
http://www.electrodragon.com/product/esp-01-esp8266-wifi-module/ (http://www.electrodragon.com/product/esp-01-esp8266-wifi-module/)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on October 09, 2017, 09:09:58 AM
Not supporting extended commands would rule it out for us as we have Leviton wall switches that use extended commands.
The Soft Start LM465 comes to mind as using Extended X10 commands and why the latest AHP has two modules lists for dimmers.
Exactly what I pointed out.

>*< They could have simply added a $2.40 (retail) ESP8266 to the CM15A and have PLC send/receive, X10 RF send/receive, and WiFi send/receive in one universal controller.
http://www.electrodragon.com/product/esp-01-esp8266-wifi-module/ (http://www.electrodragon.com/product/esp-01-esp8266-wifi-module/)
Very true however no one knows the inner workings of the CM15 nor the code that is left at the manufacturing plant.
This doesn't mean it still can't be done.
Authinx is already considering an advanced version something like the cm11 and cm15 depending on how well this may do. ::) :'
However I doubt I'll ever see that.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on October 09, 2017, 09:20:20 AM
Authinx is already considering an advanced version something like the cm11 and cm15 depending on how well this may do. ::) :'
However I doubt I'll ever see that.
Any grandkids?  :'
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on October 09, 2017, 10:44:47 AM
 rofl
At the rate this is developing it will be my great grand kids that see the advanced version. :-[
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: beelocks on October 09, 2017, 06:54:49 PM
The basic version has been 4 years coming and still nary an appearance.
By the time the advanced version shows its head I expect humankind will have developed a reliable source of telekinesis, fossil fuels will be a thing of the past or dinosaurs will roam the Earth once more; If any of those things happen then there will be no need to have a computerised widget turn the lights on.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: JeffVolp on October 09, 2017, 11:36:52 PM
The basic version has been 4 years coming and still nary an appearance.

Back at the lab 4 to 6 months was typical for a development project like this with several people working on it.

Jeff
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on October 09, 2017, 11:53:25 PM
Maybe we just need some one(s) from here at the forums to create a mini-pc or Arduino plug-in/software solution....

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Arduino+X10+controller
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on October 10, 2017, 07:06:19 AM
Maybe we just need some one(s) from here at the forums to create a mini-pc or Arduino plug-in/software solution....

The $35 Raspberry Pi 3 would be a better (solder-free) choice since it includes WiFi and Bluetooth. Adding RF I/O would be fairly simple but the problem is PLC. Interfacing with the CM15A is difficult at the DIY level - a license for the MCU used in the CM15A was in the thousands range when I looked into it several years back. The CM11A with its serial interface and free API is one choice but pairing the RPi3 with WiFi I/O and Jeff's XTB-232 would be the ultimate solution.
https://www.raspberrypi.org/products/raspberry-pi-3-model-b/ (https://www.raspberrypi.org/products/raspberry-pi-3-model-b/)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on October 10, 2017, 08:20:59 AM
Maybe we just need some one(s) from here at the forums to create a mini-pc or Arduino plug-in/software solution....

The $35 Raspberry Pi 3 would be a better (solder-free) choice since it includes WiFi and Bluetooth. ...... Interfacing with the CM15A is difficult at the DIY level

Apparently Homeseer figured it out... with a DL that is only a few kb's. And a CM15A plugs right into one of the units 4 USB ports. Unfortunately it isn't setup to use a CM19A... which would be a better fit for the simplicity of the setup.   

My only complaint is the Raspberry Pi... isn't being exploited to even close to its potential. I run a 2nd CM15A off a laptop... but with the right software I could do everything with the Raspberry Pi.... or maybe a mini-pc unit.. either way.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on October 10, 2017, 08:42:26 AM
Maybe we just need some one(s) from here at the forums to create a mini-pc or Arduino plug-in/software solution....

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Arduino+X10+controller
Several already have created a mini-pc or Arduino plug-in/software solutions.
However the masses aren't looking for DIY solutions, they want something simple (plug & Play).

HA-Bridge is a good example of a multi platform software solution which many run on a Raspberry Pi.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: racerfern on October 10, 2017, 09:07:31 AM
Quote
HA-Bridge is a good example of a multi platform software solution which many run on a Raspberry Pi.

IMO, at minimum, this is geek stuff, at the extreme it's for dedicated coders.

This is where AHP clearly was a cut above the rest. It was relatively easy to create macros and maintain an increasingly complicated system. This is also where HomeSeer took that approach and improved it. The HomeSeer events are substantially more involved than AHP stuff, yet still relatively easy to understand and create.

Everything else I've seen pretty much requires a coding degree and/or is painfully complicated. The java based apps are impossibly slow for me. Obviously, there are a bunch of systems I've never tried so there may be something else out there but I doubt there is something with the simplicity and power of the defunct AHP software or the current HomeSeer software. Certainly, most of these other systems are not at all intuitive and that's the key to having a system that's easy to use and understand.

HomeSeer supports X10 but IMO the only reason they support X10 is to get X10 users to embrace their technology, which is slowly happening. There is a very active X10 base of users on the HomeSeer forum and they're not waiting for some Wi-Fi unit, they've moved on.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on October 10, 2017, 09:27:21 AM
HomeSeer supports X10 but IMO the only reason they support X10 is to get X10 users to embrace their technology, which is slowly happening. There is a very active X10 base of users on the HomeSeer forum and they're not waiting for some Wi-Fi unit, they've moved on.
Unfortunately Homeseer assumed X10 was dead. X10 protocol gets no support from Homeseer at all. They have washed their hands of X10, even though when Homeseer first came out, X10 was the only remote control game around. Currently one volunteer is trying to keep the X10 plug-in functional, but it has problems (biggest problem is: once an X10 device is created it is set in stone. In most cases you can not go back and change device parameters, you have to create a new device). Most sad.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: racerfern on October 10, 2017, 09:41:15 AM
If that's the biggest problem,  that's not so bad. However on my homeseer / X10 system I can change some of the parameters including the address and the type of device.

Maybe homeseer thought that the x10 user base would jump ship to Z-Wave and they wouldn't have to support X10 and that was a mistake.

Homeseer with mediocre X10 support is still better than a nearly crippled AHP.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on October 10, 2017, 10:43:43 AM
Quote
HA-Bridge is a good example of a multi platform software solution which many run on a Raspberry Pi.

IMO, at minimum, this is geek stuff, at the extreme it's for dedicated coders.
Exactly my point.
However the masses aren't looking for DIY solutions, they want something simple (plug & Play).


Homeseer lost all my respect several years ago when I was accused of being a web troll for suggesting and pushing support of the CM15.
Even though I had been (and still am) a member of their forum for several years prior.
I still visit their forum though that is very rare now.
At that time AHP was the only option and very buggy, the SDK had just been released.
I had been running Homeseer 1 and never update.

Homeseer and the AHP SDK pushed me into creating my own alternatives. ;)

Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on October 10, 2017, 10:56:50 AM
Using the CM15 or CM11 as a modem to communicate to PLC/RF and using an Arduino/RPi/ESP8266/Android stick/Windows whatever seems like a current tech that's not complicated or expensive.  That's where I'm confused about the continued interest in this specific device.  It will allow you to connect your CM15 to a network but won't control anything.  So, you still need your Windows PC running to do advanced things with your CM15.  If you instead went with one of those low power devices listed above, you could use whatever HA software you wanted (Homeseer, HomeGenie, etc) and simply use the X10 device for communication rather than trying to add WiFi to it.  I guess I'm unclear what the benefit is these days with cheap UC devices.  I've been watching this thread for a few years now and that's the question I've waited to see answered.

Q: What is the advantage of the WiFi unit over using a WiFi enabled device in conjunction with a X10 controller (CM15/CM11)?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on October 10, 2017, 11:29:23 AM
Q: What is the advantage of the WiFi unit over using a WiFi enabled device in conjunction with a X10 controller (CM15/CM11)?
As far as I see only a power consumption advantage and you can program it from any where after initial setup (hopefully ::) :') .
The app for the x10 Hub I seen had no real timers or macros so a cm15/11 would have still been needed.
However I requested macros and timers be added which would eliminate the need for a cm15/11  for most simple configurations.
I suspect complicated macros may still require a CM15 though the Hub does have more internal memory (I've been told) then the CM15 so the possibility for complicated macros and timers is a possibility.

The draw back with the hub  is it will have no RF send or receive :( but then neither does a CM11
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: toasterking on October 10, 2017, 12:43:04 PM
Q: What is the advantage of the WiFi unit over using a WiFi enabled device in conjunction with a X10 controller (CM15/CM11)?
I've had the same question all along, and to me, the advantage is none.  Regardless of whatever buzzwords may be used in its marketing, this seems intended to be a remote control device, not a home automation device.  Some of us demand more from our setups, like triggers and actions with complex logic in the middle.  I pretty much decided at the beginning that this product isn't for me.  But if it does serve some sector of the market well and helps to promote innovation and longevity in the company supporting X10, I'll support it.  I only hope that either of those are still true at this point.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on October 10, 2017, 01:07:01 PM
Some of us demand more from our setups, like triggers and actions with complex logic in the middle.
I agree and on seeing the last app build, to me it was nothing more then a device to allow remote control via your smartphone and only from ones own Lan.
I stated no one needs another fancy X10 remote, I have a box full of X10 remotes. B:(
This app is(was) worse then the one I used with the first version Alfa build with the old(obsolete) chipset. :(

The Hub does have an internal clock which I'm told is update via the web so timers are not a issue.
As long as the code for timers and macros is added into the app there will be some automation. ;)
In fortunately we are all at the mercy of the App developer  B:( The Manufacture states the possibilities are there.




Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on October 11, 2017, 12:05:50 PM
So local network control only (I'm not complaining, that's a good thing) but it requires the internet to set the clock.  Does that make sense to anyone else?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on October 11, 2017, 12:36:24 PM
I didn't say it set time via internet just that it updated (maintained) it that way.
Actually I believe the manufacture may have stated it was updated threw the app so it would use the phone to keep updated.
However since timers and macros were not in the app yet there also was not a visible time setting.
Also there was no option for dusk dawn or daylight savings settings, but after I supplied a data base I'm told this will be added.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: JeffVolp on October 11, 2017, 03:12:38 PM
Unfortunately we are all at the mercy of the App developer  B:( The Manufacture states the possibilities are there.

Gee if we have been waiting years just for the software, why not release the protocol so some of the more technically inclined X10 users can develop their own software without having to wait for the "App developer".

Jeff
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on October 11, 2017, 03:23:32 PM
Exactly what I had put forth to the Authinx owner.
However it appears the manufacture contracted the current app developer without clarifying who owned the code (so I'm told)
I've been trying to get some semblance of the protocol at least to see what the hardware is going to be capable of for over a year now. I keep being told the manufacturer is dragging their feet as Authinx is waiting on this from them. B:(
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on October 11, 2017, 06:38:06 PM
.... Regardless of whatever buzzwords may be used in its marketing, this seems intended to be a remote control device, not a home automation device. Some of us demand more from our setups, like triggers and actions with complex logic in the middle.......

You hit the nail on the head. To many people... if not most... Home Automation is timers or motion detectors that turn "lights" on and off.

Seemingly... only recently has Amazon realized that they are marketing an AI (Artificial Intelligence) Device. I've been working at getting my home to accept my voice as the remote... and communicate back to me with a voice.... for about a decade now. It is so nice to see that part of the HA experience has come to fruition! Now... if I could just get more text messages and maybe voice alerts from home... sent to my phone.

But unfortunately with that accomplishment/advancement.... the concept of truly intelligent automation seems to have been pushed the side by the crowds of NEW HA users.... who imagine HA as it existed in the 1980. Push buttons and timers.

But also... on the Brightside today anyone with basic reading skills can setup a voice (Amazon) operated garage door (MyQ chamberlain) for a couple hundred bucks. A God-send for anyone confined to a bed or otherwise (temporarily or permanently) unable to open a home to guesses, service people, or even emergency services. Or ... even just yell at their smart phone (or Amazon device) to have it make a phone call.

We come so far with automation... and the possibilities really are limited ONLY by our LACK of imagination. I like your phrase: "triggers and actions with complex logic in the middle". THAT should be the accepted goal of every new product!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on December 27, 2017, 10:25:01 AM
I've been told Authinx has a small shipment of these (production run) units in house now, though not told an exact number. :)%
They are still waiting on the App developer to finalize things but I expect these to be offered by second week of January 2018.
I'm told the developer will be working on an Alexa skill next. Hopefully they are faster at creating that! ::) :'
Authinx is open to suggestions for modifications and changes based on the masses as feedbacks come in.  :)%
2018 is looking good!
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tucson on December 27, 2017, 03:01:14 PM
 Wow, I gave up on this every happening.  That's great news. :)%  Making it open source would be great. Also a Siri Interface. But first quickly debugging problems would be nice.  A little nervous about response time after how long it's taking to get here.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tucson on December 27, 2017, 03:12:37 PM
 Almost forgot to ask which platforms will the app support.  iOS and android ?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on December 27, 2017, 03:27:18 PM
Yes iOS and Android, I've seen both.
As for open source I've been pushing for the protocol since the first proto type was created. having this would have given me a good Idea of what the hardware is capable of. Currently we have to wait till a app update and even then that only shows what the developer has utilized.
This unit is firmware upgradable (I've seen three upgrades so far) so expanding the possibilities are there however some may still require a hardware upgrade.
I've also been told that if the demand is there serious thought will be given to improvement Ideas. >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: bkenobi on December 31, 2017, 11:17:53 PM
They take 3+ years to get a device to production and then tell us that if we show enough interest, they might do more?  Seems like a tough sell even for diehard people.  I've moved on from this, but I am really hoping that the device sells well.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on December 31, 2017, 11:28:20 PM
Delays seem to be common for things done in China now or things that were started in 2014-15 B:(
Authinx is not the only company experiencing delays  :(
I wouldn't expect them to add every option users request. To stated if demand for an add was there sounds reasonable to me.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Mic_ on January 01, 2018, 01:37:14 AM
So, in a nut shell, where are we on this wifi unit?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 01, 2018, 02:23:32 AM
The units are being produced.
In fact I just received a unit today see attached. The hold up is still the apps.  B:(
The unit came with instructions for how to find the app on the prospective stores but the app doesn't exist yet. B:(
There was also a link to the manual which also doesn't exist yet. thought this is so easy to setup a manual isn't realy needed.
As soon as those links are available I'll post them.  ;)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on January 01, 2018, 04:48:48 AM
Looks nice.
That sucking sound is me now holding my breath in hot anticipation.  :)%
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 01, 2018, 04:57:11 AM
I should have place something beside this to give an idea of size. B:(
It is smaller then the CM15A, exactly the same size as a PAT03 as it still uses the same case as the original design.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: roger1818 on January 01, 2018, 08:02:50 PM
Is that an pass through electrical outlet on the bottom?

I am thinking that since it doesn't have any X10 RF capabilities that it would be best to put this as close to the electrical panel as possible to maximize signal distribution through the house.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 01, 2018, 09:51:12 PM
Sadly no!
My proto type did and I assumed this would as well  :-[
As for placing it close to your distribution panel, that may not be necessary as it does have a stronger PCL signal going out then the CM15.
It reads 9.99 on my XTBM Pro signal analyzer my CM15 reads 7.44. placement may be more dictated by your routers Wi-Fi signal range however a Wi-Fi repeater could solve that.
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: solareclipse on January 01, 2018, 10:00:22 PM
As for placing it close to your distribution panel, that may not be necessary as it does have a stronger PCL signal going out then the CM15.
It reads 9.99 on my XTBM Pro signal analyzer my CM15 reads 7.44. placement may be more dictated by your routers Wi-Fi signal range however a Wi-Fi repeater could solve that.
 >!

I'll buy it just to see how the signal strength compares.  If it works better than my CM15A, even as a secondary device it will be an improvement to my system.  Even just app control at this point is a good thing - sometimes I'm outside and wanting to turn on or off an exterior light and I don't have an RF remote with me.

I hope they work on a Google Home add-in or IFTTT integration besides the Alexa skill.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 01, 2018, 10:13:57 PM
I believe a Google Home app is in line after the Alexa App possiblity is looked into.
IFTTT won't be possible until or if the protocol is released  :(
Authinx has stated they'll pressure the manufacture more on this after the Wi-Fi unit is officaly released.

I use this in conjunction with my CM15 and AHP as currently macro (scene) functions are very limited.
As well I still use my remotes though less and less.
Even my wife uses her phone more to turn devices on/off, then the remotes. Something I never thought I'd see happening in my life time. rofl

Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on January 02, 2018, 06:10:27 AM
I believe a Google Home app is in line after the Alexa App possiblity is looked into.
IFTTT won't be possible until or if the protocol is released  :(
Authinx has stated they'll pressure the manufacture more on this after the Wi-Fi unit is officaly released.

I would bet/guess.... if there is a wifi phone app.... a little searching would find someone that could produce a "skill" that the good people at Amazon would love to offer.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 02, 2018, 02:25:12 PM
My experiments with SmartThings cloud suggest we may even be able to tie into their skill.
I do this now for Google Home and Alexa using my cm15 and software ;)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on January 02, 2018, 06:21:24 PM
My experiments with SmartThings cloud suggest we may even be able to tie into their skill.
I do this now for Google Home and Alexa using my cm15 and software ;)

Woo Hoo! I just wonder.... if other hubs might also recognize the X10 app/device as well. I know I have overlap with my other devices and apps here.   
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 02, 2018, 07:21:19 PM
Actually I don't use a SmartThings Hub I use their cloud portal.
It allows zwave, zigbee, hue, homeseer, Logitech harmony, Cree, GE and a bunch of other manufactures devices.
All my X10 devices show up in the SmartThings app and Alexa or Google use the SmartThings skill
I've even added Broadlink RM coded devices to it.
I had put forth something simular for the WM100 but have it built into the HUB and not require a setup like SmartThings.
However after working with SmartThings that may be the better way as my idea was in a macro.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: roger1818 on January 02, 2018, 07:30:59 PM
So can the WiFi unit talk directly with the SmartThings cloud, or do you need to have a computer running 24/7 to bridge the two?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 02, 2018, 08:57:05 PM
The WIFI unit (WM100)can't communicate with SmartThings or the other way around (yet)
With the protocol you could have SmartThings talk to it thus enabling Alexa control through the WM100.
If my macro Idea were implemented the WM100 could send info to any hub, if you knew that hubs expected HTTP GET protocol.

 I had not attempted to hack my WM100 to any degree for fear I'd corrupt testings of it.
I use SmartThings with the PC and a cm15 currently.
However the WM100 does see PLC sent from the CM15 (currently that is just to avoid stepping on a X10 signal).
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on January 02, 2018, 09:01:27 PM
Actually I don't use a SmartThings Hub I use their cloud portal.
It allows zwave, zigbee, hue, homeseer, Logitech harmony, Cree, GE and a bunch of other manufactures devices.
All my X10 devices show up in the SmartThings app and Alexa or Google use the SmartThings skill

That makes sense.
I don't own a SmartThings (Samsung) Hub either. But I do have the Wink Hub (1st generation) I picked up on clearance. And although... I have no Wink devices for the Hub to control... It does recognize and control other brand devices I do own. Some things... like my garage door... is controlled by two Hubs. The MyQ Hub (and app) controls (and alerts me about) my garage door. But Since the Wink Hub also see's the garage door... it can turn on lights when the door raises after dark. Interesting... the lights it turns on are Cree and ihome (I have NO Wink lights).

I know you're just referring to the SmartThings app.... and cloud-based services. But the software commutations is pretty much the same... maybe without local control.

It may be possible.... if the Samsung Hub recognizes the X10 WiFi interface to include other flavors of HA products in our AHP macros. I would think..... that Samsung would LOVE to include the X10 name as one more product controlled by it's SmartThings Hub. And a great thing would also be (for X10 users) that Samsung is the major source of occupancy sensors right now.... I believe.

But then again...... I think about one of the newer Echo devices (maybe not yet available in Canada)... that has a built-in Hub of it's very own. An X10 skill..... would be AWESOME.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 03, 2018, 09:50:34 PM
The Developer has stated the X10WIFI Apps are ready and they are waiting Apples approval of the iOS app.
From what I've read that can take up to a week if nothing is flagged inappropriate, longer if it gets flagged. B:(
So in now looks like we're waiting on Apples acceptance. ::) :'
The owner has air freighted in a small batch ( I didn't ask the number) for initial release the rest are on the slow boat from China.
Those could take Up to 8 weeks to arrive. B:(
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: astrothug on January 04, 2018, 01:41:31 AM
wow this is so cool, do we have a base price? i  put away my x10 controller and bought a samsung smartthings hub, and Philips hue hub.  What i missed the most from my x10 is my house talking to me with the help of MSAgent Nicole by Guile3D. I have been trying to do something similar with my present set up. thanks all for the updates...
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 04, 2018, 11:23:00 AM
 Avioninnovative.com (http://www.avioninnovative.com/x10-smart-home.html) has a new Blue Tooth controller out which starts at $199(includes $20 app) ::) :'
I thought that was a bit out of sight considering you only get local control.

So I guess the initial price of the X10WIFI(app) and WM100(hardware) combo isn't to bad a deal at $99.
Authinx stated that was as low as they could offer this without losing their shirts, although I don't expect them to make a profit off this for some time. Hopefully I'm wrong. ::) :'
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on January 04, 2018, 12:05:43 PM
So I guess the initial price of the X10WIFI(app) and WM100(hardware) combo isn't to bad a deal at $99.

Marmitek's Ethernet-to-X10 RF device costs about $75 plus it requires an RF-to-PLC transceiver so $99 doesn't seem too bad by comparison.
https://www.uk-automation.co.uk/marmitek-tip10rf-smartphone-to-x10-interface/ (https://www.uk-automation.co.uk/marmitek-tip10rf-smartphone-to-x10-interface/)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 04, 2018, 12:11:05 PM
I actually forgot about that unit. :-[
 It also isn't Wi-Fi if I remember right, it has to use a Ethernet cable.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: petera on January 04, 2018, 12:38:48 PM
I actually forgot about that unit. :-[
 It also isn't Wi-Fi if I remember right, it has to use a Ethernet cable.

Correct. PLC via Ethernet. Separate transceiver required for RF control.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dhouston on January 04, 2018, 12:59:42 PM
To clarify the Marmitek TIP10RF...
     Ethernet -> RF -> PLC

Once connected to your network it can be controlled via WiFi but it has no WiFi capability itself.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: petera on January 05, 2018, 08:36:35 AM
To clarify the Marmitek TIP10RF...
     Ethernet -> RF -> PLC

Once connected to your network it can be controlled via WiFi but it has no WiFi capability itself.

That's correct. RF via Ethernet only. Connects directly to your router. No need for a computer. Transceiver handles RF signal from TIP10RF locally.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Mic_ on January 14, 2018, 11:28:52 PM
Just so I don't miss the boat here...the long awaited WiFi unit is here? Do I understand that it in limited supply? Where can I see what this thing looks like? What will it allow one to do?
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Brian H on January 15, 2018, 05:41:44 AM
Just so I don't miss the boat here...the long awaited WiFi unit is here? Do I understand that it in limited supply? Where can I see what this thing looks like? What will it allow one to do?

Look at post #465 for a photo of the unit.
Posts indicate the first production run of them is on a boat to the USA.
With a small quantity of then sent by air. For evaluation.

More data besides here. In Jeff's Forums.
Last post.
http://jvde.us/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=52v5jl4fs0nnmhqm4i91io2241&topic=329.msg1717#new
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Mic_ on January 15, 2018, 02:55:34 PM
Thanks all
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: abxflyr on January 15, 2018, 03:37:11 PM
To ask a few questions about the WM100....after someone/anyone develops a skill for Alexa, will one be able to simply use Alexa and have it comm with the WM100 for simple X10 commands? 

For me, I'm new to the Alexa and are looking for the best/simplest option to integrate into a long standing x10 system.  I don't need anything other than the basic communication since I will have all complex scripting and commanding done from current stand alone controller (Ocelot) and PCS scenemaster switching.  I've considered Tuiceman's Alex10, but it requires a Win10 computer to run continuous (not in love with that); and the set up....is taxing my computer skills.  I know for most it's easy, guess I'm not most in the arena. 

Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 15, 2018, 06:25:07 PM
Once a skill is available you'll not need anything else. (other then x10 modules)
Alex10 was created for Win !0 but I've heard it is being used in older OS above XP.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: akeene on January 16, 2018, 04:51:30 AM
I would love a X10 WIFI hub.
Hey Tuiceman, Seens your site is broken.
Something changed?
Permission denied in ??
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 16, 2018, 06:21:23 AM
I would love a X10 WIFI hub.
Hey Tuiceman, Seens your site is broken.
Something changed?
Permission denied in ??

well the modules are here the delay now is not Apple but changes made for it need to be redone for the Android app.
Not a good idea to release something that you can't access. B:(

As for my forum,
Godaddy is working on it I'm told
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Mic_ on January 20, 2018, 08:49:44 AM
Question; first thanks for the notice that the x10 WiFi unit is here, I ordered mine.  Will there we a windows phone app available? If not, I will get an Android phone to work with this long awaited device.

Next question; I have one computer at home with win XP; will the new wifi device work on XP? Thanks all
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on January 20, 2018, 09:11:42 AM
Question; first thanks for the notice that the x10 WiFi unit is here, I ordered mine.  Will there we a windows phone app available? If not, I will get an Android phone to work with this long awaited device.

The app for your iPhone is already at the app store (free dl). I am using it now. You can download it today, but the app is useless until you receive the WM100.

Next question; I have one computer at home with win XP; will the new wifi device work on XP? Thanks all

No computer needed... unless you count your phone. You'll setup your devices, timers, and scenes all through the app on your phone. The WM100 plugs into an outlet and syncs with your phone... but operates via wifi... so you'll have control from anywhere.

Setup is super easy! But for timers and scenes I needed to review the directions (http://www.authinx.com/manuals/X10/WM100-Manual.pdf). For the wifi setup... there is a barcode/QR code on the WM100 and you just scan it with your phone and press the sync button till it blinks. Follow the simple instructions you can't miss. (http://www.authinx.com/manuals/X10/WM100-Manual.pdf)
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: dave w on January 20, 2018, 09:16:01 AM
Question; first thanks for the notice that the x10 WiFi unit is here, I ordered mine.  Will there we a windows phone app available? If not, I will get an Android phone to work with this long awaited device.
Next question; I have one computer at home with win XP; will the new wifi device work on XP? Thanks all
WiFi App is only in Android and iOS versions. There has been some discussion about a Windows version (mainly to be able to input devices via a desktop or laptop), but if it happens, I don't think it will be soon. $0.02
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: HA Dave on January 20, 2018, 09:28:04 AM
WiFi App is only in Android and iOS versions.

Oops! I misread Mic_'s post. So sorry Mic_.
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 20, 2018, 09:59:27 AM
Mic_ ,
You'll need an iOS device (something with a camera and wifi) or an Android device(again something with a camera and wifi)
The camera is only needed to scan the QR code for setup wifi is needed for communication.
Currently they are the only Phones which have an app.
As dave w pointed out there is currently no way to connect via a PC.
If/when the Protocol is released this may happen from a thirdparty.
 >!
Title: Re: New x10 Wi-Fi unit
Post by: Tuicemen on January 20, 2018, 10:04:57 AM
Note: I've locked this topic since the module is now available to any forum user all new discussion for it can be done in that section.
 >!