X10 Community Forum

X10 WIFI => Wish list => Topic started by: Tuicemen on December 27, 2017, 01:25:02 PM

Title: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: Tuicemen on December 27, 2017, 01:25:02 PM
The owner has stated that the developer would look at Alexa next. To me that doesn't mean they'll create one.
However if the interest is there it may happen quicker.
I realize many like myself use Google, Alexa and maybe Cortana so for this reason I've allowed voting for all answers.
 >!
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: Noam on January 18, 2018, 11:14:32 AM
While we're asking for more skills, how about adding one for IFTTT (If This Then That) - another cool scripting app/system that already has ties to other Home Automation systems, as well as hooks to popular e-mail, calendar, etc apps.
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: Tuicemen on January 18, 2018, 11:18:44 AM
A skill doesn't need to be made for IFTTT
You can use web hooks to send info to devices this would include the WM100 (if the protocol was published).
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: HA Dave on January 18, 2018, 11:59:15 AM
Wow.... I hadn't thought of all the different virtual people this might be used with.
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: Tuicemen on January 18, 2018, 12:08:45 PM
I suspect eventually there will be one top dog if not already.
Cortana and Alexa are set to work together and that was to have happened in 2017 but the deadline pasted with out implementation. So I expect to see it shortly.
Others may team up to fight for top spot as a good search engine is what makes these shine.
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: HA Dave on January 22, 2018, 08:12:35 PM
Using this great, quality, rock solid, unit with the Amazon Alexa is my number one desire. Period.
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: Walt2 on January 23, 2018, 11:53:36 AM
While we're asking for more skills, how about adding one for IFTTT (If This Then That) - another cool scripting app/system that already has ties to other Home Automation systems, as well as hooks to popular e-mail, calendar, etc apps.

Can I vote against IFTTT?

Maybe I am pretty paranoid, but IFTTT's hooks are alarming.   Their android app (maybe their iPhone app too?), collects copies of all your pics, all of your contacts, reads all your sent/received SMS, and reads your phone call logs.   

To me, that's not a nice app.
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: Tuicemen on January 23, 2018, 12:33:56 PM
IFTTT isn't a skill nor a voice assistant.  ;)
the only way X10 could disable you from using IFTTT would be not to publish the protocol.
And I believe everyone wants the protocol to be released.
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: roger1818 on January 23, 2018, 12:39:34 PM
Their android app (maybe their iPhone app too?), collects copies of all your pics, all of your contacts, reads all your sent/received SMS, and reads your phone call logs.

I haven't used Android, but from what I have seen, iOS (assuming you haven't jaibroken it) does a better job of asking users if an app can have access to hardware and data and allowing the user to prevent an app from gaining access.  From what I have heard all Android does is hides permission in the license agreement that no one reads and it is up to you to agree or not use the app.
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: HA Dave on January 23, 2018, 02:50:04 PM
I haven't used Android, but from what I have seen, iOS (assuming you haven't jaibroken it) does a better job of asking users if an app can have access to hardware and data and allowing the user to prevent an app from gaining access.

You're right! iOS is a little safer/more secure.... like it matters. And there isn't any shame in a little "fear of the unknown" either. True be told... it's a part of the human condition. But connectivity and technology ruined any chance of any privacy.... years ago.

Exploiting this same technology is one way we can share in it's benefit. And there are tons of benefits.
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: Walt2 on January 23, 2018, 04:57:46 PM
Their android app (maybe their iPhone app too?), collects copies of all your pics, all of your contacts, reads all your sent/received SMS, and reads your phone call logs.

I haven't used Android, but from what I have seen, iOS (assuming you haven't jaibroken it) does a better job of asking users if an app can have access to hardware and data and allowing the user to prevent an app from gaining access.  From what I have heard all Android does is hides permission in the license agreement that no one reads and it is up to you to agree or not use the app.

Just to clarify, Android tells you want the apps wants to use, and asks permission, but if you say 'no', it completely aborts the install.
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: Tuicemen on February 15, 2018, 02:05:35 AM
With voice assistance so popular and the Owner of Authinx asking me to look at creating something so users could easily use Alexa with existing X10 PC interfaces. I would have thought a skill would have been very quickly developed for this. ::) :'
Authinx obviously sees the importance and popularity of a skill allowing this.
The Alexa, Google and Cortana assistant apps all allow some additional HA options besides simple on/off/dim.
A skill would allow the WM100 to tap into those options.
From emails with the owner he seems to thing a firmware update will be required.
This may be the case due to how phones initially have to connect to it. ::) :'
Good thing the firmware is upgradable over the internet! :)%
 >!
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: Knightrider on February 15, 2018, 02:14:12 AM
Let's face it, developing apps takes time and money.
If they released the protocol,  there are enthusiasts who would develope third party apps that met smaller niches.
Those third party apps would drive the sale of the hardware.

The more functional the Willie 100 becomes, the more it appeals to the consumer.

Releasing the protocol reduces the amount of time and money required  by Authinx .
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: Tuicemen on February 15, 2018, 02:28:01 AM
Releasing the protocol reduces the amount of time and money required  by Authinx .
Agreed but this is not the thread to discuss the protocol.  ;)

I believe Authinx already has an agreement with the developer for creating a skill. The issue is the time frame it gets done.
They wish to have the Willie 100 as stable as possible before this is started.
I've not looked into skill development much but I do know it means learning another programing language(for me). ::) :'
Hopefully the developer is already familure with the process.
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: HA Dave on February 15, 2018, 02:42:53 AM
Let's face it, developing apps takes time and money.

And..... I am sure you realize few businesses invest time and money without a chance for a return. "Skills" are free... they can't be sold. If someone else develops a skill it will be to control "their software product" they want to sell for DL to the WM100. Having to "buy" software for a module that X10 sells... does NOT increase the modules value.

If they released the protocol,  there are enthusiasts who would develope third party apps that met smaller niches. Those third party apps would drive the sale of the hardware.

On this/that we're in complete agreement! That Alexa "niche"... is MILLIONS of users. Why on Earth wouldn't MILLIONS of potential customers be X10 number one priority? 

The more functional the Willie 100 becomes, the more it appeals to the consumer.

We agree again! And no function is more desired among NEW automation users than Alex/Google/Siri voice control. THAT is the ONE function X10 should be absolutely on top of.

Releasing the protocol reduces the amount of time and money required  by Authinx .

EXCEPT.... X10 ain't got that in a desk drawer somewhere. The Chinese contractor never relinquished that product... and like with the CM15A... probability never will. IF X10 owned it... they should share it. But X10 doesn't own the protocol anymore than you or I. It's silly to spend time or money on anything you can't control or own (unless it's charity).

X10 needs to serve it's customers and potential customers and make X10 modern. Build the skill and get it out there the sooner the better.
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: HA Dave on February 15, 2018, 02:49:59 AM
... this is not the thread to discuss the protocol.  ;)

And... realistically... I am sure (or at least hope) X10's business decisions aren't based on Internet forum posts. Hopefully X10 knows that what Amazon, google, and Siri has done for HA is bigger than anything ever before. Literally MILLIONS of people bought an Echo or Google home... and went about figuring out how to exploit those little devices. Or.... like myself... saw the new "home" icon on my iPhone after an update. Then proceeded to explore and exploit the new technology there.

I am a "new guy".... when it comes to using X10. I only first started using X10... around 2002 (16 years ago). But I've recently tried to re-imagine my setup... and only then did I realize how rock hard my automation paradigms are. The compulsion to re-build, or re-create... instead or re-imagine new ways and means to automate is compelling to say the least. But I refuse to pin myself down to being an old geezer "button pusher". HA has evolved way past that.
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: Tuicemen on February 15, 2018, 03:10:53 AM
Quote
"Skills" are free... they can't be sold. If someone else develops a skill it will be to control "their software product" they want to sell for DL to the WM100.
Skills may be currently free but that is changing. The cost of developing them is also not free.
Amazon charges to host these and that is based on the number of users of said skill.
I don't expect Authinx to charge for this, it wouldn't be in their best interest.

 Over 90% of skills are developed not by the manufacture of a smart device nor do they control a device.
Some skills that are developed for a hardware come out months if not years prior to the manufacture releasing one.
I can think of at least three instances of this.
Unfortunately many skills created by individuals don't get updated. :(
One created by the Authinx's developer I would hope does.
 >!
Quote
And... realistically... I am sure (or at least hope) X10's business decisions aren't based on Internet forum posts.
This is not the reason for keeping discussions on topic!


Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: Tuicemen on February 15, 2018, 04:40:51 AM
Literally MILLIONS of people bought an Echo or Google home... and went about figuring out how to exploit those little devices
So true.
I would have thought home automation would be a top reason for getting one of these.
However from posts on Alexa and google home forums that is not the case. Most questions are about music :o
Very few are (it appears) into Home Automation, maybe a X10 skill will change that ::) :'
I'm sure it will get thousands that have put their modules away in storage to think about using them again.
 >!
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: HA Dave on February 15, 2018, 06:29:12 AM
.... I would have thought home automation would be a top reason for getting one of these.

It is! AI (Alexa and Google are both AI devices) is the apex of Home Automation.

However from posts on Alexa and google home forums that is not the case. Most questions are about music :o
Very few are (it appears) into Home Automation,.....

Yeah. We have a lot of old button pusher HA guys here on the forum. And... you'll have to trust me on this... but deconstructing those old paradigms is about as tough a job as you'll likely ever encounter. What used to be.... is no longer what is. From time-to-time no matter what we endeavor to accomplish we need to honestly reevaluate our efforts and direction. ALOT has changed since X10 was introduced in 1976. What hasn't changed is the way many of us look at home automation.

Lighting.... when I was a child... was the number one use for electric energy. For many reasons lighting is now a fractional part of energy use today. And this has nothing to do with LED's. Lighting was only 12% of electric use even before CFL's.

Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: brobin on March 28, 2018, 04:59:03 AM
Any updates from Authinx on an Alexa Skill release? That's really all I need the WM100 for so I'm waiting for it before I order.
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: Tuicemen on March 28, 2018, 05:44:15 AM
I wouldn't expect a skill till all the bugs are worked out of the app and module.
I'm told it is on the developers list of to dos.
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: dave w on March 28, 2018, 06:05:55 AM
Any updates from Authinx on an Alexa Skill release? That's really all I need the WM100 for so I'm waiting for it before I order.
Boomer, it took four years from announce for the "Willie 100" to ship. I would not wait for the Alexa app.  My own pessimistic prediction is; it's 12 months away. Besides, I have full voice control X10 automation through Homeseer. It is fun to say "Alexa, turn on, put house to sleep" and watch the lights go out all over the house, but the WM100 is very useful as it now stands.
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: HA Dave on March 28, 2018, 06:28:59 PM
.......... I would not wait for the Alexa app.  My own pessimistic prediction is; it's 12 months away. Besides, I have full voice control X10 automation through Homeseer. It is fun to say "Alexa, turn on, put house to sleep" and watch the lights go out all over the house, but the WM100 is very useful as it now stands.

I am also using Alexa (and Amazon routines) along with Homeseer (via the Raspberry Pi based Hometroller). Of course.... I was using Voice Control via the BVC software and a HA PC.... a decade ago. So where voice control isn't new, it has never been so good. X10 should be on developing an Amazon skill.... like white on rice.

Whether it's hands-free light control while working in the kitchen, Alexa giving me a 10 minute spaghetti timer, or shutting down the home when I announce to Alexa that it's bedtime. Or... even dancing with the little tike grandkids to Alexa playing "I'm a gummy bear" (they love that), or Alexa calculating the number of days... till any event I ask for... Amazon's (and I am sure Googles) AI automation..... is too awesome NOT to utilize (if it is at all possible).

I know.... the fear of the unknown is as much a part of the human condition.... as is little human offspring. But acting like frightened old women (my apologies to old women) and avoiding modern technology won't fly in the Home Automation/smart home marketplace. Sure... there are lots of old Luddite's in the world. And some also use HA products. But those people are so few.... they could all have lunch together at the last Howard Johnson restaurant, at Lake George, NY (a beautiful area BTW). They may be a great group of wonderful people... but I really doubt they constitute a profitable market. And if X10 doesn't profit.... we lose X10.
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: Tuicemen on March 28, 2018, 07:00:12 PM
There are several FREE ways to get Alexa control over x10. Waiting for a skill to be available for this product before purchase is  unrealistic.
I have Alex, Google and Cortana control over my X10 and didn't have to wait for a skill.
No new devices need to be purchased for Voice control of X10.
Use what you have till a skill comes but don't  wait for one before purchasing a WM100, this unit is a power house as is.
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: HA Dave on March 28, 2018, 07:34:58 PM
There are several FREE ways to get Alexa control over x10. Waiting for a skill to be available for this product before purchase is  unrealistic............ don't  wait for one before purchasing a WM100, this unit is a power house as is.

The WM100 is a great product as-is. Certainly any X10 user should enjoy the expanded capability of a (use from anywhere) phone-based X10 remote. And MOST IMPORTANTLY... anyone can setup the WM100 in just minutes.

But I am just guessing that the vast majority of HA users are stumped and frustrated when trying to use many of the available alternate means and methods for HA. Nothing against users or creators of products (like yourself). But for most users... this stuff really needs to be almost out-of-the-box ready. THAT is where Amazon and the Amazon skills.... really shine. It's advanced tech... that works for everyone.
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: JeffVolp on March 28, 2018, 07:39:27 PM
Sure... there are lots of old Luddite's in the world. And some also use HA products. But those people are so few.... they could all have lunch together at the last Howard Johnson restaurant

Per the definition:

A slang term used to attack and ostracize those who are not afraid to keep things that still work and do not need to be upgraded. A luddite is someone who encourages the use of technology and technological equipment that is still perfectly good and perfectly working, although a new model/generation/color has come out.

There are more than you may think.  Many X10 users would fall into that group.  We don't waste money buying the latest and greatest.  Personally, I replace things that break and are no longer repairable or are no longer suitable for the application.  I have dedicated the last decade to helping other X10 users keep their systems running as they should.  So watch when you throw around that term derogatorily.

Jeff
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: Tuicemen on March 28, 2018, 10:11:46 PM
But I am just guessing that the vast majority of HA users are stumped and frustrated when trying to use many of the available alternate means and methods for HA. Nothing against users or creators of products (like yourself). But for most users... this stuff really needs to be almost out-of-the-box ready. THAT is where Amazon and the Amazon skills.... really shine. It's advanced tech... that works for everyone.
Not everyone! Even with skills users still have issues setting up their HA stuff. ::) :'
Just go through feed back for different skills not all are praises of easy setup.
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: HA Dave on March 29, 2018, 12:35:43 AM
A slang term used to attack and ostracize those who ..............

Not at all Jeff.

Starting backwards.... your efforts and many accomplishments have greatly improved HA in general for many. Neither YOU or anyone else on this forum is being either attacked or ostracized by me... or anyone else on this forum that I am aware of.

Luddite... is NOT a slang term. It's a historical reference to Ned Ludd (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ned_Ludd)... and a reminder of the violent, bloody resistance that is part our history. The resistance to change... is so strong in the human race... it is often met with such awful and senseless confrontation. Thankfully because of the failure of the Luddite resistance, even todays impoverished individuals aren't forced to live naked in the streets. Weaving technology advancements.... brought clothing to the masses.   
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: HA Dave on March 29, 2018, 12:42:04 AM
Not everyone! Even with skills users still have issues setting up their HA stuff. ::) :' 

You're absolutely correct. Which I believe.... reinforces what I am pointing out.

IMHO.... the sooner X10 brings a skill online that can (or NOT) be used with the new WM100 modules... the better for everyone. X10 included. Advancing X10 ability's... harms NO ONE. No one will be forced to progress into what has become the standard for automation.
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: JeffVolp on March 29, 2018, 12:55:57 AM
Luddite... is NOT a slang term. It's a historical reference to Ned Ludd (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ned_Ludd)

Yes, I am familiar with the history.  But the term is usually used today for someone who avoids new technology.  I'm sure you were not referring to textile workers in your earlier post.  And that term does fit me as I only recently upgraded my emergency flip-phone to an Android smartphone because it became waterlogged when I hiked the Kalalau Trail on Kauai.  My daily usage car (280ZX) doesn't even have power steering.  And my "hiking" car is a '95 Explorer.  I would not want a car with all the electronics in the new ones.

But we also have an Echo and two Dots.  (I'm always impressed when Alexa answers some obscure question.)  And I'm finally accepting WiFi rather than pulling in all that Cat5 for hard-wired Ethernet.

Jeff
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: HA Dave on March 29, 2018, 01:17:36 AM
Yes, I am familiar with the history.  But the term is usually used today for someone who avoids new technology.

That is a shame. Yes... they're, there, and their seem interchangeable to many today also. But that is NOT my fault. Many, many people died or were displaced during the industrial revolution. We are seeing similar displacements with todays technological revolution. And... IMHO... much more is yet to come. Forgive the old soldier in me that doesn't hesitate to point out the threat conditions as I see them. If we don't remember our past... we are destined to repeat it.

I only recently upgraded my emergency flip-phone to an Android smartphone because it became waterlogged when I hiked the Kalalau Trail on Kauai.  ......

I lost a camera to rain in the Puerto Rican Rain Forest years ago. Your hike sounds great! I am bicyclist now myself (I ride a solid 2000 miles a year). Cyclist keep their phones, cash, and whatnots... in Ziploc bags. They do a good job. Some of my bikes are latest greatest.... some are vintage. I even have a beautiful old vintage steel bike (last of an era).

Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: JeffVolp on March 29, 2018, 01:39:29 AM
Your hike sounds great! I am bicyclist now myself (I ride a solid 2000 miles a year). Cyclist keep their phones, cash, and whatnots... in Ziploc bags. They do a good job.

I had everything in ziplog bags too, but I slipped on a muddy rock crossing a stream and came down on my backpack in the stream.  That blew open the bag, and it filled with water.  (Those muddy rocks were so slippery it was like hiking on ice.)

If interested in photos:  http://jvde.us/photos/Kalalau-Trail-Kauai/

I wish I still had my old JC Higgins bike with the balloon tires and coiled spring front suspension.

Jeff
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: HA Dave on March 29, 2018, 06:18:49 AM
If interested in photos:  http://jvde.us/photos/Kalalau-Trail-Kauai/   

MY GOD.... that's serious hiking! Any path that has a "Hazardous cliff" signs.... is out of my league. 

I wish I still had my old JC Higgins bike with the balloon tires and coiled spring front suspension.

John Higgins was an actual real life Sears employee.... who started with sears in 1898. And.... the fat tires are popular again! My Gravel Grinder has big tires.... it's a go anywhere road bike.



Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: Knightrider on March 29, 2018, 07:32:22 AM
I always thought that Jon Higgins was a pseudonym for Robin Masters.
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: HA Dave on March 29, 2018, 07:36:48 AM
I always thought that Jon Higgins was a pseudonym for Robin Masters.

 rofl

Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: dave w on March 30, 2018, 04:04:58 AM
Youse guys are talkin way over my head.  <huge grin>
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: brobin on March 31, 2018, 10:47:02 PM
There are several FREE ways to get Alexa control over x10. Waiting for a skill to be available for this product before purchase is  unrealistic.
I have Alex, Google and Cortana control over my X10 and didn't have to wait for a skill.
No new devices need to be purchased for Voice control of X10.
Use what you have till a skill comes but don't  wait for one before purchasing a WM100, this unit is a power house as is.

Thanks to your excellent Alex10 program I do have Alexa control for X10 now but the WM100 with an Alexa skill would eliminate the need for the PC that runs it.  I already have WiFi control and everything else (and more) that the Willie offers through my long running Stargate installation.  The CM-15a I bought for Alex10 has no scheduling at all and is only used as a signal interface.  The Willie does offer a lot but I would only use it as an Alexa bridge. 
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: gkamieneski on April 08, 2018, 05:40:25 PM
I guess I am with those waiting to buy the Willie, until Alexa support, but do people think this will require a hardware change, firmware update, or does the Alexa skill simply have to be published?

If I knew I could buy the Willie now and use it as currently configured and then take advantage of the Alexa script when available, I would be happy,.
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: HA Dave on April 08, 2018, 06:44:28 PM
Thanks to your excellent Alex10 program I do have Alexa control for X10 now but the WM100 with an Alexa skill would eliminate the need for the PC that runs it. ...... 

I ran a Home Automation [dedicated] PC or laptop for over a decade. Maybe.... it was the introduction of the low-wattage LED lights that helped make me aware of the power consumed by my HA PC's. It certainly wasn't the cost of the computers... as I always used door-stop dust-collector grade computers for HA PC's. But even now.... I am using a Hometroller (homeseer raspberry pi)... which is by every description a computer... but runs on milliamps.

Whether we use little stick or micro-PC's or old used desktops.... great Home Automation requires the power of PC processing and programs. Although this processing needed could be supplied by a HUB.... I don't know of a HUB out there that does much processing. Or course [smart] mobile phones and "cloud-processing" (like with Alexa and/or googles voice) should make home computers far less needed... "in the future". But for now.... we can do a lot with the small HUB's and just a bit more when we add a stick PC, Raspberry Pi, or high-end specialty unit (like Homeseer).   

I guess I am with those waiting to buy the Willie, until Alexa support, but do people think this will require a hardware change, firmware update, or does the Alexa skill simply have to be published?

If I knew I could buy the Willie now and use it as currently configured and then take advantage of the Alexa script when available, I would be happy,.

I "think" and have read here... we're just waiting for the minor bugs to be ironed-out of the current app.... and then the Amazon-Alexa skill will be introduced. Meanwhile... the WM-100 is the very best (smart phone based) remote control ever made for X10... and it works from everywhere.
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: Tuicemen on April 08, 2018, 08:46:44 PM
I guess I am with those waiting to buy the Willie, until Alexa support, but do people think this will require a hardware change, firmware update, or does the Alexa skill simply have to be published?

If I knew I could buy the Willie now and use it as currently configured and then take advantage of the Alexa script when available, I would be happy,.
The Willie will not require a hardware change for an Alexa skill.
A skill basically just sends a HTTP Get to a device simular to what the WiFi app does now.
The hub sends back an acknowledgement to AWS simular to what it does now.
If the Protocol was published anyone could build a skill for the Willie for now we have to wait for the developer as they know the protocol.
Title: Re: Please create an voice assitant skill
Post by: gkamieneski on April 08, 2018, 09:10:21 PM
Thanks gentlemen.

Seems I might as well pull the trigger on a WM100 now and gain control from iPhone. Then when the skill is published, I will have Alexa control as well.