X10 Community Forum

X10 WIFI => Help & Trouble shooting => Topic started by: SkipWX10 on February 10, 2018, 04:13:41 PM

Title: Where does WM100 get it's dusk/dawn times?
Post by: SkipWX10 on February 10, 2018, 04:13:41 PM
Maybe I just spaced on somehow inputting my zip code or location, but I don't remember ever giving the app or WM100 my location. I know in AHP (and synced with the CM15) I choose a location and at what interval I want to update dusk/dawn times.

Since it's on my phone, does it get location info from my cell (even if I have location off) or from my internet provider via wifi? And if it does, why do I have then to sync time from my cell to the WM100?

And, if it does not communicate with my cell/internet service or sync time, how does it know dusk/dawn times?

And then to further extrapolate, if the device timers reside on the WM100 once programed, how do seasonal changes then get adapted for dusk/dawn.

Please forgive me if this is a totally basic concept and it's just me that can't grasp it.....

Thanks, Skip
Title: Re: Where does WM100 get it's dusk/dawn times?
Post by: akeene on February 10, 2018, 04:41:22 PM
At this point - We are all in the NEWBE state.
We are just now building a data base of problems and learning as we go.
So do not feel that its just you.

1. Location on the phone: Even if you have location set to off, It once was on. so that should be what it uses.
2. When you add WM100 to your router for Internet, it could use the time zone there.
3. Dusk - dawn - works on that info. If you set DST on in the WM100, it will adjust time based on the setup.
4. If you chose to sync time with the Internet server, Somewhere It asked for your zone ( -8  -7 etc. )
5. Have fun testing and reporting back to enlighten us.
this is what we do and love it.

thx
Title: Re: Where does WM100 get it's dusk/dawn times?
Post by: dave w on February 11, 2018, 07:40:59 AM
Since it's on my phone, does it get location info from my cell (even if I have location off) or from my internet provider via wifi? And if it does, why do I have then to sync time from my cell to the WM100?
And, if it does not communicate with my cell/internet service or sync time, how does it know dusk/dawn times?
Perhaps Tuicement who deals with Authinx X10 frequently could add more insight, but my two cents is the WM100 does not know your location, but dawn and dusk are calculated from the local time. 
Title: Re: Where does WM100 get it's dusk/dawn times?
Post by: Tuicemen on February 11, 2018, 01:04:06 PM
Originally I was told the dusk dawn settings were from your phone on initial setup.
However I believe it may be from your IP when you initially connect to the Amazon servers.
I'll try to get some clarification ;)
Title: Re: Where does WM100 get it's dusk/dawn times?
Post by: JeffVolp on February 11, 2018, 01:05:59 PM
Perhaps Tuicement who deals with Authinx X10 frequently could add more insight, but my two cents is the WM100 does not know your location, but dawn and dusk are calculated from the local time.

That would be a poor solution because dawn and dusk vary an hour over a time zone.  Using the mid-point, there could be half an hour error for those on the eastern and western edges.  And latitude is also a factor.

If the GPS location isn't available from the smart phone, a zip lookup table could work in the US.  Something like that probably exists for Canada too.

Jeff
Title: Re: Where does WM100 get it's dusk/dawn times?
Post by: HA Dave on February 11, 2018, 02:35:48 PM
If it helps any..... Alexa gives me the exact same time for sunset as the WM100 uses for the timers.
Title: Re: Where does WM100 get it's dusk/dawn times?
Post by: SkipWX10 on February 11, 2018, 02:53:03 PM
Thanks for the replies. I would love to know where actually it determines the d/d times. To Jeff's point, I was thinking even if it used my 'time' to guess my 'time zone' it could still be wildly inaccurate. The fact that HA Dave shows Alexa and the WM100 match, does give one hope ;-)
Title: Re: Where does WM100 get it's dusk/dawn times?
Post by: Knightrider on February 11, 2018, 02:54:30 PM
I use a 3g connection for my internet. My IP sometimes pings back to Chicago or Detroit. I live in the Eastern Time zone. I don't think that's how it gets the time.
Title: Re: Where does WM100 get it's dusk/dawn times?
Post by: HA Dave on February 11, 2018, 03:26:48 PM
..... The fact that HA Dave shows Alexa and the WM100 match, does give one hope ;-)

I've only recently conceded to using a "mathematically calculated sunset/sunrise". Until recently I used the light sensor built into X10 PR511 floodlight to create a condition. But... I am re-imagining my HA setup.... and hence am using the estimated dusk/dawn. It has been cloudy and dreary here... so dusk seems to be a little late coming.
Title: Re: Where does WM100 get it's dusk/dawn times?
Post by: SkipWX10 on February 11, 2018, 04:59:45 PM
..... The fact that HA Dave shows Alexa and the WM100 match, does give one hope ;-)

I've only recently conceded to using a "mathematically calculated sunset/sunrise". Until recently I used the light sensor built into X10 PR511 floodlight to create a condition. But... I am re-imagining my HA setup.... and hence am using the estimated dusk/dawn. It has been cloudy and dreary here... so dusk seems to be a little late coming.

Using a sensor would give me the option of triggering something 'on' when it senses dusk, but my current timers are 60 minutes ahead of dusk. Were I smarter, I suppose I could create a dusk time based upon the previous day's dusk...but I ain't :-| Also, I do not have a PC running 24/7, my simple HA is all contained on the CM15 and amended with a PalmPad as needed.

To that, if the WM100 'estimated' dusk is close, it will work for me if the timers can be advanced 60 minutes, since the purpose of the advance is to be triggered while it is still light. Another option would be to manually reset the timer each month or appropriate interval...

I am happy to be back in the 'thinking' mode with HA, simple as my thinking is/needs to be. I thought X10 was cool as heck in the 70's when I first started using it for lights with a mini controller and mini timer (which I still use for Christmas lights!)....I still think it's cool as heck.
Title: Re: Where does WM100 get it's dusk/dawn times?
Post by: SkipWX10 on February 11, 2018, 05:05:58 PM

3. Dusk - dawn - works on that info. If you set DST on in the WM100, it will adjust time based on the setup.


I cannot find DST setting in the WM100 app....can you tell me where to find it? Thanks.
Title: Re: Where does WM100 get it's dusk/dawn times?
Post by: SkipWX10 on February 12, 2018, 04:28:49 PM
So...living by the mantra of RTFM, I came across this:

Dawn | Dusk
 
 This allows you to create
ON or OFF commands according to your
local dawn or dusk times (this does
require giving the app permission to
know your location.)


Looking at the app data on my phone, I see that one of the permissions is Location. It is spelled out in the listing as: "approximate location (network-based)" and "precise location (GPS and network-based)"

I do not recall ever giving specific permission for location, so just assume it was part of the standard wording when installing any app, i.e.: "this app requires access/permission to....etc, etc, etc.

End result, the app gets approximate dusk/dawn location info from your cell network.

And, just for fun, I wonder what happens if you decide to create a timer using dusk/dawn while on vacation 4 time zones away?
Title: Re: Where does WM100 get it's dusk/dawn times?
Post by: arizona480 on August 11, 2018, 10:47:44 PM
So at least initially your mobile device needs to be connected to a cellular network when you setup the hub, when you set the timers, or all the time?   If you have a wifi only device it cannot pull the necessary time and location data?
Title: Re: Where does WM100 get it's dusk/dawn times?
Post by: Tuicemen on August 12, 2018, 07:42:59 AM
You don't need to be connected to a cell network just your home network via Wi-Fi. even for initial setup.
In fact initial setup requires your phone to be on your network via Wi-fi 2 Ghz not 5 which most new phones seem to default to.
Title: Re: Where does WM100 get it's dusk/dawn times?
Post by: arizona480 on August 12, 2018, 10:30:40 PM
You don't need to be connected to a cell network just your home network via Wi-Fi. even for initial setup.
In fact initial setup requires your phone to be on your network via Wi-fi 2 Ghz not 5 which most new phones seem to default to.

Thanks, I'm in Arizona and DST tends to be an issue with devices, I haven't had a successful Dusk timer work the last two nights, anything else I should be aware of?
Title: Re: Where does WM100 get it's dusk/dawn times?
Post by: Tucson on August 12, 2018, 10:37:44 PM
Im here in AZ D/D is one hour late. It you set -60 it will compensate.

Also -90 does not work for me.