X10 Community Forum

📱🖥️PiX10Hub ( Always Evolving Open Source) => 💬General Discussion => Topic started by: Tuicemen on January 19, 2019, 09:30:35 AM

Title: Who is using or tried the PXH image?
Post by: Tuicemen on January 19, 2019, 09:30:35 AM
Several like my self wonder, How many x10 users have at least tried the image and with what x10 interface?
I included the cm17 because there is an addon which apparently allows it to be integrated into HG.
Some have tested this with several interfaces but l'm just interested in which your currently using.
Authinx has shown some interest in this project and has an idea of creating a new module similar to my cm15/ZeroW mod which puts a Pi inside the Cm15. I realize some have moved on to a more powerful Pi which this image doesn't work with but if your using a pi for X10 please still vote. The community that helped create this wonders if we wasted our time helping bring X10 to the Pi world for the rest of you! ::)
 >!
Title: Re: Who is using or tried the PXH image?
Post by: Brian H on January 20, 2019, 07:24:48 AM
I tried and tested the PiX10HUB with the Pi Zero W and Pi 3B. CM15A was the X10 controller.
My primary protocol is Insteon with a Primary X10 address in the modules. With an ISY994i.
So I have tested it but it is not my primary protocol in use.
Title: Re: Who is using or tried the PXH image?
Post by: Tuicemen on January 20, 2019, 08:36:52 AM
I actually have the PXH running on two Zero Ws. One is with a CM19 and is basically set as a Alexa Hub using the HG Echo Bridge. I also have a Zwave dongle attach to this for control of the few Zwave modules I have in use.

The second is on a Cm15 and set for remote access. Since the Echo Bridge fails to work with HG password protection enabled (right now) I require the two. Actually I could use HA-Bridge for Alexa control on this but find the echo bridge much more reliable and faster.

 I have a Pi 3B+ at my off grid place which runs HG but not this image it is connected to a Cm15. This one is also set for remote access. The 3B+ also acts as a streaming device so it is running Raspbian Stretch full (desktop version)instead of the lite version which the PXH uses.

 I'd love to see Authinx come out with a new module with the PL power of the WM100 but with a SBC like the pi inside. End users could decide what software to use just like they can now for the existing CM modules.

Title: Re: Who is using or tried the PXH image?
Post by: petera on January 20, 2019, 09:44:17 AM
I don't see any financial gain for a commercial entity to tool up for the production of a purely X10 focussed unit you describe. Potential unit sales in my opinion wouldn't justify it. Possibly a unit that would include support for X10 but would need to include many other protocols might just succeed.

A concept like you describe would be better suited to someone operating from their home workshop and building units to order. This flexibility would allow for a more "hands on" development approach in conjunction with an already established user base in the shape of this forum's membership or similar.

Personally, I think a well speced Raspberry Pi and a decent X10 controller would more than fill the requirements of any X10 user. My personal recommendation for reliability and flexibility is the Raspberry Pi 3b+ and a CM19.

While the aim at the outset of the project was to protect potential users from the Linux command line, I was pleased to see a number of users take the plunge and as a result now have their own personally tailored setup and are already expanding their setup beyond the original ideals of the project.

If Authinx intend to pursue an idea like this I highly recommend they employ an experienced systems designer/programmer and present them with a set goals from the outset so as to avoid the mistakes made when producing the WM100. Maybe then they could look at the commercial viability of a venture like that.

In the meantime the Raspberry Pi and X10 controller combination is doing nicely thank you. >!
Title: Re: Who is using or tried the PXH image?
Post by: Tuicemen on January 20, 2019, 10:15:06 AM
As much as I'd love to see a new X10 Module with SBC I can't see it happening either.
I suspect it is just a matter of time before someone hacks the WM100 when that happens I hope it can be implemented into Pi software. For now my pi ZeroW boards work just fine with either the Cm19 or Cm15 however my preferred controller (for now) is the Cm15.
 I agree the most reliable and flexible Pi is the 3B+ but I have to disagree with the Cm19 as the best controller. The Cm15 beats it hands down (at least here)
I guess if I didn't need to see PL signals a Cm19 and pi would be OK, but then I'd still need extra hardware to put the RF onto the PL .
>!
Title: Re: Who is using or tried the PXH image?
Post by: Geewiz on January 20, 2019, 10:36:16 AM
I definitely want to migrate from my PC based system to the Raspberry 3 B+ platform.  I started out with the Pi Zero and Tuicemen's ISO, but could not get a reliable command response over the wireless connection.  I then tried starting from scratch on the 3 B+ but, given my lack of general knowledge working with Linux, hit some roadblocks.   Given that I have the 3 B+ plugged directly into a network switch, the speed and reliability seemed to be every bit as good as on the PC system. 
I'm going to start over and see how far I can get.   

If I can get HomeGenie and Alexa working on the 3 B+, and have the X10 devices picked up in Smartthings, I'll be very happy.

Given Tuicemen's description of his 3 B+ setup, it seems this should be doable? 

As for somehow incorporating the an SBC into the CM15 housing, that is a low priority for me. 
Title: Re: Who is using or tried the PXH image?
Post by: petera on January 20, 2019, 12:00:47 PM

If I can get HomeGenie and Alexa working on the 3 B+, and have the X10 devices picked up in Smartthings, I'll be very happy.


That shouldn't be an issue. The EchoBridge is a Hue emulator so that looks after all your X10 modules/devices.

What type of devices are you using in Smart Things that actually requires using Smart Things in the first place.
Title: Re: Who is using or tried the PXH image?
Post by: Tuicemen on January 20, 2019, 01:28:30 PM
Geewiz, with Smartthings implemented Alexa & Google contol would be automatic.
I had started to play with adding HG to SmartThings (I even created a devicehandler) however since I don't use my google home
mini for automation I stopped playing with the concept.
Title: Re: Who is using or tried the PXH image?
Post by: Geewiz on January 20, 2019, 02:47:57 PM

That shouldn't be an issue. The EchoBridge is a Hue emulator so that looks after all your X10 modules/devices.

What type of devices are you using in Smart Things that actually requires using Smart Things in the first place.

I'm afraid I don't understand enough to give you a clear answer.  I only know that all my X10 devices are controllable through the Smartthings app, so everything is available in one interface.   I always assumed it was the presence of HA-Bridge/Alex10 that made the X10 devices discoverable by ST.
Title: Re: Who is using or tried the PXH image?
Post by: petera on January 20, 2019, 03:19:00 PM

That shouldn't be an issue. The EchoBridge is a Hue emulator so that looks after all your X10 modules/devices.

What type of devices are you using in Smart Things that actually requires using Smart Things in the first place.

I'm afraid I don't understand enough to give you a clear answer.  I only know that all my X10 devices are controllable through the Smartthings app, so everything is available in one interface.   I always assumed it was the presence of HA-Bridge/Alex10 that made the X10 devices discoverable by ST.

Are you talking about some form of Windows setup. Not needed with this setup.

Maybe at some stage in a new post if you could lay out exactly what devices you have hardware wise and exactly what you are trying to achieve here you could be mildly surprised that you don't in fact need Smart Things at all.

HG would be well capable of doing everything you require under one roof.
Title: Re: Who is using or tried the PXH image?
Post by: Tuicemen on January 20, 2019, 04:03:39 PM
@Geewiz Alex10 nor HA-Bridge is what made x10 devices appear in ST. If you were using my Smartcloud program it was that. If you don't have google home devices you can use the new Alexa app to control your devices from your phone which would be faster then the HG app or SmartThings. If you have a SmartThings hub I understand your wishing to use the SmartThings app. The SmartThings device handler I created for HG should do what you wish.  A link to that device handler can be found on my forum. If I remember right (once setup) you just need to point existing modules to use it instead of the x10 handler I created.
Title: Re: Who is using or tried the PXH image?
Post by: petera on January 20, 2019, 04:16:34 PM
There's an awful lot of bridges and handlers going on there Tuicemen  :) I was starting to get confused as to what bridge to cross and what handler to hold on to. :)%

I was just curious as to what hardware Geewiz had and how much of it could be integrated into HG with the minimum of fuss and where possible without the aid of 3rd party intervention. A working EchoBridge had already eliminated the need for the HA Bridge server.

Should be interesting to see what else can be integrated into HG and how many hubs could be done away with once it's established what hardware users possess.

Title: Re: Who is using or tried the PXH image?
Post by: Tuicemen on January 20, 2019, 05:15:31 PM
There's an awful lot of bridges and handlers going on there Tuicemen  :) I was starting to get confused as to what bridge to cross and what handler to hold on to. :)%
LOL
 There are a lot of options for sure. The cool thing is just about all can be made to work with HG if one wished.

I would imagine the Echo Bridge would have worked for Google Home had Google not switched to cloud only connections. SmartThings is cloud based so nothing gets added to HG or the device it runs on. It talks to HG via the HG API no extra server required.

The Echo Bridge only eliminated the Alexa control HA-Bridge made possible, it has not eliminated my need for the additional options HA-Bridge supplies. :(
Title: Re: Who is using or tried the PXH image?
Post by: hpm on January 21, 2019, 05:07:00 AM
The PiX10 image works adequately well using a CM15a interface, but the unsupervised shutdown of the Raspberry Pi does indeed corrupt the sd card. The lack of a reliable auto-restart (even with a UPS) makes it unusable for my purposes.  I guess an ISY994i is the best solution since the WM100 turned out to be a dismal failure.
Thanks for your efforts which have kept my 76 year old mind alert for a few days longer.
Title: Re: Who is using or tried the PXH image?
Post by: petera on January 21, 2019, 06:37:40 AM
The PiX10 image works adequately well using a CM15a interface, but the unsupervised shutdown of the Raspberry Pi does indeed corrupt the sd card. The lack of a reliable auto-restart (even with a UPS) makes it unusable for my purposes.  I guess an ISY994i is the best solution since the WM100 turned out to be a dismal failure.
Thanks for your efforts which have kept my 76 year old mind alert for a few days longer.

The unsupervised shutdown you refer to doesn't necessarily corrupt the SD card. It's just advised that you stop the homegenie service prior to unplugging the Raspberry Pi. I've unplugged the Raspberry Pi while HG is running many times without any adverse effects.

Of course you could transfer your setup to a USB key attach it to your Raspberry Pi and boot from there. The standard Raspberry Pi woukd suit better for that. That's another option.

Regarding an auto start, one simple line added to the homegenie.service file would overcome this. In the event of HG crashing the line "Restart=always" will immediately restart the homegenie service.

I'd hate to see you not continuing to use the PiX10 for the reasons you outline when there are clearly solutions to your concerns.
Title: Re: Who is using or tried the PXH image?
Post by: Geewiz on January 22, 2019, 07:19:37 AM
...I was just curious as to what hardware Geewiz had and how much of it could be integrated into HG with the minimum of fuss and where possible without the aid of 3rd party intervention.

I started out with X10 back at the turn of the century  ;D and have about 20 lamp and appliance modules.  I installed the XTB-II coupler repeater and that has made a world of difference in getting PLC's across our 4500 sqft house.  I had a dedicated X10 server running 24/7 and, save for a few system crashes over the years, the X10 system has worked very well. 

The last computer crash I had a couple of years ago, and the ensuing difficulty I had rebuilding the system, got me thinking that it might be time to start looking at alternative home automation platforms...especially in light of X10 going out of business.

A couple of years ago I picked up a Smartthings package at a good price and found integrating various modules was extremely easy, and building routines was a snap.  So, I started transitioning over to Smartthings. 

Then I discovered Tuicemen's Alex10, and my enthusiasm with X10 was wholly renewed.  Integrating voice commands into Alexa gave X10 a whole new life! 

So now I have a rather eclectic variety of systems working together: X10 Active Home running on a dedicated PC + Alex10 + Alexa + Smartthings.

I'm currently using about 15 X10 devices, all of them appliance, lamp, and wall switch modules.  I also have about 20 Smartthings devices which include smart bulbs, wall plugs, motion sensors, and door sensors.

I'm excited about the prospect of moving the X10 control to the Raspberry Pi.  I'd really like to retire that PC!  I really appreciate all the help, advice, and innovation that all of you have provided over the years!
Title: Re: Who is using or tried the PXH image?
Post by: Tuicemen on January 22, 2019, 10:56:51 AM
Geewiz are you looking to add SmartThings devices to HG, or just X10 devices to your SmartThings hub/app, or both?
I'm a bit confused as to what exactly your hoping to do.
Title: Re: Who is using or tried the PXH image?
Post by: dave w on January 26, 2019, 10:34:05 AM
The last computer crash I had a couple of years ago, and the ensuing difficulty I had rebuilding the system, got me thinking that it might be time to start looking at alternative home automation platforms...especially in light of X10 going out of business.

I'm excited about the prospect of moving the X10 control to the Raspberry Pi.  I'd really like to retire that PC! 
Rabbit trail follows:

Since about 2005 I have ran our X10 smart home from a Homeseer desktop server. In the past I have had a couple of hard drive failures,  so always feared the day the Homeseer server drive would spin its last.

I saw last November, Best Buy had Solid State Drives at prices too cheap to pass on. A 1 Tbyte SSD was barely $100 and a 300 GB was so cheap the next best thing would have been, they pay me to take.

Anywho I upgraded to a Samsung SSD, replacing the old hard drive with it. Samsung migration software was easy and flawless. The server now draws less power, runs cooler, is much faster when booting or preforming other tasks besides running the house.

I still want to try the Pi X10 HG fix, but I have 89 X10 devices and 127 events (macros, some quite long)  in Homeseer so am postponing rebuilding every thing in HG as long as I can.

Rabbit trail ends.
Title: Re: Who is using or tried the PXH image?
Post by: Tuicemen on January 26, 2019, 11:12:25 AM
Rebuilding your setup in HG (actually any software) will be a long process though rewarding I'm sure.
Entering the devices is simple the macros and timers will take the most time to setup however you could slowly move over things over running both setups if you have a spare x10 controller which most of us long time users do. Start with the simple things first. Take baby steps and you'll not be disappointed.
 >!
Title: Re: Who is using or tried the PXH image?
Post by: alzy on January 26, 2019, 12:21:46 PM
I have tried the PXH image with both the cm19 and cm11 on the Pi Z W. I could never get it to trigger the cm19 reliably even though I tried it on 2  Pi Z W's from 2 different suppliers and with 2 different cm19s  (both cm19s work perfectly with Alex10 software and were in the same physical location and same "environment" during testing). I had 2 issues, one was long delay times to trigger and the other was often it would take 2 clicks of the HG widget to get the cm19 to respond. I did not see these issues with the cm11, but I do need to do more testing with Alexa and the HGEB, which I will do once the HGEB is released with the dim capability update. If the Alexa response time proves to be on the order of a second or so and Alexa dimming works well , I plan to gradually move my system to the PIXH. I may have to go to a PI 3 to get the respond times acceptable.
I was disappointed to hear reports that the PXH install could be corrupted by a power failure and the sd card image would have to be replaced but I can power the hub off an existing ups to help mitigate this issue. I have 2 other R Pi's and an Arduino running that are not on a UPS, which have applications running that have shown to be immune to PS interruptions.

I have a system of about 30 x10 devices and 50+ macros.

I would like to thank all those involved in developing HG, the HGEB, and the PXH for their work and for all the support provided me during my testing. THANKS!  >!
Title: Re: Who is using or tried the PXH image?
Post by: HA Dave on January 26, 2019, 05:44:26 PM
...Since about 2005 I have ran our X10 smart home from a Homeseer desktop server....
.I still want to try the Pi X10 HG fix, but I have 89 X10 devices and 127 events (macros, some quite long)  in Homeseer so am postponing rebuilding every thing in HG as long as I can.

Don't. Don't rebuild, that is. I've also switched to Homeseer.... and have also been experimenting other brands/devices/protocols/flavors/etc. This is a brand new age of Home Automation. So freaking much has changed since X10 was push-button-lighting-control. it would be too long of a post to even try to type out. Let alone remain historically accurate.

When I had the chance to "rebuild" my setup.... I already had an Echo dot, MyQ garage door, a Wink Hub... and more. I realized I had to re-imagine my Home Automation setup..

Re-imagining a new setup was a difficult leap of faith. It meant disassembling some of my favorite parts of my setup. And even though the initial Hometroller was originally fernracer's and gifted to me... there was still some expenses and effort involved.

Imagine what your setup might look like... how it might function... with the technologies you plan to exploit in your new project. Lean heavily on it's best parts and shy away from its faults. Build the setup that best fits what you have to work with. Just My Humble Opinion
Title: Re: Who is using or tried the PXH image?
Post by: LostDog88 on January 26, 2019, 06:58:25 PM
I leaped today. Into the unknown world of RPi and HG.

Aside from a couple of annoyances, I had the system up and running in about 10 minutes after I wrote the SD card.

Seriously. It was 10 minutes. I made a backup of the old system, followed the directions to setup the X10Hub and restored to the new system.

Done....all seems to work. Except a couple of config changes that I posted in another thread I would like to fix.