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Author Topic: Disarming DS7000 remotely?  (Read 211870 times)

Puck

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Re: Disarming DS7000 remotely?
« Reply #30 on: October 12, 2006, 07:00:56 PM »

I just did the test, and I'm also concerned about this one.

I held an off button down on one of my palm pad remotes and was able to open a door without the DS7000 detecting it, plus I walked all around my house (tripping every ActiveEye) without it registering in the activity monitor.

I'm not sure what X10 could do about a jamming signal with the DS7000 (aside from a complete redesign to spread spectrum), but they should be able to help counter this in AHP. If there is someway AHP could detect multiple same-signals over a short time frame, then a macro could be triggered to set off the power horns through the power lines (bypass the RF & DS7000).

I'm certain the DS7000 doesn't listen for PLC signals but it would be nice if you could trigger the PANIC that way.

Until then, keep them cameras rolling (if the motion detectors can get their signal through to turn them on  :- )
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KDR

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Re: Disarming DS7000 remotely?
« Reply #31 on: October 12, 2006, 07:20:02 PM »

I just tested this with the Radio Shack 49-1000 and get the same results. Any X10 remote transmitting while you trip a security sensor deactivates the sensor. All one would need is a remote... press a button and hold... then walk right in. Activity monitor does not record the security sensor event. If Activity monitor doesn't record the event I'm not sure changes to the program would help at all.

BIG PROBLEM FOR X10
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Puck

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Re: Disarming DS7000 remotely?
« Reply #32 on: October 12, 2006, 07:29:08 PM »

If Activity monitor doesn't record the event I'm not sure changes to the program would help at all.

BIG PROBLEM FOR X10

Sorry, I should have started that the activity monitor continued to show the repetition of the button on the remote I was holding down. I'm sure when I opened the door or walked past the motion sensors that the 2 signals interfered with each other and didn't register, but once the door was open or motion detector stopped transmitting, the remote continued to register repeatedly. This is where a possible software detection could work. ( unless the burglar is real crafty with an awesome sense of timing ;) :) )


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KDR

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Re: Disarming DS7000 remotely?
« Reply #33 on: October 12, 2006, 07:40:23 PM »

There is no communication to the security console by way of PLC signals. If AHP software could detect what was going on it would have to send RF to the security console. As long as the remote button is held down it blocks the signals to AHP and the security console so no alarm would trigger.
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Puck

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Re: Disarming DS7000 remotely?
« Reply #34 on: October 12, 2006, 08:26:46 PM »

Correct, RF would be disabled so the DS7000 would be useless, however AHP could still send ALL LightsOn/All Lights OFF "DIRECTLY" to the power lines through the CM15A... thus flashing lights and triggering power horns.... it could even send emails for external notification.
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KDR

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Re: Disarming DS7000 remotely?
« Reply #35 on: October 12, 2006, 08:37:38 PM »

True... Didn't think of that.  Was more focused on the alarm portion of the system. I already have those things in place but are triggered by AHP getting the sensor RF signal. It will be interesting to see if X10 responds to any of this. Does anyone know if any of their other systems act this way. Like the 2000?
« Last Edit: October 12, 2006, 08:39:27 PM by KDR »
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tom j

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Re: Disarming DS7000 remotely?
« Reply #36 on: October 13, 2006, 02:37:56 AM »

I just tested this with the Radio Shack 49-1000 and get the same results. Any X10 remote transmitting while you trip a security sensor deactivates the sensor. All one would need is a remote... press a button and hold... then walk right in. Activity monitor does not record the security sensor event. If Activity monitor doesn't record the event I'm not sure changes to the program would help at all.

BIG PROBLEM FOR X10

KDR You read my mind I was just getting ready to ask you that very question. I thought they would of addressed this in the newer 49-1000 they had to be aware of it. I think the problem is that the console is just not sophisticated enough to process two signals simultaneously so while it's trying to process one it's can attend to the other. And yes I agree this is a HUGE PROBLEM FOR X10 but will they do any thing about it I think we'll going to need an e-mail campaign what do ya guys think  ??? Boy x10 advertises how they recruit the best engineers from around the world to design their products, Yeah Right! someone needs to lose their job over this oversight really!

Tcj
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Snoochy

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Re: Disarming DS7000 remotely?
« Reply #37 on: October 13, 2006, 09:56:39 AM »

I agree that this is a major issue as well.  Not likely something X10 will respond to very soon.  I will have to rethink my new system.  The key is not to tell anyone you have this system, so it is less likey for a theif to know (and of course don't put that silly decal in your window advertising you have an x10 system!!).

I think I am fortunate that I still have my old hard wired security system in place at home as well...I was thinking of adding a universal module on to the siren, so if I continue to arm my old system (which is not monitored), then the triggering of the siren can at least activate macros through PLC and email me as well (just in case).  Pretty sad that we have to have this kind of backup in place due to a flaw in X10!! >:(
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rpatty

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Re: Disarming DS7000 remotely?
« Reply #38 on: October 13, 2006, 11:34:24 AM »

We recently purchased and installed the Radio Shack 49-1000. Our door and motion sensors are holdovers from the previous DS7000 system.  We have 3 remotes:  2 Keychain Remotes (One KR31A and One KR10A), and 1 larger remote. 
Pressing and holding a button on either of the keychain remotes did not cause the system to 'not alarm'.  Actually, it appears the keychain remotes transmit a single RF burst signal; even if a key is constantly depressed.  Even while holding the button down, and opening a window, the alarm still activated.
However, the larger remote did jam the sensor signals and seems to transmit a constant RF signal as indicated by the remote LED constantly flashing.  Sensors were ineffective.
As someone mentioned in an earlier post, if a burglar is semi-sophisticated enough to bring a remote (or any RF transmitter operating on the proper frequency) and jam our system; then they will get in no matter what you do. 
Just wanted to pass on our experience with the remotes and system jamming.

v/r
Bob P
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p2459

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Re: Disarming DS7000 remotely?
« Reply #39 on: October 13, 2006, 12:19:43 PM »

I'm sorry to say I think this is really pathetic, and unless a solution for this problem is found soon
I'm going to need to return all this equipment to the distributor. If it isn't bad enough that they
use fixed (static) codes instead of the preferred random (secure) code method, now we learn
that anyone can easily bypass an X10 system with little effort and expense.

There is something far more troubling about this problem that I discovered while doing tests,
but I hesitate to post it in case any thieves are reading these boards.

This problem is a disaster, and must be addressed asap.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2006, 12:22:37 PM by p2459 »
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tom j

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Re: Disarming DS7000 remotely?
« Reply #40 on: October 13, 2006, 07:56:18 PM »

I doubt very much that the thieves reading this forum knows where I live.
And even if they did, they don't have any idea what else I may have in store for them.
As has been stated over & over again. If someone really wants to get into your home they will !
Locks & Security systems are only a deterrant to persons who are not determined to get into that particular place.
They would rather move on to one that isn't locked or protected in any way.

Of all the people that live where you do.
You would have to be specifically singled out and in that case they would get in anyway.



Well that may be true but this is like leaving all your doors unlocked and rolling out the welcome mat!!
 >:( :-\
Tcj
« Last Edit: October 13, 2006, 10:26:11 PM by tom j »
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tom j

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Re: Disarming DS7000 remotely?
« Reply #41 on: October 13, 2006, 10:21:01 PM »


Quote
Well that may be true but this is like leaving all your doors unlocked and rolling out the welcome sign!!
 >:( :-\
Tcj

 ??? I'm sorry but I don't quite understand what you're saying.
Please explain how this is as you've stated.

I was just saying that it would really make it easy real easy for some scumbag to break in if he had one of those remotes. I understand what your saying but if someone knew how to get around your system it would remove any possible intimidation they might of had. The whole thing about a security system is that the bad guy feels he might get caught but if he can circumvent your system he would feel much less intimidated. And I tend to disagree I feel a security system will definitely keep the bad guys out. My house was broken into and believe me if not for that little x10 system they would have cleaned me out had all my expensive stereo equipment unplugged by the time I got home with my door hanging off the hinges let me tell ya it's a sight you would never forget, but 4 large powerhorns and an aftermarket x10 outdoor siren and the fact that all my lights are x10 controlled proved to much for them my neighbors said my house looked alive and the *&^%$# left and didn't even get a dime. Believe me they wanted that stuff but they haven't been back and that's been two years. After that realizing how important a system was I started putting together a hybrid system a real super system so when I'm on vacation or at work I won't have to worry but if x10 was going to be my main system with this flaw I would really be concerned.

Tcj
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tom j

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Re: Disarming DS7000 remotely?
« Reply #42 on: October 14, 2006, 12:17:23 PM »

I'm sorry to say I think this is really pathetic, and unless a solution for this problem is found soon
I'm going to need to return all this equipment to the distributor. If it isn't bad enough that they
use fixed (static) codes instead of the preferred random (secure) code method, now we learn
that anyone can easily bypass an X10 system with little effort and expense.

There is something far more troubling about this problem that I discovered while doing tests,
but I hesitate to post it in case any thieves are reading these boards.

This problem is a disaster, and must be addressed asap.

Yep Ditto to that Amen Brother!!  ;D

Tcj
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tom j

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Re: Disarming DS7000 remotely?
« Reply #43 on: October 14, 2006, 06:57:50 PM »

I agree that the flaw should be fixed right away.

However, I'm not concerned at all about someone breaking in.

My housesitter Otis, is a German Shephard / Pit Bull mix.

I got some company to, 2 Smith & Wessons Alex and Bill one's in 40 cal and the other is a 9 mm and they got a pretty nasty bite to!!

Tcj

« Last Edit: March 03, 2007, 12:14:37 AM by tom j »
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Dan Lawrence

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Re: Disarming DS7000 remotely?
« Reply #44 on: October 14, 2006, 08:15:06 PM »

I agree that the flaw should be fixed right away.

However, I'm not concerned at all about someone breaking in.

My housesitter Otis, is a German Shephard / Pit Bull mix.

So, that's why your handle changed!!!  Obviously, Otis got pieved when he wasn't allowed to post here.
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