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Author Topic: Security randomness within macro  (Read 7558 times)

myron18

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Security randomness within macro
« on: August 02, 2007, 12:38:43 PM »

I want to program a macro with 3 modules A, B and C, each having a separate timer with the security switches checked. Assuming the macro is correctly written and triiggered, if the modules are timed so that B will turn on 15 min. after A, and C timed so that it turns on 15 min after B, do the individual security settings within the macro work independently. For instance, could the security setting on the A module add 30' to the it's start time, and the C module security subtract 30', so that C might actually start before A? Or do all security adjustments within a macro have the same "random" adjustments?
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Oldtimer

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Re: Security randomness within macro
« Reply #1 on: August 02, 2007, 03:05:08 PM »

I want to program a macro with 3 modules A, B and C, each having a separate timer with the security switches checked. Assuming the macro is correctly written and triiggered, if the modules are timed so that B will turn on 15 min. after A, and C timed so that it turns on 15 min after B, do the individual security settings within the macro work independently. For instance, could the security setting on the A module add 30' to the it's start time, and the C module security subtract 30', so that C might actually start before A? Or do all security adjustments within a macro have the same "random" adjustments?

Several of us will probably chime in on this but here's my view of the situation.  First you have to clarify in your mind the differences between Timers and Macros when it comes to controlling modules.  Security adjustments only apply to Timers.  Timers and/or Macros can activate a module.  Timers can also activate Macros.  So the answer to your question is that all the modules inside the macro have the same single random offset as the Timer on the Macro independant of the Timers on the same modules outside the Macro.

As a practical matter I don't think the average criminal is going to spend enough time let alone days watching your house to be aware of the subtle difference we're talking about.  My daily "Away" macros are in four separate groups, two randomized and two not.  If I wanted to make it really sophisticated I'd have them set up in two or three separate groups of four to run on different days of the week with different module sequences in each along with the randomization.

Finally if there was anything in your house valuable enough for someone to case it for as long as a week you probably could afford, and should have, a professionally installed system anyway.
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HA Dave

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Re: Security randomness within macro
« Reply #2 on: August 02, 2007, 07:06:08 PM »


As a practical matter I don't think the average criminal is going to spend enough time let alone days watching your house to be aware of the subtle difference we're talking about............................ 
Finally if there was anything in your house valuable enough for someone to case it for as long as a week you probably could afford, and should have, a professionally installed system anyway.


Oldtimer is right! My "away" lighting: I leave a light on. I also have yard lighting and lots of motion sensors and floodlights outside.
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myron18

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Re: Security randomness within macro
« Reply #3 on: August 02, 2007, 10:07:50 PM »

Thanks for your comment Oldtimer, I agree with your 2nd paragraph. re: your 1st paragraph. I may have the details of how a macro works wrong, but........

Let me expand on my question. I want to write a macro, triggerred by a single event, and include 3 modules, each having a different timer with security set. Since the macro itself isn't icontrolled by a timer, each module should be independently controlled for on/off times. Are the times in the 3 modules individually randomiized, or because they're included within a single macro, they all have the same offset minutes even though each may  be calculated at a different point in the clock cycle? You may have already answered this, but I couldn't catch it.
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Oldtimer

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Re: Security randomness within macro
« Reply #4 on: August 02, 2007, 10:29:22 PM »


Since the macro itself isn't icontrolled by a timer, each module should be independently controlled for on/off times. Are the times in the 3 modules individually randomized, or because they're included within a single macro, they all have the same offset minutes even though each may  be calculated at a different point in the clock cycle? You may have already answered this, but I couldn't catch it.


Let's take this one step at a time.

The three modules in the macro are going to have the same randomized offset minutes as the security timer that starts the macro.  No security timer for the macro equals no offsets for the modules. The modules are not individually randomized even if you have checked the security block in their timers external from the macro.
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myron18

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Re: Security randomness within macro
« Reply #5 on: August 03, 2007, 05:20:36 PM »

Thanks again Oldtimer. It's not obvious to me that the timers within the macro shouldn't be independent of the controlling macro timer. I hadn't gotten that far in my testing. I suppose my logic is also going to fall apart when I consider nested macros.
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Oldtimer

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Re: Security randomness within macro
« Reply #6 on: August 03, 2007, 10:38:55 PM »

Thanks again Oldtimer. It's not obvious to me that the timers within the macro shouldn't be independent of the controlling macro timer. I hadn't gotten that far in my testing. I suppose my logic is also going to fall apart when I consider nested macros.

MYRON18: I think you're correct again, a nested macro does not take its associated timers with it when you call it, with a dummy module of course, from another macro.

The thing to keep in mind is that what is inside a macro command string are commands to have the CM15A send control signals to a specific modules.   What is inside a module or macro icon timer is a command to send a signal to that module or to start the macro running at a certain time and date with or without a security offset.

The only visible common element between the module icon and its presence in the macro is its name and house code/unit code. There is a hidden, AHP generated "serial number" for the combination that keeps track of it so you can can change the house/unit code and/or the name at the module icon and have them changed automatically inside any macros where they also appear.

« Last Edit: August 04, 2007, 08:28:09 AM by Oldtimer »
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myron18

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Re: Security randomness within macro
« Reply #7 on: August 06, 2007, 06:25:03 PM »

Oldtimer, you're going to tire of me very quickly. If I understand correctly what you're saying............. If Macro A has a timer set for 8PM, and it calls Macro B, the signal from A will trigger B, but B must have its own included timer to trigger its included modules. If that's correct, must B have 8PM set as one of it's triggering conditions?

Is there a practical limit to the number of levels of nested macros? And must each macro have it's own included timer?

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Oldtimer

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Re: Security randomness within macro
« Reply #8 on: August 06, 2007, 09:09:22 PM »

Oldtimer, you're going to tire of me very quickly. If I understand correctly what you're saying............. If Macro A has a timer set for 8PM, and it calls Macro B, the signal from A will trigger B, but B must have its own included timer to trigger its included modules. If that's correct, must B have 8PM set as one of it's triggering conditions?

Is there a practical limit to the number of levels of nested macros? And must each macro have it's own included timer?



Macro A will call Macro B independant of any timers included in B.  B's timers, if any, will start Macro B independant of A.

I don't have an exact answer as to how many Macro's can be nested.  Have you done a search on the forum for that or related topics?
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