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Author Topic: What's the difference between the 2-way Transceiver and the Transceiver?  (Read 6890 times)

mcampbell

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On this page...  http://www.x10.com/catalog/home_automation.html?TWENTY11 ... at the very bottom there is a "Wireless Transceiver" and "2-way Wireless Transciever".

What is the difference?  They both act as a lamp module, and both accept RF signals and broadcast those signals to the AC lines.  What does one do that the other cannot?
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dave w

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The "2-Way transceiver" will transmit it's status on the powerline when polled, or when it's status is changed by a command.
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Brian H

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The RR501 "Two-Way Tranceiver" also has a power line receiver in it and can be remotely controlled by a power line signal.
The latest TM751 "One-way Tranceiver" doesn't have the built in appliance style relay and can't control anything plugged into it. The sales page now says a pass through outlet and other here have also verified no switched outlet on a TM751.

One of the on line automation dealers is listing the RR501 as discontinued.
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dave w

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The sales page now says a pass through outlet and other here have also verified no switched outlet on a TM751.

It is no wonder people complain about X10 advertising. When they drop an important feature like the controlled outlet in the TM751 and make it a "pass through" one would think the web master would do a search on all their web pages and correct the description throughout, not just on the products main sale page. Even the TM751 main sale page states "also can be used as an Appliance Module."

The "Bang, bang, bang" heard in the background is X10 continuing to shoot themselves in the foot.
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Brian H

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Yes the features still say "Also an Appliance Module" while the main body of the TM751s description says "pass through outlet".

I did ask a user about their new one. As they also said a sticker was glued over the hole in the front cover where the local control button use to be. Would not want to waste a perfectly good front cover just because it has an unused hole in it.
« Last Edit: May 14, 2012, 12:47:47 PM by Brian H »
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dhouston

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Would not want to waste a perfectly good front cover just because it has an unused hole in it.

UL might think differently.
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starterbulb

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Would not want to waste a perfectly good front cover just because it has an unused hole in it.

UL might think differently.

You are right.  I recently purchased the "newer" TM751 with just the pass through feature. It also has the little X10 logo sticker over the hole on the front cover.

This module is missing the UL logo on the back. The little round sticker shows the production code of 12B08.


I also have an older TM751 with the built-in appliance module feature. This module does have the UL certification logo on the back.

I am concerned about this. Was this just an oversight on X10's part or perhaps this new updated TM751 can't pass UL standards, hence no UL logo on the module.  Does anyone have any insight to the UL certification process?
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Brian H

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Thank you for confirming the changes to the latest TM751.

I believe it would have to be re-certified and the sticker over the hole isn't going to fly.
UL certification also is not cheap and is a lengthy process.
Peel the sticker off the hole and stick a piece of metal into it. Bang or worse person inserting the metal gets a nasty shock.
« Last Edit: May 19, 2012, 06:41:15 PM by Brian H »
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dhouston

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There has long been a hole in the rear cover of the RR501. It's under the label and allows tuning the RF section (I think). It's in an inherently safer location (normally against the wall) and the tunable IF transformer beneath it pretty much blocks access to the circuit board itself so I believe UL was OK with it - IIRC the UL logo is on the rear label of the RR501. However, this hole in the front cover would concern me as it might allow contact with line voltage which is present at the rotary switch contacts. And it's at a height that's particularly accessible to inquisitive toddlers. I would return it or deep-six it if I had toddlers about. Or, you might epoxy a piece of plastic over the hole - that would be safer than a sticker although it will probably score a low SAF.

UL has a website but you can spend an eternity there trying to research something like this.

And, I would hazard a guess that, if they have a large inventory of cases, they have an equally large inventory of labels with the UL logo so IMNSHO, the lack of the UL logo is telling.
« Last Edit: May 19, 2012, 07:39:07 PM by dhouston »
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starterbulb

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UL has a website but you can spend an eternity there trying to research something like this.

And, I would hazard a guess that, if they have a large inventory of cases, they have an equally large inventory of labels with the UL logo so IMNSHO, the lack of the UL logo is telling.

I did some research on the UL website and found the following:

TM751 (original transceiver with appliance module feature) is UL listed.
RR501 (X10 version) is UL listed.
PAT01 (X10 Pro version) is UL listed.
TM751A (new version with little sticker covering hole on front cover) is not UL listed and does not have the UL logo on the back informational sticker on the transceiver.

With all the problems that X10 seems to be having - factory shutting down and then having to find a new one, items out of stock, less than stellar customer service, I hope this lack of UL certification is a one time thing or maybe X10 is now willing to let things slide a bit on the safety side...
« Last Edit: May 20, 2012, 07:44:31 PM by starterbulb »
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Brian H

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I guess the UL Listing has not been updated yet or X10 anticipated a problem and removed the Logo.  :'
I checked E63636 the blanket certification that covers almost all of the X10 models.
The TM751 is still on the list last updated 2012-05-15.  :o
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