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Author Topic: Help with the outdoor light toggle switch please..  (Read 9574 times)

Galileo2000

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Help with the outdoor light toggle switch please..
« on: January 19, 2008, 09:34:26 PM »

Good Saturday Evening All,

Long time reader, first time poster.

Excellent site, lot of useful info.

I succesfully employ x10 in my house, all rooms have lighting control thru IR-543, RR501, TM 751, wall switches etc.

However, I have a problem.

My outdoor lights are controlled with the mechanical toggle switch inside CFGI box. In order to operate it NEEDS to be a toggle ($1) switch.

Old house and no neutral.

I want to incorporate x10 into this equation, so I can turn on outdoor lights from inside sending x10 command. On the other hand, I'd like to keep the mechanical switch functional as well.

I am pulling my hair trying to find a soulution.

There are couple of x10 toggle switches (Insteon x10-compatible I believe), but they all require a neutral which I don't have.

Googled forum and Web for many hours. No light in the end of the tunnel :(

Some sort of inline module maybe?

Help please, much appreciated.
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Dan Lawrence

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Re: Help with the outdoor light toggle switch please..
« Reply #1 on: January 19, 2008, 11:05:25 PM »

An X-10 wall switch (WS467) could do what you want, it does not require a neutral, but I'm not sure what mounting it in a CFGI box would do.  It would replace the toggle switch as far as function.
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Galileo2000

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Re: Help with the outdoor light toggle switch please..
« Reply #2 on: January 19, 2008, 11:43:40 PM »

Dan,
The problem with WS467 as well as other available X10 switches (WS12A etc.) is they don't have that "regular" On/Off "long" button which goes into the CFGI box from the inside in order to operate the switch manually from the outside. Otherwise it would be really easy.

Thanks anyway.
« Last Edit: January 19, 2008, 11:45:19 PM by Galileo2000 »
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HA Dave

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Re: Help with the outdoor light toggle switch please..
« Reply #3 on: January 20, 2008, 06:38:48 AM »


My outdoor lights are controlled with the mechanical toggle switch inside CFGI box. In order to operate it NEEDS to be a toggle ($1) switch............ I want to incorporate x10 into this equation, so I can turn on outdoor lights from inside sending x10 command.


What are these "outdoor lights"?

I recently read that SocketRockets can be used indoors or OUT. But I like X10's floodlights so much... it was worth some re-wiring to install them. To make one floodlight easy to install, the old fashion toggle switch is NOT handy. However, since I haven't used the manual switch since installation day... that hasn't been a problem.

I also use the Black&Decker weather-proof plug-in modules (still available at smarthome.com). And have considered the 2-pin appliance module modification... to make it a wired-in module. The mod... as I remember.. was just replacing the "plug" parts with wire leads and sealing the case.

I should also mention.. that for both security and decorative purposes... I use the low-voltage landscape lawnlamps.

Of course... NONE of what I've done has given me any dimming abilities with my outside lighting.

« Last Edit: January 20, 2008, 08:24:15 AM by Dave_x10_L »
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Brian H

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Re: Help with the outdoor light toggle switch please..
« Reply #4 on: January 20, 2008, 07:31:23 AM »

Dave; I actually found some B&D Modules including the outdoor ones at a local overstock store. Any type $5.00 ea. ;D
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Oldtimer

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Re: Help with the outdoor light toggle switch please..
« Reply #5 on: January 20, 2008, 11:54:01 AM »


My outdoor lights are controlled with the mechanical toggle switch inside CFGI box. In order to operate it NEEDS to be a toggle ($1) switch.


I have no idea what a "switch inside CFGI box" is. When I tried to Google variations on "CFGI", Google had nothing but typo variants of CFCI which I don't think is what Galileo2000 is refering to.  Can someone give me a better description so I can research it and see what it looks like.
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Tuicemen

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Re: Help with the outdoor light toggle switch please..
« Reply #6 on: January 20, 2008, 12:39:34 PM »

I'm with oldtimer on this! ??? ::) ???
Perhaps Galileo2000 can post a pic of this  box! ;)
The only  thing I can find is a GFCI Load Center
As I've always stated a Pic is worth a thousand words! ;) In this case lots of answers! ;) :D ;D
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Galileo2000

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Re: Help with the outdoor light toggle switch please..
« Reply #7 on: January 20, 2008, 01:09:12 PM »

Guys,

Thank you for trying to help.

Dave:
"Outside lights" are two lanterns with 3 bulds each, so SocketRockets are out of the question.

Oldtimer and Tuicemen:

Obviously I meant something like GFI/GFCI (note to myself: don't use abbs I don't understand).

Picture is below. As you can see, the switch from the outside requires "regular" toggle switch to operate.


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steven r

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Re: Help with the outdoor light toggle switch please..
« Reply #8 on: January 20, 2008, 03:16:58 PM »

...Picture is below. As you can see, the switch from the outside requires "regular" toggle switch to operate.



Just to clarify, as least for me anyway, does this outside plate mechanically switch a regular switch under it?
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Galileo2000

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Re: Help with the outdoor light toggle switch please..
« Reply #9 on: January 20, 2008, 03:34:44 PM »

...Picture is below. As you can see, the switch from the outside requires "regular" toggle switch to operate.



Just to clarify, as least for me anyway, does this outside plate mechanically switch a regular switch under it?

It does exactly this.
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Oldtimer

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Re: Help with the outdoor light toggle switch please..
« Reply #10 on: January 20, 2008, 04:19:57 PM »

If you say there is no neutral in the box under this waterproof mechanical switch adapter then I have to assume that there are just two wires to this box from another box somewhere else that has both hot and neutral in it.  If that is the case then any 2 wire X10 3 way module could be put where the other box is located and the two wires you have running to your mechanical switch box would be used for an "X10" companion switch.  In your case the "companion" switch wouldn't be made by X10 but would be any waterproof momentary action, make when pushed, button with a waterproof plate that would replace your mechanical switch plate.  I believe such buttons are readily available and in this case don't have to carry any current to speak of.
« Last Edit: January 20, 2008, 04:36:11 PM by Oldtimer »
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Galileo2000

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Re: Help with the outdoor light toggle switch please..
« Reply #11 on: January 20, 2008, 04:39:49 PM »

If you say there is no neutral in the box under this waterproof mechanical switch adapter then I have to assume that there are just two wires to this box from another box somewhere else that has both hot and neutral in it.  If that is the case then any 2 wire X10 module could be put where the other box is located and the two wires you have running to your mechanical switch box would be used for an "X10" companion switch.  In your case the "companion" switch wouldn't be made by X10 but would be any waterproof momentary action, make when pushed, button with a waterproof plate that would replace your mechanical switch plate.  I believe such buttons are readily available and in this case don't have to carry any current to speak of.

Well, I could not find any waterproof plates with the pushbuttons either. If something like that exists, then it would be easy. Replace "regular" toggle switch with WS467, replace front metal cover with the pushbutton weatherproof cover - done!

Links to the above mentioned weatherproof/pushbutton covers would be great.

Thanks.
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steven r

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Re: Help with the outdoor light toggle switch please..
« Reply #12 on: January 20, 2008, 04:48:34 PM »

...then I have to assume that there are just two wires to this box from another box somewhere else...
Hmm... I didn't read into Galileo2000 description that there was another switch that controlled the lights. Also his plate is labeled with an ON and an OFF which would make me think it is not a 3-way setup.

Galileo2000: Is there more than one switch that controls the same light?

Well, I could not find any waterproof plates with the pushbuttons either. If something like that exists, then it would be easy. Replace "regular" toggle switch with WS467, replace front metal cover with the pushbutton weatherproof cover - done!...
That should work for a single switch application if you find them.
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Knightrider

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Re: Help with the outdoor light toggle switch please..
« Reply #13 on: January 20, 2008, 05:13:46 PM »

try a togglelinc from smarthome.
http://www.smarthome.com/2466dw.html
x10 compatible
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Oldtimer

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Re: Help with the outdoor light toggle switch please..
« Reply #14 on: January 20, 2008, 05:16:52 PM »


Well, I could not find any waterproof plates with the pushbuttons either. If something like that exists, then it would be easy. Replace "regular" toggle switch with WS467, replace front metal cover with the pushbutton weatherproof cover - done!


I couldn't either in the few minutes I just had available but try this link.  

http://www.go2marine.com/product.do?no=16528F&WT.mc_id=gb1

It's a marine product that should work in this application.  You'd drill a hole in a blank waterproof plate to mount it and install it with pipe joint compound or silicone sealer around the inside of the gap between the plate and the switch to keep out moisture.  Note that you'll need both the pushbutton switch and the waterproof pushbutton cover.

What I was visualizing when I wrote my post was an industrial product that may not be cataloged by Google.
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