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Author Topic: True X10 Compatible Toggle Switch (Modification)  (Read 37831 times)

Dave4720

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Re: True X10 Compatible Toggle Switch (Modification)
« Reply #15 on: November 08, 2010, 06:35:23 PM »

In a thinly disguised attempt to pat myself on the back, I can report that my toggle switch modification has worked well the past few months.

I did change the capacitor to 10uF to lengthen the pseudo “button press” to a healthy one-second plus.  The lights now work as well as X10 does in general … meaning rare-but-non-zero malfunctions (mostly a light not coming on when switched).

It must be working well because I caught myself flicking the toggle switch and just entering or exiting the room.  When I first installed them, I always hesitated and waited for the PLC delay before moving on.  Now, I don’t even think about them not working.

I even kinda like the relay “pop” noise and am now used to it.  And oh-so-good for the switchbox location with no neutral.

Another advantage - not so much from my mod - of having the overhead box full time hot with a XPFM for switching, is I’m going to run a lighting and general-purpose power pole near the overhead light.  I can steal full-time hot from the nearby box MUCH easier than running a new circuit, and I can do so because the wall switch does not switch the power to the overhead box, rather it switches a XPFM to the light.

I love it when X10 allows creativity and when it works.  ;D
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dhelms29505

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Re: True X10 Compatible Toggle Switch (Modification)
« Reply #16 on: June 13, 2011, 01:32:36 AM »

I was wondering where the link is for the attachments? I maybe missing it viewing it from android.
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Brian H

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Re: True X10 Compatible Toggle Switch (Modification)
« Reply #17 on: June 13, 2011, 06:10:57 AM »

The two attached files are near the bottom of the original post in the thread.
Shows on my screen as maybe a light blue.
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Noam

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Re: True X10 Compatible Toggle Switch (Modification)
« Reply #18 on: June 13, 2011, 09:41:23 AM »

I remember reading this several months ago, and thinking how clever it was. True, the whole hassle with changing the battery and having to remove a wire to reprogram is there, but depending on how many times a day to use the switch, the battery could potentially last for years.

Another way to approach it, if you had the ability to fish wires from that box, could have been to wire a standard (single-pole) wall switch to the contacts of a PowerFlash module, and locate that somewhere out of the way.

The PowerFlash is more expensive than a keychain remote, and they take up an outlet (which, if you have several of them, can be its own nightmare to deal with), but they never need battery replacements, and you don't need to deal with modifying anything.
I don't recall the different modes offhand, but there is a mode for a "momentary" contact, and for on/off, based on the status of the switch you wire to the contacts.

Several years ago, I read instructions on Ido Bartana's website (www.idobartana.com) for modifying a plug-in "tabletop" controller to act as a contact-closure module (like a Powerflash), but with several sets of contacts.
It wasn't hard to do, and that could also be used for an application like this.

I'm not saying your approach is bad (in fact, I think it is brilliant!), just thinking of other ways to do the same thing.
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Brian H

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Re: True X10 Compatible Toggle Switch (Modification)
« Reply #19 on: June 13, 2011, 10:44:08 AM »

If it is a dry contact only and not a low voltage input.
WGL makes {made} a eight input powerflash style module PF8. Though I looked just now for a link to it and it was not showing on the WGL site.
« Last Edit: June 13, 2011, 10:50:13 AM by Brian H »
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JTTrojan

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Re: True X10 Compatible Toggle Switch (Modification)
« Reply #20 on: October 30, 2012, 01:42:24 PM »

Hi, first time poster here.  I've been scouring the net for a "normal" toggle switch x10 transmitter and just came across your mod.  I think I'll attempt it, but I have a question.  Can I also hardwire a light to the switch for normal direct operation, or will this line voltage mess up the control of the KR19A transmitter? 

I've got a regular wall switch already wired to turn on LED undercabinet lights in my kitchen, but I want it to also simultaneously turn on undercabinet lights in two locations on the other side of the room.  Running romex to these two locations is not going to happen, so I need an x10 solution.   Thanks for the help!
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dave w

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Re: True X10 Compatible Toggle Switch (Modification)
« Reply #21 on: October 30, 2012, 03:24:44 PM »

Can I also hardwire a light to the switch for normal direct operation, or will this line voltage mess up the control of the KR19A transmitter?  

Yes the line voltage will smoke the KR19 electronics....in a big way.

However, IF you can find a DPDT wall toggle switch it would work. Lowes, Home Depot etc. may have them. If not, try Grainger. It is going to be hard to find

I have no idea if this is allowed by "code".


« Last Edit: October 31, 2012, 08:45:53 PM by dave w »
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Dave4720

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Re: True X10 Compatible Toggle Switch (Modification)
« Reply #22 on: October 31, 2012, 05:06:22 PM »

But ... the mod uses a SPDT (Single-pole DOUBLE-throw) switch.  The switch has TWO positions, and the cap acts to simulate a "push-release" action.  One side operates the KR19 'ON' button, and the other side operates the KR19 'OFF' button.

One side of a DPST (Double-pole SINGLE-throw) switch would only operate one of the KR19's buttons ... you could never operate the other side.  You need the double-throw.

You would need a DPDT switch ... if they even make one.  And definitely mixing AC and low voltage in the same box is not to code.  Although I don't always follow the code Gods, I would not mix AC and low voltage in the same box.

I'd use the KR19 switch to control several XPFM relays in the fixture box, all set to the same code.
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dave w

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Re: True X10 Compatible Toggle Switch (Modification)
« Reply #23 on: October 31, 2012, 08:35:22 PM »

Yeah Dave4720, I forgot you need an OFF signal also.  :'  Thanks, I will correct my post.
« Last Edit: October 31, 2012, 08:46:53 PM by dave w »
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JTTrojan

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Re: True X10 Compatible Toggle Switch (Modification)
« Reply #24 on: November 05, 2012, 06:00:44 PM »

Thanks Dave and Dave.  Back to the drawing board I guess.

Is there a transmitter (or transmitter mod) that would basically act as a relay to transmit an ON signal when it detects a voltage and transmit an OFF signal when the voltage is removed?  Maybe a modified DS10a?

What I have now is a 120V wall Decora switch with Romex going to a box hidden behind the wall housing a little transformer (think "wall wart").  This transformer converts the line to low voltage for LED strips.  The low voltage wire is then fed from the box through the wall to a couple different spots to power undercabinet lighting.

So... I'm thinking I could take a feed off of the low voltage line (it's something like 6V) to trigger the "relay".  Thus, when I flip the switch it not only lights up the LEDs hardwired to it, but also activates two XPFM modules or hacked socket rocket receivers to turn on two other LED strips across the room.  I feel like there should be an easy solution here to avoid running romex, but I'm new to this whole x10 thing. 
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Brian H

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Re: True X10 Compatible Toggle Switch (Modification)
« Reply #25 on: November 05, 2012, 06:29:58 PM »

DS10A is a Security type module.
It does not send a standard X10 RF On and Off command.

If you wanted a power line X10 command. The hard to find now PF248 Powerflash module. Can send an On and Off power line signal from either a dry closure or a low voltage DC or AC signal.
PSC01 is the X10Pro version of the Powerflash.
http://www.x10pro.com/pro/pdf/psc01.pdf

Dry closure only. You could use a Insteon I/OLinc and program an optional X10 primary Address into it.
http://www.smarthome.com/2450/IOLinc-INSTEON-Low-Voltage-Contact-Closure-Interface-1-In-1-Out-/p.aspx
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bkenobi

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Re: True X10 Compatible Toggle Switch (Modification)
« Reply #26 on: December 03, 2012, 11:01:47 AM »

I think your best bet is to just use Insteon ToggleLinc switches.  They are pricey, but the one I have installed gets really good ratings on the WAF scale!  With these switches, you can control a local load as well as remote loads.  In my case, I use the switch to control a remote module by having the switch send a PLC command.  What you want to do sounds like this plus local control which would work fine.

The only thing to be aware of is that the module is a bit larger than the WS467 and it requires a neutral wire.  If you can handle a slightly larger module (which you would need if you were going to use this mod anyway), and you have a neutral, I'd say you would be good to go (and up to code)!

http://www.smarthome.com/2466SW/ToggleLinc-Relay-INSTEON-Remote-Control-On-Off-Switch-Non-Dimming-White/p.aspx
http://www.smarthome.com/2466DW/ToggleLinc-Dimmer-INSTEON-Remote-Control-Dimmer-Switch-White/p.aspx
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