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Author Topic: All Lights On - All Units Off  (Read 12357 times)

Dave4720

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All Lights On - All Units Off
« on: May 07, 2010, 11:41:59 AM »

Help me get this straight before I buy more modules and then find I cannot do the thing I thought I could do …

Using CM11A for my timers and macros.

All Lights ON will turn ON any module that is considered a “light” module, i.e. lamp module, wall switch … correct?

All Units OFF will turn OFF any/all modules, lights or anything.  I find no All Lights OFF command … correct?

Assuming the above is correct, I have questions:

1. WS13A wall relay switch: Manual states it responds to All Lights ON … but if you used it for a ceiling fan, an All Lights ON command would turn on your fan, right?

2. XPFM relay module: Manual states it responds to All Lights ON … but again, if you used it for something else (not a light), an All Lights ON command would turn on that something else, right?

3. AM466/ AM486 Appliance Modules: Unit - and will not respond to All Lights ON? (in the context of All Lights ON and All Units OFF)?  Manual does not state.

4. If I want to turn off all lights (using All Units Off, not each light individually), but I have a stereo on an AM466 Appliance Module, I am forced to issue an All Units Off and then the code to turn the stereo back on?

There seems to be a conflict with the limited All Lights ON and All Units Off commands and what one may actually be controlling.

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Brandt

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Re: All Lights On - All Units Off
« Reply #1 on: May 07, 2010, 11:59:50 AM »

It is per housecode.

1. WS13A wall relay switch: Manual states it responds to All Lights ON … but if you used it for a ceiling fan, an All Lights ON command would turn on your fan, right?

Not sure, I don't have a ws13a, but if you place it on a different house code your fine.

2. XPFM relay module: Manual states it responds to All Lights ON … but again, if you used it for something else (not a light), an All Lights ON command would turn on that something else, right?

I'd have to test to be sure, but if you place it on a different house code than your lights you will be ok.

3. AM466/ AM486 Appliance Modules: Unit - and will not respond to All Lights ON? (in the context of All Lights ON and All Units OFF)?  Manual does not state.

Correct

4. If I want to turn off all lights (using All Units Off, not each light individually), but I have a stereo on an AM466 Appliance Module, I am forced to issue an All Units Off and then the code to turn the stereo back on?

if your stereo is on a different housecode than you issue an All Units OFF then the stereo won't go off.

« Last Edit: May 07, 2010, 12:01:49 PM by Brandt »
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Brian H

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Re: All Lights On - All Units Off
« Reply #2 on: May 07, 2010, 03:06:55 PM »

The X10 protocol has an "All Lights Off" command, but it is hardly ever used. I know my early Simplehomenet EZX10RF module has a firmware bug in it. When my X10 remote sends an All Units Off it sends a power line All Lights Off.  rofl If I remember correctly I tried the All Lights Off command and many lamp type modules did not respond. My old 1132CU can send the all Lights Off command.

I have an XPS3 which is the X10Pro version of the WS13A and a XPFM. I will do some tests and see what they do.

One reason given by X10 for Appliance type modules not responding to an All Lights On. Is many maybe controlling things like heaters motore etc. That could be a hazard if turned on in error.

All Lights On; All Lights Off and  All Units Off are by House Code. So a BAll Units Off would only control any device on House Code B. Any other House Code would not react to the command.
« Last Edit: May 07, 2010, 06:21:24 PM by Brian H »
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Brian H

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Re: All Lights On - All Units Off
« Reply #3 on: May 07, 2010, 04:34:45 PM »

LM465 not soft start:
All Lights On yes
All Lights Off No
All Units Off yes.
LM465 Soft Start older firmware Date Code 08A01
All Lights On Yes ramps up
All Lights Off Yes ramps down
All Units Off Yes ramps down.
LM465 Soft Start newer firmware Date Code 09J44
All Lights On Yes fast on
All Lights Off Yes fast off
All Units Off yes fast off.
New CFL type Appliance module Date Code 09K48
All Lights On no
All Lights Off no
All Units Off yes
XPS3 Date Code 04L51 {X10 WS13A}
All Lights On yes
All Lights Off yes
All Units Off yes
XPFM Date Code 05A05
All Lights On yes
All Lights Off yes
All Units Off yes.

Since X10 has been re-engineering modules lately to use more readily available parts. I can not say if present  XPS3 and XPFM modules will act the same as in my tests.
« Last Edit: May 07, 2010, 04:39:25 PM by Brian H »
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NickJ

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Re: All Lights On - All Units Off
« Reply #4 on: February 23, 2011, 01:15:14 PM »

For the X10 wall switch modules - especially the relay models that may switch non light loads - it is an unfortunate design decision to allow them to respond to "all lights on".  I have many applications - even when using them to control lights - where I don't want them to come on with an "all lights on" command.  I'd like an wall switch module that worked exactly as appliance modules work - only respin ding to a directr command plus "all units off".  Does anyone know of one?

As far as using different house codes as I see often suggested, is there a practical way of doing that?  That is, is there a controller that allows you to pick a house code and then a device number?  All the controllers I have require changing the house code with a small  dial which would not stand up to frequent use.  I already use a different house code to turn on HEPA filters at night but I dedicate a separate controller to that function.
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Brian H

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Re: All Lights On - All Units Off
« Reply #5 on: February 23, 2011, 01:40:58 PM »

I have not seen any standalone controllers like the Maxi or Mini controllers.
The CM15A computer interface and AHP can use all sixteen house codes and unit codes.

The Insteon SwitchLinc Relay, Icon On/Off switch  and ToggleLinc Relay switch. Can have an X10 address programmed into them.
They respond to the All Units Off command but not the All Lights On or the rarely used All Lights Off commands.
« Last Edit: February 23, 2011, 02:00:53 PM by Brian H »
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Dan Lawrence

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Re: All Lights On - All Units Off
« Reply #6 on: February 23, 2011, 01:57:32 PM »

Automated Outlet http://www.automatedoutlet.com/ carries the X10 Maxi Controller, the X10 Mini Controller and the IR43 Infrared Controller.  Check them out!! 
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JeffVolp

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Re: All Lights On - All Units Off
« Reply #7 on: February 23, 2011, 02:01:24 PM »

As far as using different house codes as I see often suggested, is there a practical way of doing that?  That is, is there a controller that allows you to pick a house code and then a device number? 

The one SmartHome device that I have purchased is their #4071 ControLinc Maxi that does exactly that.  However, they have no price listed anymore, and it may have been discontinued.

Jeff
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X-10 automation since the BSR days

Brian H

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Re: All Lights On - All Units Off
« Reply #8 on: February 23, 2011, 02:18:53 PM »

I forgot the 4071 ControlLinc Maxi. I should have remembered it as I used one to program X10 scenes into Insteon modules. The preset sequences where a great feature.

I believe you are correct Jeff. It seems to be gone.
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