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Author Topic: Appliance Module & wall sw. w/florescents  (Read 3151 times)

treetops

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Appliance Module & wall sw. w/florescents
« on: November 05, 2010, 04:21:05 PM »

Florescent tubes in my workshop are switched by a standard wall switch. Now I want X10 control of these lites. As I have a bunch of unused Appliance Modules (AM466), I thought I would connect the output of a Module to the load (hot side of lites) in parallel with the load side of the wall switch, thus activating the lites from either the switch or the App. Mod.
Does anyone know if this will work?
.......Especially if both the module and the switch are on at the same time??
( if this scenario is a problem, I would change the wall switch to a 3way switch (ie a toggle switch) and wire the Module input to one side of the toggle and the lites and Module putput to the other side of the toggle. That way the module is not seeing line voltage on both the in and out simultaneously.)

Any thoughts or experience with this?
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dave w

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Re: Appliance Module & wall sw. w/florescents
« Reply #1 on: November 05, 2010, 05:22:54 PM »

Yes this will work until: the wall switch is on and you turn off the Appliance Module. The module will go "clickty-clickty-click" trying to turn off the light but not seeing the load side of the relay change state, so firing the relay two more times.

The caviet: I have never tried this with the new "CFL Friendly" versions of the appliance modules but have done with the older AMs.

I can't remember what happens if the AM is off and you turn on the wall switch, but do remember there is no fire and smoke.  If you turn on the AM when the wall switch is on, it will probably go clickty again and end up back in the off state. i.e you can't get the the AM to turn on when the wall switch is on.

Since you have many AM's, just test it.
« Last Edit: November 06, 2010, 10:11:22 AM by dave w »
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Brian H

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Re: Appliance Module & wall sw. w/florescents
« Reply #2 on: November 05, 2010, 06:24:18 PM »

I think we went through this on another project. Like water leak stopper.

If my memory is correct and I did the tests.  ???
If the Appliance Module is off and the power is still on the output. Trying to turn it on does nothing and it stays off.
Now if you send it an off and the voltage is still on its output. It clicks a few times trying to turn off.

Back to the test rig.  ;D
« Last Edit: November 05, 2010, 06:29:38 PM by Brian H »
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Brian H

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Re: Appliance Module & wall sw. w/florescents
« Reply #3 on: November 05, 2010, 07:18:15 PM »

Tested with both an older and CFL friendly Appliance Module. Difference is number of clicks when trying to change its output. Older one rapid clicks maybe 4. CFL friendly two slower clicks.

This was just a standard switch setup where the line was always on the appliance module. Not the one you where thinking of trying With a three way style.


No smoke if you don't reverse the line and neutral between the switch and appliance modules output.  :'

I never tried the three way switch setup where the line in to the appliance module was off while the output side has voltage on it.
I have a three way switch  and will try to test it tomorrow.

Switch Off. Module turns light On and Off as expected.

Module Off. Switch turns light On and Off as expected.

Switch On: Module is On. Clicks with an X10 Off command
                Module is On. No action with an X10 On command.
                Module is Off. No action with an X10 On command.
                Module is Off. Clicks with an X10 Off command.
« Last Edit: November 05, 2010, 08:04:27 PM by Brian H »
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Brian H

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Re: Appliance Module & wall sw. w/florescents
« Reply #4 on: November 06, 2010, 09:53:26 AM »

I did a test with a three way switch; old Appliance Module and CFL friendly Appliance Module.
Switched the line into the lamps Line connection or the AC Line Input Pin on the appliance modules.

With the AC directly to the appliance module it worked correctly.
With the AC directly to the lamp it turned on as expected.
Only thing was if the appliance module's switch was On. The AC feed back from the Output Line pin to the AC Input pin. So even in the direct light position you could turn it Off. Once Off it was not powered and stayed off and did not chatter.

I allowed both versions to be connected with the Line Switched to direct and it didn't seem to generate any magic smoke.
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treetops

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Re: Appliance Module & wall sw. w/florescents
« Reply #5 on: November 06, 2010, 01:33:55 PM »

Wow!  Brian: Thanks for all that effort!

From your tests it looks like I would have a workable solution even without the 3way switch.

What I am trying to set-up:
Will put a nightwatch camera w/ motion detector (MD) in basement workshop and want florescents to come on when MD triggers camera and appliance module (AM). So normal situation = lite switch is off, intruder trips MD, which turns AM on........ And from your input it looks like this setup will work fine, even without the 3way switch. Thats great because a second workshop has florescents on a 3way lite setup which would preclude my using the 3way switch solution. So in both workshops, I can use an AM with its input wired to 120V and the output directly to the lites.
I will just have to be careful that after an MD trip (and I have flushed out the intruder ;D) , all the AM's  get reset to OFF ready for the next event. Now I need to figure out a foolproof way of preventing my accidently setting off the MD's......ie how to arm this setup for the appropriate times: nite in bed, away etc.
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