🔌General Home Automation > Powerline Control Reliability
CFL versus X10 – Which Models are Compatible
JeffVolp:
Last week my workbench light burnt out. I had been using an incandescent because the CFLs I had at the time would not fit. We since purchased a couple of 13W Sylvania "Soft White mini 60" (CF13EL/MINI) that were small enough to fit, and I replaced the bulb with one of them. It takes a minute or so to come up to full brilliance, but the color temperature and brightness match the previous 60W incandescent very well.
Yesterday I was testing another batch of devices. As part of XTBM testing I check the signal level from a Maxi Controller plugged into the same power strip to verify the gain switch is working. The signal read about 20% lower than usual. At first I thought it was a problem with that XTBM, but I verified the 1% resistors were all in the correct locations. Then I checked the level with my prototype XTBM, and it read the same. Hmm… Maybe the old Maxi Controller is finally going soft.
Later I was testing a bunch of XTB-IIRs. As part of that testing I check the output of the return signal amplifier with a very weak incoming signal. It also read lower than normal, so I put that one aside for further investigation. The next one also read lower than normal, and I thought perhaps the input stage tuning was slightly off due to a new lot of components. I still did not connect the dots back to that new CFL. I verified the tuning was correct by injecting a signal from my Wavetek into the powerline. However, there was still a signal there when I disconnected the Wavetek. Hmm… Then it dawned on me… The new CFL! Add a filter and the XTBM and XTB-IIR behaved exactly as they should.
I bring up this long-winded narrative to show you that as things evolve in our homes, there can be an impact to X10 signals that are not observed at the time. While one of these bulbs would not cause a problem, slowly replacing incandescents with them would eventually result in a deterioration of X10 performance. This particular bulb acts both as a noise source AND a signal sucker. So, the bottom line:
13W Sylvania “Soft White mini 60" (CF13EL/MINI): Not Compatible without a filter.
Jeff
Brian H:
Thanks for the evaluation and information.
Sounds like another cap across the line input to reduce their emissions to a acceptable level.
I actually have a CFL where the manufacturer spent the added few cents and has a inductor from the center contact of the bulb to the PCB. Where the cap was across the line.
JeffVolp:
--- Quote from: Brian H on April 10, 2011, 12:32:34 PM ---I actually have a CFL where the manufacturer spent the added few cents and has a inductor from the center contact of the bulb to the PCB. Where the cap was across the line.
--- End quote ---
If you have the manufacturer and model number, please add it to your post. We need to create a list of CFLs that are compatible with X10 systems.
Maybe manufacturers will see this as an incentive to spend the extra few cents to increase their market share.
Jeff
Brian H:
I will see if I can find the information on the CFL.
It was burned out ones I did an autopsy on the base. ;D
Looked again and the input inductor was actually on the PCB.
Westinghouse Triple-23 Older style with three 'U' shaped tubes.
Sylvania CF13EL/MINIT/TWIST/DAY
GreenLite 13W/ELS-M 2700K
Noam:
I know this is an older thread, but after conversations with Jeff, I'm trying to revive it.
I have been running for a few years with 6 CFL "bug bulbs" in my outdoor fixtures. They are a mixture of n:vision and EcoSmart 14w (60w equivalent).
The 6 fixtures are controlled by two SmartHome Insteon ToggleLinc relays, and two Insteon SwitchLinc relays.
(For those of you having trouble with the math: two switches have two bulbs each, the other two have one bulb each)
Other than one bulb going bad prematurely (I think it was one of the n:vision ones), and throwing out enough noise to cripple my entire system, I haven't had any other problems with them.
I just replaced 11 more bulbs. I put in 6 of the Philips "EnergySaver" 13w (60w equivalent) in one fixture, and and 5 of the 9w (40w equivalent) in another.
Each fixture is controlled by a SmartHome Insteon ToggleLink relay switch.
I didn't detect any issues with either fixture, and with both of them on (6 of the 23w ones, 5 of the 9w ones), I didn't have any problems with the rest of my system responding to commands.
I don't have an XTBM (yet), so I don't have a way to measure the noise levels of these bulbs.
I also bought a few of the Dimmable EcoSmart 65w equivalent spot bulbs for my recessed lights, but I found the "Daylight" version to be too bright, so I didn't get to the point of testing for noise.
I have to exchange those for the "soft white" version and test again.
Can anyone recommend a recessed spot bulb (r30 type) that is a soft-white 65w equivalent, is dimmable, and doesn't interfere with X10?
(I have two older SmartHome Togglelinc dimmers on those lights, and I'd rather not change the switches out for relay ones if I don't have to.)
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