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Author Topic: X10 component Recomendation  (Read 2550 times)

dob85

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X10 component Recomendation
« on: August 28, 2015, 12:12:37 AM »

Hello All,

I am new to X10, and I need a item recommendation.  I have a front patio with 3 CFL lights and the switch inside the house in the hallway. I Want to have a motion sensor to trigger the light to turn on when someone enters the front yard. So I read some literature about X10 and I am thinking to buy the following:

X10 MS16A
X10 TM751 Wireless Transceiver Module
X10 PRO XPS3 Decorator Wall Switch - PRO Version of WS13A

Can I expand it to add another one or two switches in the future ?

Am I going in the right direction?

Thanks
Oscar
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Brian H

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Re: X10 component Recomendation
« Reply #1 on: August 28, 2015, 06:27:22 AM »

The MS16A sends an Off command after a preset time of no motion detected.
It has the ability to be set to some preset times and operating options.
I have linked to the manual for the MS16A so you can see the times and how it works.

It also has a Dusk Dawn sensor that will send an On at Dusk and Off at Dawn. To the next higher Unit Code set in the main X10 House Code Unit Code the motion sensor is set to.
Manual:
http://www.authinx.com/manuals/X10/MS16A.pdf
Wiki page:
http://kbase.x10.com/wiki/MS16A

You can have more than one X10 switch on the same Address House Code and Unit Code. All X10 devices on the same address with all follow the command sent to their address.

Here is the manual for the WS13A/XPS3. One thing you should check is in the original manual switch positions. Is there a Neutral Power wire in addition to the normal Line and Load wire in the location. As the WS13A/XPS3 requires a Neutral Power wire.
http://kbase.x10.com/wiki/WS13A
« Last Edit: August 28, 2015, 06:32:53 AM by Brian H »
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dob85

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Re: X10 component Recomendation
« Reply #2 on: August 28, 2015, 10:39:53 AM »

Hello Brian and thanks for your answer.

So if no motion is detected, it still going to send an On command turning on the light?  I thought I can turn the dawn/dusk option off. An leave the motion detection option ON.
Yes , I have a neutral line. In fact I have 3 lines ( hot, neutral and ground).
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dave w

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Re: X10 component Recomendation
« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2015, 12:14:40 PM »

Brian may want to add specifics, but the MS16 sends the dusk - dawn ON-OFF commands on the next highest unit code. In other words if the MS16 is set to House Code "A" Unit Code "1" (A1) the motion detection will be on A1 and the dusk -dawn will be on A2, not effecting the A1 lights.
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dob85

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Re: X10 component Recomendation
« Reply #4 on: August 28, 2015, 12:40:10 PM »

Thanks Dave...

So if I understand you correctly, If my House is the highest Unit code (A1), the sensor will follow the (A1) commands and automatically downgrades the "dusk/dawn" setting to secondary commands ?

As for the wiring, I see the WS13A has Neutral, Line and Load.  How does that map to the "Hot" (Balck), "White" (Neutral) and "Ground" standard electrical wire?

Thanks for your input.
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bkenobi

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Re: X10 component Recomendation
« Reply #5 on: August 28, 2015, 01:32:22 PM »

There are 2 ways your lights could be wired in the walls.  The electrician could have run just the switched wires to the box so you will only see 2 leads (no neutral or ground) or they could have run everything through the box (an incoming hot, neutral, ground and an outgoing load, neutral, ground).  Depending on how your wiring was run, you may be able to use a relay based X10 module or not.  If you do not have neutral in the box, you can only use 2 wire modules.  However, these do not work correctly with CFL or LED lights.  You should verify that you have a neutral in the box prior to expending much money or energy into your project.

Brian H

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Re: X10 component Recomendation
« Reply #6 on: August 28, 2015, 01:52:07 PM »

The Dusk Dawn sensor in your example would be the default A2 as the default Motion Address would be A1.
At Dusk an A2 On would be sent at Dawn a A2 Off would be sent.
The MS16A has a few extra features not found in the other X10 motion sensors. The manual I linked to gives details. Like no motion time out etc.

If there are only two wires {switch loop} not counting safety ground in the box. The white one {should have a black tape or paint on it} is NOT Neutral but the Line feeding the switch and the black on the switch is going to the load. The only time you may see a Neutral connected to a mechanical wall switch along with the Load and Line. It has a pilot light in it to show when it is on or it is a combination half size switch with an outlet in one assembly.

« Last Edit: August 28, 2015, 01:59:49 PM by Brian H »
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dob85

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Re: X10 component Recomendation
« Reply #7 on: August 28, 2015, 02:42:13 PM »

Thanks for the updates guys.....I am not an electrician, but this is the CFL used: http://eiko.com/Products.aspx?CatID=573&ProductIndex=TT26/27 and this is what I see when I open my current switch. I will try to upload a pic.  Two black wires and ground.
« Last Edit: August 28, 2015, 02:47:23 PM by dob85 »
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Brian H

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Re: X10 component Recomendation
« Reply #8 on: August 28, 2015, 02:48:19 PM »

Two Black Wires connected to the two terminals on the switch. That sounds like a switch loop.

You may find a White bunch of Neutral wires in the back of the electrical box. Just wire nutted together.

I looked at the CFL bulb you are using.
The GX24q-3 base bulb. Is driven by a ballast in the fixture. Most likely a Electronic Ballast. May or may not cause X10 issues. depends on the design.

There is an excellent set of X10 tutorials here.
http://jvde.us/x10_troubleshooting.htm

« Last Edit: August 28, 2015, 03:06:52 PM by Brian H »
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dob85

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Re: X10 component Recomendation
« Reply #9 on: August 28, 2015, 03:06:03 PM »

I certainly do!  What do I do with them ?

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Brian H

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Re: X10 component Recomendation
« Reply #10 on: August 28, 2015, 03:08:55 PM »

You add a white wire to the neutral bundle and connect it to the Neutral connection on the WS13A.
If there are only two White Neutral wires in the back of the box. You could also connect one to each of the two Neutral connections on the WS13A.

Then you have to determine which Black wire is the Line and Load. Connecting them to their respective connection on the WS13A.
« Last Edit: August 28, 2015, 06:42:34 PM by Brian H »
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dob85

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Re: X10 component Recomendation
« Reply #11 on: August 31, 2015, 12:28:35 PM »

Thank You Brian for your Input.  It was very helpful and I was able to connect it without any issues.
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