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Author Topic: Outdoor sensors  (Read 959 times)

soxfan1966

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Outdoor sensors
« on: March 05, 2019, 06:15:42 AM »

I've got HomeGenie running on the Pi Hub for a few months now.  Everything is going good - it's proven to be more reliable than AHP, although I'm still using the additional HA-Bridge instead of the HomeGenie Alexa Integration (haven't had time to get back to that).

I'm using a variety of x10 modules, including some outdoor motion sensors.  I do not have these defined in HomeGenie and they work - well as good as they did with AHP.

Problem is the x10 motion sensors seem to sporadically not work.

Wondering what other options are available to use with HomeGenie and my x10 modules.  I read about a new Phillips Hue outdoor sensor this morning and it got me thinking there may be options available that work better than the x10 motion sensors with HomeGenie.

Thanks
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Tuicemen

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Re: Outdoor sensors
« Reply #1 on: March 05, 2019, 08:08:26 AM »

HomeGenie has a number of different protocol options and since you use Ha-Bridge as well that allows even more.
This question would most likely get more suggestions if posted on the homegenie.club forum.
I do have different protocols in use here but only a few motion sensors in play all of which are x10 security motion sensors which I find to be more reliable then the standard X10 motion sensors.
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bkenobi

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Re: Outdoor sensors
« Reply #2 on: March 05, 2019, 11:19:58 AM »

The advantage of using HG (or any other similar HA software) is that it supports a number of protocols given the right hardware.  Since you have X10, you could use any of the X10 motion sensors but, IMO, they are all junk at consistency.  I have a few installed but I absolutely hate them.  They fail if they get wet (even when silicon prevention is taken) and their range is garbage (even with the passive antenna mod).  I have not found a wireless motion sensor yet, but any protocol that HG supports will work.  I do have a wired sensors I installed long ago.  I initially interfaced using a PowerFlash module but after burning it up during a wind storm, I switched to using the RPi GPIO.  This is faster, WAY more reliable, and easily accomplished with HG.

racerfern

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Re: Outdoor sensors
« Reply #3 on: March 05, 2019, 04:31:53 PM »

I use the Homeseer Floodlight sensor to trigger other events, not just turn on lights. It's mains powered and has performed flawlessly outdoors. Not sure how it will be recognized by HG without the equivalent of a device handler like Samsung has.

I also just bought the Zooz outdoor motion sensor that will operate on battery or mains but again, not sure how it will work with HG. One thing for sure, a simple z-stick type controller would be easy to add to a Pi (not zero). I use a 3B+. That would open a whole new world of X10 uses.
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bkenobi

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Re: Outdoor sensors
« Reply #4 on: March 05, 2019, 05:03:51 PM »

I was hoping someone would eventually make something like that Zooz S2 unit with a solar panel on it.  If it can last for a reasonable time with a battery, a solar cell would make it last forever.  If calculators have had them forever, why not add it to low power devices like this?

soxfan1966

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Re: Outdoor sensors
« Reply #5 on: March 05, 2019, 05:59:33 PM »

I think this is the one I saw this morning:

https://www2.meethue.com/en-us/p/hue-outdoor-sensor/046677541736#

Since it connects to the Hue Bridge it would work for HomeGenie?

Does this look better / more reliable than the x10 units?
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soxfan1966

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Re: Outdoor sensors
« Reply #6 on: March 05, 2019, 06:09:43 PM »

Are the x10 MS10A the security motion sensors? 
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bkenobi

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Re: Outdoor sensors
« Reply #7 on: March 05, 2019, 06:15:38 PM »

I believe so.  Since I wouldn't call x10 motion sensors high quality, I don't know how to answer that question. They are not water resistant let alone water proof therefor are not outdoor units. I have 2 installed under cover that are working fine, but transmit range is poor, detection range and angle is poor, and there is no mount available (so it mounts flush to surface unless you mfg something). They used to cost $5 which was worth it IMO. Now that they are $30+, they are a poor choice for me.

racerfern

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Re: Outdoor sensors
« Reply #8 on: March 05, 2019, 06:20:19 PM »

Quote
I was hoping someone would eventually make something like that Zooz S2 unit with a solar panel on it.

There are a bunch of very small solar chargers, but not all that cheap. You would just need a rechargeable battery rather than a conventional battery. However with the Zooz running on mains, it's probably cheaper to run a micro usb to the sensor from the nearest power supply.
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Brian H

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Re: Outdoor sensors
« Reply #9 on: March 06, 2019, 06:28:28 AM »

Are the x10 MS10A the security motion sensors?

The MS10A is the older Security Motion Sensor. The presently sold one is a MS18A.
The DS10A was the old Security Door-Window Sensor. The presently sold one is a DS12A.
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soxfan1966

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Re: Outdoor sensors
« Reply #10 on: March 06, 2019, 07:59:56 AM »

Can the MS18A be used outside?  I don't see it mentioned as possible or not in the doc.  And will it work with a regular x10 receiver or does it require a security specific one (from reading about the MS10A it sounded like the security motion sensors used different receivers than the regular x10 ones)
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Tuicemen

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Re: Outdoor sensors
« Reply #11 on: March 06, 2019, 09:21:57 AM »

Currently Authinx has no X10 motions sensors rated for outdoor use.
However if well protected from the elements most will perform there.
I have a MS10A that has been outside for several years but it is under a overhang so it is protected from the elements.
The security sensors send different RF codes then the standard X10 ones however the CM19 and Cm15 can see these as can HG.

Ha-Bridge being actively developed would more then likely Hue sensors. The Philps Hue Program in HG was designed to work with a Hue Hub however it will also see and work with HA-Bridge provided you don't have security enabled in HA-Bridge.
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HA Dave

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Re: Outdoor sensors
« Reply #12 on: March 06, 2019, 12:54:49 PM »

I remember... knightrider once gave directions on converting regular motion sensing floodlights to exploit an X10 universal module so as to get a similar response as a X10 floodlight. However.... I did a search with no productive results. But as I remember... the mod required a "RadioShack" relay as well as the X10 universal module. So.....

But there should be a way... a modification of some sort that would allow/cause a common floodlight to trigger a PLC (or maybe even RF). Or maybe we should be looking at a more modern "camera motion detection" product that can be integrated into our Home Automation systems.   

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soxfan1966

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Re: Outdoor sensors
« Reply #13 on: March 06, 2019, 01:15:56 PM »

Hmm, are you suggesting having security cameras identified in HG that have motion sensing ability used to trigger x10 modules?

If so I'd be interested.  I just started getting some IP cameras to replace x10 ones but have not had luck getting one to appear in HG yet.  If I could get that to work then that may fill the need I have (two birds, one stone approach)
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HA Dave

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Re: Outdoor sensors
« Reply #14 on: March 06, 2019, 02:58:42 PM »

Hmm, are you suggesting having security cameras identified in HG that have motion sensing ability used to trigger x10 modules?....

Yes... although not directly. The standard DVR HD recorders with Internet connectivity has pixel based motion detection with alarm abilities. The PSC01 Powerflash should work (I know.... I incorrectly posted Universal module... my bad, sorry).

But maybe.... instead of converting back to old standards.... why not use the motion detecting cameras (like Ring brand) as they were intended. Maybe find one that will co-operate with a known Hub (like zwave or smartthings…. or directly with Alexa) and just re-imagine how automation gets done. At one time.... the old motion detecting X10 floodlight was at the heart of my home security. But that was a LONG time ago. I don't feel compelled to recreate old ideas.... just because "that's how it used to be done."

Modifications and work arounds.... were at one time a big part of X10 use. And with the X10 Pi... I see that attitude of alter and change to make it work continue.
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