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Author Topic: What is the definition of AI here?  (Read 1997 times)

brobin

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Re: What is the definition of AI here?
« Reply #15 on: March 11, 2019, 01:22:41 PM »

During Hurricane Irma we had no power for 9 days and no cable/internet for 12 days. Our 48kw genset took care of the power and the only thing that didn't work was Alexa. All HA schedules executed as usual from the Stargate. The antenna in the attic delivered OTA broadcasts and, thanks to Verizon for suspending data plan overage fees, we even had 4G hotspots for our PCs when needed.  It did get me thinking about a cellular modem though but I'll wait for 5G availability for that.
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HA Dave

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Re: What is the definition of AI here?
« Reply #16 on: March 11, 2019, 06:00:29 PM »

During Hurricane Irma we had no power for 9 days and no cable/internet for 12 days. Our 48kw genset took care of the power and the only thing that didn't work was Alexa. All HA schedules executed as usual from the Stargate. ……..

…… heavy winds took out a cable pole down the road...……. the cable company does not know when they can get a contractor to set a new pole. Pity all the Alexa, Google, homes with cloud switches.

Alexa et al are basically just voice control via a speaker that Amazon et al wired to their search engines.

NOT... that this forum is predictable..... but my post earlier... already addressed the above posts.

It might be a lot easier to just find a "tin-foil-hat warnings" about how scary todays modern cloud can be. Or reminisce about pushing remote control buttons to have lights come on or go off (the GOOD OLE DAYS). Many here (at the forums) has found those technics to be very effective ways to avoid progress. It doesn't matter. [/b]

...….  many of us on this forum that use Alexa, Google, Cortana and or other Voice assistants and are comfortable with using them for Home Automation as well as other things.[/u][/b] 

With 70K+ skills.... I am sure some must be non-automation related. But I can't imagine for the life of me what those skills might do. After all.... Alexa is nothing more than a simple (basic) AI device.

I think the real issue... is many people see "products" like X10 as "Home Automation".... and the rest of todays Home Automation as "other things". As humorous as that is.... it gets old. You see I have a real affection for X10 products. But as X10 isolates itself from the rest of the Home Automation world.... it becomes more and more.... just a remote lighting control product. Or... as I had posted before: (below).

The deal is.... Alexa is now.... THE primary human interface to all Home Automation Systems. Just like the modern computer-based-communications systems have effectively replaced fax machines, letter writing, errand boys, and wired telephones (and soup cans connected by strings). However.... there are still old guys like myself... who still send cards and call friends and loved ones (from my easy chair). I think the human emotional connections are important. But.... my automation devices aren't human. And I don't assign them make believe feeling.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2019, 06:04:35 PM by HA Dave »
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racerfern

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Re: What is the definition of AI here?
« Reply #17 on: March 11, 2019, 06:21:35 PM »

Quote
After all.... Alexa is nothing more than a simple (basic) AI device.

I see nothing even remotely resembling Artificial Intelligence in Alexa. It will sit there forever unless you ask or tell it something. The day it tells me I left the garage door open without prompting and says I should close it, then that's basic AI, IMO. Of course I use Homeseer events to accomplish that, but that's my limited intelligence, not Alexa or any other device.
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brobin

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Re: What is the definition of AI here?
« Reply #18 on: March 11, 2019, 06:37:24 PM »

quote: "I think the real issue... is many people see "products" like X10 as "Home Automation".... and the rest of todays Home Automation as "other things"."

That doesn't make Alexa AI. I have X10, Lutron, Sonoff and a number of hubs and bridges for different devices but Alexa can and will do only precisely what I've set it up to do. Now if Alexa or any other device saw that I had a flight leaving at 10AM and a wakeup alarm set for 6AM at a location 45 min away from the airport, and saw that there was a major traffic delay along the way and/or that there would likely be a delay at the TSA checkpoint based on the loads to be carried by all the flights leaving from my terminal and, based on all that, decided to wake me up earlier, THEN I'd say we have AI.  Would love to see it!
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Tuicemen

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Re: What is the definition of AI here?
« Reply #19 on: March 11, 2019, 06:54:47 PM »

I think the real issue... is many people see "products" like X10 as "Home Automation".... and the rest of todays Home Automation as "other things". As humorous as that is.... it gets old. You see I have a real affection for X10 products. But as X10 isolates itself from the rest of the Home Automation world.... it becomes more and more.... just a remote lighting control product.
That may be true of some people however many on this forum like myself use X10 for more then just lighting always will. I like your self and others here have "other things" which are automated and I consider them part of my Home Automation setup. These other things are not X10!
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James G

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Re: What is the definition of AI here?
« Reply #20 on: March 12, 2019, 06:08:50 AM »

I appreciate all the input. I am sorry Dave but I just cannot accept your definition of AI. As far as I know, there is none anywhere on the planet today. All is just programming. Most people expect AI in a few decades. I consider AI to be self-aware and be able to change its programming. It must be able to consider decisions, reconsider and change its mind. Sorry.  :'
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James G

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Re: What is the definition of AI here?
« Reply #21 on: March 12, 2019, 07:00:32 AM »

Tuicemen, thanks for the tip on the Alexa Forum. Will join it!
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HA Dave

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Re: What is the definition of AI here?
« Reply #22 on: March 12, 2019, 12:19:23 PM »

….. I am sorry Dave but I just cannot accept your definition of AI.

I have no definitions. I merely rely on expert opinion.

As far as I know, there is none anywhere on the planet today. All is just programming. Most people expect AI in a few decades. I consider AI to be self-aware

OK.... you expect AI to be "self-aware"..... then when man (and woman) create self-aware "life" (currently called "children").... you'll call them... AI. AI is an acronym for Artificial Intelligence.  The word Artificial…. implies less-than real. Or in the case of AI.... programing

I should have covered that part of the prevailing paradigm in my earlier post. OH WAIT.... I did!



The thing is.... Alexa is a digital assistance. AI, and …….. if "lighting control" is what you think "home Automation" is... if that is as far as you can imagine HA to be... then Alexa is a voice controlled button pusher. PERIOD.

For many... actually most here. That's it. That's as far as they can comprehend.... and they can't see any reason to use the Internet to push a PalmPad button.
« Last Edit: March 12, 2019, 12:34:04 PM by HA Dave »
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HA Dave

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Re: What is the definition of AI here?
« Reply #23 on: March 12, 2019, 12:30:11 PM »

.  That may be true of some people however many on this forum like myself use X10 for more then just lighting always will. I like your self and others here have "other things" which are automated and I consider them part of my Home Automation setup. These other things are not X10!

No. (you had posted that you use Alexa for things OTHER than automation) The question was what are those other things? I see Alexa and Google device as solidly automation products. I am interested in what NON-automation uses AI has.
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HA Dave

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Re: What is the definition of AI here?
« Reply #24 on: March 12, 2019, 12:47:23 PM »

I sure hope I don't hurt anyone's feeling.... although we should all be adults here. And even if we weren't.... younger people don't have the rock-solid protective paradigms that I see defended here. It's OK.... we're all only human. This is how our brains work and it can be nearly impossible for most people to step outside their own perceptions. These perceptions are NOT limited to this forum or by any means to Home Automation.

This kind of resistance is why we had diskettes and VHS.... when we could have had CD's instead. Old paradigms slows progress down.... but it also keeps us grounded. I don't think poorly of anyone.... for merely being human.
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dave w

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Re: What is the definition of AI here?
« Reply #25 on: March 12, 2019, 12:48:26 PM »

I am interested in what NON-automation uses AI has.
Alexa is pretty good at playing "20 questions". d'zat count?
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HA Dave

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Re: What is the definition of AI here?
« Reply #26 on: March 12, 2019, 12:51:24 PM »

I am interested in what NON-automation uses AI has.
Alexa is pretty good at playing "20 questions". d'zat count?

I am not a big fan of games... but I have played 20 questions with Alexa. Better entertainment than much of daytime TV. Yeah... entertainment is a BIG part of modern Home Automation.
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Tuicemen

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Re: What is the definition of AI here?
« Reply #27 on: March 12, 2019, 12:59:53 PM »

….  That may be true of some people however many on this forum like myself use X10 for more then just lighting always will. I like your self and others here have "other things" which are automated and I consider them part of my Home Automation setup. These other things are not X10!

No. (you had posted that you use Alexa for things OTHER than automation) The question was what are those other things? I see Alexa and Google device as solidly automation products. I am interested in what NON-automation uses AI has.
If your going to quote me be sure your reply reflect what I actually posted! Nowhere in that post did I mention Alexa! ???

Your definition of AI is different then mine and it appears lots of users here as well and that's OK by me.
For that reason, the none automation uses AI has, I'll not go down that path.
 

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brobin

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Re: What is the definition of AI here?
« Reply #28 on: March 12, 2019, 01:14:00 PM »

I'd be happy if Alexa could figure out that if I say "turn off kitchen" it would know that I mean the kitchen in the same house the Alexa device is in! But nope, not enough AI for that. Someone please prove me wrong on that - I'd love to have that!
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JeffVolp

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Re: What is the definition of AI here?
« Reply #29 on: March 12, 2019, 01:53:03 PM »

For me Alexa was just a verbal PalmPad.  And we had to use only the words it understood.  Not much AI required for that...

Jeff
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