X10 Community Forum
🔌General Home Automation => Automating Your House => Troubleshooting Automation Problems => Topic started by: npampel on April 09, 2011, 01:46:06 PM
-
Is it possible that X10 modules are signal suckers themselves? I have a semi extensive X10 layout and for the most part it works pretty good with out any repeaters, bridges or application. But yesterday, I added a new 2 prong appliance module (AM486) into the mix and now one of the other appliance modules (AM486) 2 prong that has been in use for years is problematic. It works occasionally by with an HR12A, slimline wall mount, and through AHP 3.310 directly.
I am guessing that the more x10 modules used that there is signal sucking and a XPCR or equivalent may be needed.
Any help or comments appreciated.
Cheers,
Nate
-
Is it possible that X10 modules are signal suckers themselves?
Yes, all X10 devices will present some loading to X10 signals - transmitters in particular. But, adding a single appliance module should not have had that much of an effect unless your signal level was already marginal. Perhaps something else changed at the same time?
Jeff
-
Is it possible that X10 modules are signal suckers themselves?
Yep
I have a semi extensive X10 layout and for the most part it works pretty good with out any repeaters, bridges or application.
Hard to believe that a decent sized setup can work reliably without at lease a passive phase coupler.
But yesterday, I added a new 2 prong appliance module (AM486) into the mix and now one of the other appliance modules (AM486) 2 prong that has been in use for years is problematic. It works occasionally by with an HR12A, slimline wall mount, and through AHP 3.310 directly.
Did you then try removing the appliance module to see if reliability returned? If AHP (the CM15A) still works fine... maybe the HR12A just needs a new battery.
I am guessing that the more x10 modules used that there is signal sucking and a XPCR or equivalent may be needed.
You need (or WILL need) something... IMHO.
-
X10 one way modules are not severe signal suckers.
The older X10 style Smarthome One way ApplianceLincs where very bad signal suckers.
Instead of using a tuned transformer circuit to couple the power line signals into the processor. They used a coil and capacitor in series. It acts like a low impedance to the 120KHz power line signals. Into a set of clamping diodes if memory serves me.
-
I removed the appliance module and everything worked as normal (or Better) prior to the installation of this appliance module. Another note, my wife was doing laundry and had the dryer going yesterday so I thought what a great time to test further. So I added that appliance module back into the mix and tested as the dryer was going and everything worked like a charm. :)% So it is looking like a repeater/amp is the way to go.
I currently have the following in place and in use; and looking to expand with some extra part/modules laying around:
5 x WS467
5 x LM465 - only one of these 5 in use is the smart soft start
4 x AM486/AM466
4 x Slimline Wireless Wall switch
1 x PUM01
1 x RR501 (used to bridge the 2 phase of the house and IR for macros)
2 x TM751 (used for IR macros)
1 x MS16a
2 x MS10a
2 x SR227
1 x DS7000
9 x DS10A
All running with AHP 3.310 and ActivePhone, OnAlert, OnAlert Mobile, MyGarage, Smart Macros and MyHouse Online using the CM15a with the antenna modified.
It's not huge, but a semi decent setup, i would guess. I have surely enjoyed creating some macros for this setup, and many thanks goes out to the folks here in the forum for giving me some of the ideas.
But non the less, I think it may be time to bite the bullet and get an XPCR.
Cheers,
Nate
-
Just to add to my post above. I have been reading about the XPCR and some folks have mentioned that it occasionally locks up or can have a firestorm with the CM15a. I understand about the firestorm and the crosstalk that the XPCR and CM15a could have, but the "lock ups" what are the symptoms or potential issues/harm that the lock will do?
Thanks,
Nate
-
Some of the issues from the link below maybe corrected in later versions of AHP
http://kbase.x10.com/wiki/Known_Issues_with_ActiveHome_Pro
-
Just to add to my post above. I have been reading about the XPCR and some folks have mentioned that it occasionally locks up or can have a firestorm with the CM15a. I understand about the firestorm and the crosstalk that the XPCR and CM15a could have, but the "lock ups" what are the symptoms or potential issues/harm that the lock will do?
Thanks,
Nate
FWIW I have had both X10 XPCR and the Leviton branded version repeaters. Both would lock up for no appearent reason. They simply quit working about once every month or two. Cycling the breakers would get them working for another 60 days or so. I later fixed the problem by upgrading to the ACT CR234 :D .
-
I wanted to let you all know that I just purchased an X10 XPCR to aid in troublesome circuit. I installed the XPCR: red on same circuit as the CM15a (Phase1), Black on Phase 2, capped third black as Phase3 is N/A, and the white to the neutral bridge. I have not found any improvement, especially on the one troublesome circuit I have. My house is not all that large, about 1355 sq feet, two levels; so approximately 2600 sq. feet total. The CM15a worked fine prior to the installation of the XPCR with the exception of the above mentioned circuit. I am concerned that the XPCR may generate unnecessary noise if the repeater/amplification does not help me with that circuit. A couple of questions that I have though are:
1. The red LED on the XPCR does work and I get 3 flashes, pause, then 2 flashes when a command is sent. Is this normal?
2. I have not swapped the Red and Black wires to switch the phases. Will this do anything?
To temporarily correct the circuit issue and what I have been using in the past to make this circuit work is to transmit to TM751 on another HC and that TM751 RF's the on/off commands to a light on that circuit.
Any Help is much appreciated.
Many Thanks,
Nate
-
1. I don't remember the two extra flashes, but it has been 13 years since I used XPCR so may not remember clearly. The Black wire you used is the L2 wire and not L3, correct?
2. IF the XPCR is operating properly, then no, reversing the red and L2 black wire should not effect operation. However you could flip the red and black just to test that both amps in the XPCR are working.
Assuming the XPCR is operating properly you should have seen an improvement on the unreliable circuit. Have you looked at that circuit for noise sourses and signal suckers?