X10 Community Forum
🔌General Home Automation => Automating Your House => Troubleshooting Automation Problems => Topic started by: phs3 on July 10, 2007, 02:16:01 PM
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A little over a year ago, I bought a couple of LM465 lamp modules, an AM486, and a TM751. The TM751 has a bedroom fan plugged into it; the AM486 has a Honeywell HEPA air cleaner. About 7 months later, the AM486 went "CLICK CLICK CLICK" out of the blue and died. The vendor (Home Automation Store, authinx.com) happily and painlessly replaced it under warranty. Now, six months later, it's dead again.
Are AM486s really that weak? I know the TM751 isn't the best, and am about to replace it with an RR501, but I would have thought that after all these years, this stuff would be a bit more robust. Or have I just had bad luck?
For whoever was about to ask what the air cleaner draws: I don't know, but I can't believe it's as much as 500 watts -- if it were, it'd have to run pretty warm, and it doesn't It's a discontinued model, a 13528, and I can't seem to find specs on it, but the current models draw on the order of 170 watts.
Any and all suggestions welcome!
Thanks...
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I use the 2-pin appliance modules (AM486) all over the house. I have yet to have one fail.
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Sounds like phs3 has added some electronic device on the AM486 or something new that exceeds the amperage rating.
I also have several AM486's (both X10, Radio Shack and others) plus a bunch of lamp modules (x10, Radio Shack and others) and only one lamp module has ever failed, one used at Christmas when a lighted decoration's cord shorted at the plug and fried the lamp module controlling it. The plug was replaced and the module (which still worked, but only on Housecodes O & P. it was trashed and replaced with a new one from my spare stock.
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Maybe newer ones are a different design. We have an active thread right now on "Disable Local Control On an AM486". The photo the poster sent was a new one I have never seen. Controller IC on the solder side and the PCB completely different. Who knows what other things got re-engineered on them.
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Your right Brian H! I had read that... but it slipped my mind. I could use a few more appliance modules myself. I wonder if they have all changed?
The vendor (Home Automation Store, authinx.com) happily and painlessly replaced it under warranty. Now, six months later, it's dead again.
I also wonder if a third-party vendor makes any difference.
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I don't know on the all changed. I was in the X10 KB the other night looking for LM465 data and saw something interesting. A question on "why my lamp module turned on slowly". Seems some of them now have soft start built in or so the answer indicated. Guess X10 marches on.
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Well at least X10 still has the RCA overstock packages.
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About 7 months later, the AM486 went "CLICK CLICK CLICK" out of the blue and died. The vendor (Home Automation Store, authinx.com) happily and painlessly replaced it under warranty. Now, six months later, it's dead again.
At least from my experience, that 'CLICK CLICK CLICK' sound is because the internal status feedback isn't working. The module will keep clicking until it "sees" the right on or off feedback. When I have played with such failing modules, I found cleaning the contacts solved the problem.
For whoever was about to ask what the air cleaner draws: I don't know, but I can't believe it's as much as 500 watts -- if it were, it'd have to run pretty warm, and it doesn't It's a discontinued model, a 13528, and I can't seem to find specs on it, but the current models draw on the order of 170 watts.
Any and all suggestions welcome!
500 watts is less than 5 amps. Plus, remember to account for any start up surge which can easily be a much higher current draw than what the unit draws continuously. Plus, a unit that has a high inductive value will not want to allow an instantaneous stopping of current flow. To stop that from happening, you will have lots of arcing on the module's contacts, and that in turn, will cause the contact to get dirty mighty fast (carbon build up).
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Great insight and information Walt! That makes perfectly good sense.
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I believe the maximum rating on an Appliance Module is 500 Watts [handy AM14A sticker said that] as Walt2 indicated. The cold filament surge has to be taken into account.
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500 watts is less than 5 amps. Plus, remember to account for any start up surge which can easily be a much higher current draw than what the unit draws continuously. Plus, a unit that has a high inductive value will not want to allow an instantaneous stopping of current flow. To stop that from happening, you will have lots of arcing on the module's contacts, and that in turn, will cause the contact to get dirty mighty fast (carbon build up).
I feel dense, but I don't know what to conclude from the above. Can you clarify?
Thanks!
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The Appliance Module can control a Resistive Load of 15 Amps. Resistive would be something like a old fashioned electric heater or toaster.
500 Watts for Incandescent Light Bulbs; as they have a filament that glows and when cold is almost like a dead short across the powerline. So the starting surge; though brief can be high.
Inductive is like a motor or low power light run by a transformer.
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The Appliance Module can control a Resistive Load of 15 Amps. Resistive would be something like a old fashioned electric heater or toaster.
500 Watts for Incandescent Light Bulbs; as they have a filament that glows and when cold is almost like a dead short across the powerline. So the starting surge; though brief can be high.
Inductive is like a motor or low power light run by a transformer.
Yeah, I'd seen that they tout the Appliance Module for coffee machines and the like. Doesn't seem like a small HEPA air cleaner is likely to draw 15A even for a moment to me...
Well, I just ordered two more (to amortize the shipping) from Automated Outlet. Will see how they do!
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The filter is most likely not resistive. It may have electronics in it for a power supply or a fan motor to move the air through it.