X10 Community Forum
🔌General Home Automation => Automating Your House => Troubleshooting Automation Problems => Topic started by: DowNet on October 17, 2006, 10:20:45 PM
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Hey all. I live in a fairly average size 1 bedroom condo. Since I purchased my V572AB (4+ months ago) all my RF problems have been fixed. I managed to fix all my PLC problems first with filters and such so the problem is not there. I can control my whole house via my PC/large remote with no PLC problems. So on to my problem:
I have 3 MS14As-EagleEye Sensors (1 in each closet). Normally I would open the door to that closet and the light would come on, then go off after a min of no motion as normal. It worked perfectly for about 4-6 months now. Now all of a sudden, the closet sensor by the V572AB works perfect but the 2 other sensors in the other closets do NOT work (or only work about 3-7% of the time). It's not a PLC issue, because if I bring the "bad sensors" closer to the V572AB unit and create motion, the corresponding closet light does go on (and after a min go off) as it should.
But when the unit is mounted in these "problem closets" (like it has been for months) all of a sudden now (last couple of days), the units do not work. What I believe is that it's either a problem with the transmit on the sensors to the V572AB OR the V572AB receiving capability at that long distance (1 room away - less than 15 feet) is diminishingng smaller. Could my V572AB be beginning to fail or do we think the sensors are beginning to go bad? My condo is completely automated and everything else works perfectly...even my slimline wall switches! :/ However when I interchange any of the sensors in 2 of the closets to troubleshoot, it appears that the RF signal is not getting to the V572AB. I even tried the "good" sensor in one of those "closets" and the "good sensor" won't get to the V572AB. Could something be causing interference in those closets (RF-wise)? Nothing has changed in my home for a while now, so I'm not sure what is causing this. I hope I'm clear in my issue as I wish to have it resolved fairly quickly. This has gotten me stumped. :(
Any help or thoughts regarding this would be great!
Thanks!
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Some thing in the home has obviously changed! A new cordless phone maybe? ??? ::) ;)
Do a search for RF reception it may provide other clues! ;)
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Some thing in the home has obviously changed! A new cordless phone maybe? ??? ::) ;)
Do a search for RF reception it may provide other clues! ;)
Well now that I think of it, my condo building is going through a renovation and they just installed new light fixtures and lights in the main hallways. But would that affect the RF inside my condo, in those closets only? ??? Remember this is not a PLC issue but an RF issue.
I can't imagine it would, although I don't know, hence me posting here. :)
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Other than doing a search check your batteries! ;)
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Other than doing a search check your batteries! ;)
I forgot to mention that: yes I did change the batteries, like twice...just incase I had a bad pair. I've done a quick search and didn't come up with anything. Matter of fact it goes to things that I already have (i.e. V572AB) and to install them. I have. It's the best investment I've made to the system, but for some reason I've had this intermitten recent problem. No new "RF Toys" in my home as of late (cordless phones etc.).....hmmmm...... :-\
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Did you try "RF interferance" as a search as well? ??? ;)
What have you moved in the home? ???Anything large made of metal? ???
Has the condo renovations included TV cable rewireing? ??? Ask to see just what was done!
Bad cable conections can cause noise! ;) :D ;D
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...But when the unit is mounted in these "problem closets" (like it has been for months) all of a sudden now (last couple of days), the units do not work.
Either:
- METAL in the "as the crow flys" path between the sensor and the receiver *OR*
. - Another RF transmitter JAMMING your 'teeny-weeny' MSxx
are the first ideas that come to my mind.
...Could my V572AB be beginning to fail or do we think the sensors are beginning to go bad?
Do you have a RR501 or TM751 to test with?
...Could something be causing interference in those closets (RF-wise)?
Sure!
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Either:
- METAL in the "as the crow flys" path between the sensor and the receiver *OR*
. - Another RF transmitter JAMMING your 'teeny-weeny' MSxx
are the first ideas that come to my mind.
...Could my V572AB be beginning to fail or do we think the sensors are beginning to go bad?
Do you have a RR501 or TM751 to test with?
...Could something be causing interference in those closets (RF-wise)?
Sure!
What can jam the signal in that closet? It just has towls, sheets and the like in there. No electronics other than the x10 socket rocket and the sensor. Plus it's been working for months...now all of a sudden it's belly up. Are there any other "stronger" x10 motion dectors that I can look into? The palmpad remote works like a charm inside or outside that closet. I'm assuming it has a stronger transmit. Thanks for your help thus far.
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One thing to check that you may have overlooked are the connections at the antenna and at the V572AB. Actually unscrew them look at the center wire on the cable to make sure they look clean and not corroded or tarnished. I wouldn't think adding new lights in the hall would do anything but with everything going hi-tech you never know. You may try relocating the antenna a bit to see if that changes things. On my V572AB I had to mount it horizontally to get good coverage for both upstairs, second floor and attic and main floor and basement.
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Well, what I plan on doing now is that I ordered a "different" X10 motion detector. I ordered the Occupancy white one. They claim that this has a transmit range of 100' and the one I'm using now has a transmit range of 20'. All I can think of is that the RF is to weak to get to the V572AB due to the sensor's transmitter beginning to degrade because there is not enough power or tremendous interference that I really can't weed out. I believe more of the former (however I could be wrong :)). Maybe a 100' transmit on a different detector is just what I need to get over this hump. We shall see. \
I can only see this being true because if I move the "problem sensor transmitters" closer to the V572AB, they do work as normal without problems. In the meantime, while I wait for this new part to test, I'll look into my connections at the V572AB, KDR.
Thanks for all the suggestions thus far. If anyone has any others, feel free. I'll update my post once this "new" part comes in.
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If possible, take the motion detector, V572AB, and an appliance or lamp module to a friends house (not in your condo building) and try it there. That would at least help determine whether the problem is in your condo's RF environment or your V572AB has a problem.
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DowNet: If your convinced it is a range\signal problem why not try the Passive Antenna Trick (http://jvde.us/x10/passive.pdf)? ;) :D
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DowNet: If your convinced it is a range\signal problem why not try the Passive Antenna Trick (http://jvde.us/x10/passive.pdf)? ;) :D
HOLY COW! This trick worked! Tuicemen you get my vote on this one! I clipped down an old metal hanger and stuck it behind the sensors and wala! The damn thing hits its target! Amazing! I thought it would never work. I'm assuming because everything else works in the house with the VS72AB that it's not a problem with that unit but a problem with the sensors either degrading or getting some type of interference. This trick seemed to fix the problem.
So it looks like that I was right on it being the motion sensors and not the VS72AB! Thanks to all for your help. Job well done! :) ;D ;D ;D ;D