X10 Community Forum
🛡Home Security => Home Security General => Topic started by: tom j on July 28, 2008, 11:32:13 PM
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Say anyone know why you get so many false alarms with the MS10a's in the 1st position, think I read somewhere that it was because of RF interference, anyone know for sure? Anyone recently buy a Protector Plus system I would be curious to know if you've gotten ANY false alarms in the one movement mode. Someone said that they might have made some improvements on them but I'm not for sure. I REALLY HATE FALSE ALARMS!!
Tom j.
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Say anyone know why you get so many false alarms with the MS10a's in the 1st position...........
You know.... I don't. My unit isn't new and the sensors... are older than the console.
I think my success is due largely to my placement of the sensors. I know sensors react to temperature and often light changes. So... I was careful to avoid areas with windows and heat/AC vents. I know that can sound restrictive.... as It kinda limits their use to hallways, stairwells, entry areas and walk-in closets. I would guess in most cases that is plenty enough to restrict any movement within a home.
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Say anyone know why you get so many false alarms with the MS10a's in the 1st position...........
You know.... I don't. My unit isn't new and the sensors... are older than the console.
I think my success is due largely to my placement of the sensors. I know sensors react to temperature and often light changes. So... I was careful to avoid areas with windows and heat/AC vents. I know that can sound restrictive.... as It kinda limits their use to hallways, stairwells, entry areas and walk-in closets. I would guess in most cases that is plenty enough to restrict any movement within a home.
Hi Dave! say have you ever gotten any false alarms in the 1st position? I noticed when I got the last one before I just switched to 2 movement mode that when I rushed home I noticed that there was an EMS unit a few doors down always thought that maybe their RF might have triggered it. Think that's possible? I don't know what frequency they use. Thanks!
Tom j.
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............have you ever gotten any false alarms in the 1st position?
I've never used anything but the 1 position.
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............have you ever gotten any false alarms in the 1st position?
I've never used anything but the 1 position.
That's what I was asking have you ever got a false alarm in the 1st position. Thanks
Tom j.
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I feel confident that if someone was to break into my home... the alarm... ether door/window or motion sensor would detect and report them. I am very happy with the X10 alarm system. The bad thing is ... with a break-in... considerable damage would already be done. Both the damage of a window or door and the emotional damage a break-in causes.
That is why I started the thread: Keep them outside - better than a yard sign (http://www.x10community.com/forums/index.php?topic=13351.0). I hope to encourage discussion and hopefully discover new methods of preventing the break-in... opposed to just detecting it.
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I feel confident that if someone was to break into my home... the alarm... ether door/window or motion sensor would detect and report them. I am very happy with the X10 alarm system. The bad thing is ... with a break-in... considerable damage would already be done. Both the damage of a window or door and the emotional damage a break-in causes.
That is why I started the thread: Keep them outside - better than a yard sign (http://www.x10community.com/forums/index.php?topic=13351.0). I hope to encourage discussion and hopefully discover new methods of preventing the break-in... opposed to just detecting it.
Got ya. I get it that you like the system but have you ever gotten a FLASE alarm with the MS10a's in the 1st position, never a few or what. You never really addressed my question just curious. Thanks
Tom j.
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.......... have you ever gotten a FLASE alarm with the MS10a's in the 1st position, never a few or what. You never really addressed my question just curious.
I don't get false alarms. I have never used the #2 setting on the MS10A... I have only used the #1 setting.
I really think careful placement of the motion sensors is key to preventing the false alarms.... IMHO.
I think my success is due largely to my placement of the sensors. I know sensors react to temperature and often light changes. So... I was careful to avoid areas with windows and heat/AC vents. I know that can sound restrictive.... as It kinda limits their use to hallways, stairwells, entry areas and walk-in closets. I would guess in most cases that is plenty enough to restrict any movement within a home.
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.......... have you ever gotten a FLASE alarm with the MS10a's in the 1st position, never a few or what. You never really addressed my question just curious.
I don't get false alarms. I have never used the #2 setting on the MS10A... I have only used the #1 setting.
I really think careful placement of the motion sensors is key to preventing the false alarms.... IMHO.
I think my success is due largely to my placement of the sensors. I know sensors react to temperature and often light changes. So... I was careful to avoid areas with windows and heat/AC vents. I know that can sound restrictive.... as It kinda limits their use to hallways, stairwells, entry areas and walk-in closets. I would guess in most cases that is plenty enough to restrict any movement within a home.
WHY do you keep saying you don't use the 2nd setting?? If you go back and read my posts you will see I was asking you specifically about the 1st setting and I said it 3 times, 1st setting but you answered the question, so OK Thanks
Tom j.
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WHY do you keep saying you don't use the 2nd setting??
Because other people may also read this post..... and I think the 2nd setting is near useless.... for a home alarm system.
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WHY do you keep saying you don't use the 2nd setting??
Because other people may also read this post..... and I think the 2nd setting is near useless.
Well actually I have to respectfully disagree with you on this one. You did point out that yours are older and they actually have made some tremendous improvements on the newer ones in the 2nd or 2 movement mode they are actually pretty good IF you get a GOOD one. The older ones were junk though I agree.
Tom j
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hmmm..... Now I'm starting to think that x10 might have also made some improvements on the MS10a's in the 1st position. I'm currently testing out a mega system for a friend and I've had two motion detectors set to the one movement mode going on two weeks and pointed at a north sunny window it's going on well at least 12 days and no false alarms! even had a EMS come down the street today I just knew it would trip it but it didn't, letting my friend use two of my good ones that work really well in the two movement mode and leave these connected for maybe 2 months just as a test. There in a spare bedroom so it shouldn't be a problem will report back and let you know how this test goes if x10 did improve these I think they should let people know like saying "New & Improved" or something. I actually tried this test a few years ago and they tripped after maybe 5 or 6 days and they weren't even pointing at a hot window, and they never even made it this long. What do you guys think? having these pointed at a hot window in a hot room (vent closed no air) for 12 days straight is pretty impressive for a MS10a!
Tom j.
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Well if I walk in the room they detect the motion and temperature difference and pick me up right away but still no false alarms, hmm I'm impressed!
Tom j.
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You know when I tried this same test a few years back after they tripped the first time maybe after a week or a little less I repeated it again and the same thing happen. Then I put the same 2 MS10a's in a shoe box in the same room these new ones are in and they still gave me a false alarm that told me there was something else going on beside placement. I believe it was some kind of RF interference that they were susceptible to. Another guy here on the boards repeated the same experiment by placing them in a box and the same thing happen to him. These are going on three weeks I'll have to check the date for sure but there been absolutely no false alarms and pointing a motion detector at a hot window is about the worst thing you can do they must have improved them but we'll see if they can go the distance.
Tom j.
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...........pointing a motion detector at a hot window is about the worst thing you can do they must have improved them.
I agree.... that the window test would generally be a guarantee fail. However... the angle of the sun may also effect the test results.... and the angle will change with the seasons. I think you had the right idea about the previous failures being related to an RF problem.
When using X10 and the setup works for a period of time... and then suddenly stops... we ask ourselves what has changed. I think the same trouble shooting question might apply with your setup now.
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...........pointing a motion detector at a hot window is about the worst thing you can do they must have improved them.
I agree.... that the window test would generally be a guarantee fail. However... the angle of the sun may also effect the test results.... and the angle will change with the seasons. I think you had the right idea about the previous failures being related to an RF problem.
When using X10 and the setup works for a period of time... and then suddenly stops... we ask ourselves what has changed. I think the same trouble shooting question might apply with your setup now.
Thanks Dave for your input. Any thing else you think I could try for this torture test? Didn't want to over do it that's why the north window opposed to an east window. But if you can think of anything else let me know these are actually quite close to the window maybe 8 feet or so. Like I said so far I'm impressed!
Tom j.
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After I told my friend how impressed I was with the MS10a's he bought a 5 for 1 pack and I'm adding them to the test. I've had them hooked up for about a 3 days now with the rest of them pointed at that same sunny window and no false alarms with any of them. Will let this test go until the end of the month and will report the results so far they are all 100%
Tom j.
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Well they had to improve these things they gone from complete junk to well.... EXCELLENT! I've tried everything to trip these but NO FALSE ALARMS. If these motion detectors really pan out the Protector Plus would be unbeatable for the money! Still putting in a DSC hybrid system with smoke and CO but if you can get by without these for now this system would be hard to beat for the money. You could actually buy a whole X10 Protector Plus system for the cost of one of my Canadian made keypads!!
Tom j.
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Couple of things first concerning my DSC keypads yes they are pricey but you get what you pay for this keypad is their top of the line and it responds to everything including programming in English so no cryptic codes, so if the back door is open it says Kitchen Door Open or Battery In Master Bedroom Motion Detector Is Low for example.
Also I'm now starting to think that x10 has also taken care of the "Zone Sticking" problem since I've been testing my friends setup I haven't had one zone stick! and I once again have tried to do this with no luck. This used to really be a problem that annoyed me to no end. The motion and window door sensors used to have have to report back to the console twice to complete it's communication. I always thought the solution for this problem would be a small buffer so if two devices were trying to report in at the same time they could just be stored in the buffer until the unit had a chance to process them. x10 has obviously changed the design of the new console because you used to be able to see the zone that was violated blink on and off on the new console this has apparently been dropped and now it's just the window door sensors notify you when a zone is open, while in the run 2 mode.
Tom j.
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Well I currently have 8 of the MS10a's hooked up and still no false alarms! I would still follow proper placement and try to avoid windows and heating ducts /radiators but they have really have done a good job on these, well there's still a few weeks left so check back for my final comments. ;)
Tom j.
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Well all the new motion detectors are still going strong and 100% Thought I would try an older MS10a just to compare and it didn't make it 24 hours before it gave a false alarm so there definitely had to have been a design change in these! I think I'll try another older unit that is basically new in the box but about three years old well that's if I can find it, but the new 10a's are much improved and seem extremely stable and very reliable especially in the 1 movement mode!!
Tom j.
#:) x10!!!
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Just to clarify the older MS10a that gave that false alarm was in the 1 movement mode this detectors works fine in the 2 movement but tripped right away when placed on 1. I really believe this is a RF problem. Maybe they added shielding that how most companies have resolved this.
Tom j.
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Well I've decided to extent this test until the around the 10th of this month that way we can see how the 5 that were added on the 7th fair but so far NO FAILURES WITH ANY OF THEM!! Except for the limited life span of the console I'm giving the Protector Plus with all it's minor shortcomings a thumbs up.
Tom j.
#:)
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Found two older MS10a's they both gave false alarms within 48 hours! one right after a EMS parked down the street the new ones are still all 100% and were totally unaffected.
Tom j.
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Well I've gone this far so I'll just run it to the end of September so far no false alarms with any of the new MS10a's starting to think these are possibly some of the best dumb wireless motion detectors out there, when I say dumb I mean without any microprocessors. The more sophisticated units have some kind of microprocessor to analyse the signal before it generates an alarm. I'm pretty sure at this price point these don't have anything like that.
Tom j.
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Well I officially ended the testing today and packed up my friends 5 motion detectors and returned them to him. During the test there were absolutely NO FALSE ALARMS. I will get back with my full assessment and observations.
Tom j.
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tom j,
Thanks for the time to do the testing and posting the results . I was thinking about getting a couple of these but was I waiting to see the results of you tests. :)% Looks like they will be the next addition to my ever expanding X10 system.
-:) I am still looking for a good X10 outside motion sensor with adjustable sensitivity. All the ones I have tried are way too sensitive. They pick up things like birds, rabbits, chipmunks, and any other small creature.
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tom j,
Thanks for the time to do the testing and posting the results . I was thinking about getting a couple of these but was I waiting to see the results of you tests. :)% Looks like they will be the next addition to my ever expanding X10 system.
-:) I am still looking for a good X10 outside motion sensor with adjustable sensitivity. All the ones I have tried are way too sensitive. They pick up things like birds, rabbits, chipmunks, and any other small creature.
Have you tried masking off a portion of the sensor's window. Also, you can put a tube (e.g. a short peice of PVC pipe) around the sensor. Both should decrease the sensitivity of the sensor by decreasing its viewing angle. If you still need a wide viewing angle, then you need to use a non-X10 PIR sensor that counts hits in different zones, and then interface it to a Powerflash module.
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tom j,
Thanks for the time to do the testing and posting the results . I was thinking about getting a couple of these but was I waiting to see the results of you tests. :)% Looks like they will be the next addition to my ever expanding X10 system.
-:) I am still looking for a good X10 outside motion sensor with adjustable sensitivity. All the ones I have tried are way too sensitive. They pick up things like birds, rabbits, chipmunks, and any other small creature.
Hi!! Jim glad I could help, I actually tried this same test a few years back and couldn't even go a week without false alarms so X10 has definitely made some improvements. I agree with Alan for outdoor senors like the Eagle eye you can put a narrow piece of tape along the bottom of the sensor this will prevent the sensor from seeing all the way to the ground I tried this for the first time a few years ago when I set up some Eagle eyes to keep a look out on my new car, after some minor adjustments I didn't get any false alarms from the little critters that roam the neighborhood. I plan on giving a detailed discussion of my findings when I get a chance but as for now I have to give the MS10a's a thumbs up!!
#:)
Tom j.