X10 Community Forum
📸Cameras & Camera Software => Legacy non Wi-Fi X10 Cameras => Camera General Discussion => PanTilt Pro => Topic started by: eyeonu on October 13, 2010, 10:56:48 AM
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hello,
i am from Romania and here we have 220V
we bought 4 pan tilt and to use them we bought 4 converter 220v-120v
and we coonect all power suply xm14a to the each converter and them the xm14a to the pantilt
problem is when we want to move each pan tilt separately we can't, when we move up all 4 pan tilts move up
then we buy 4 transceiver module tm751 conected to the coverter
but we can't move separately.
the question is how to control the 4 pan tilt with 4 remote control separately in the house ?
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I'm not sure when it comes to a 220v to 120v converter as I've never used these, but did you set each of the cameras power supplies to different unit codes?
You normally would set the power supplies to a group of 4 eg: A1, A2, A3, A4, and use a single transceiver set to House Code A.
When you use your remote to select camera 1 it will turn on only that camera, camera 2 etc...
You should then only have the selected camera respond to the remote.
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The Pan and Tilt mounts are turned on and off by a power line signal.
All four have to be on the same House Code and in a group of four Unit Codes. 1-4;5-8;9-12 or 13-16. Turn one on the other three go off.
Your problem is they are all staying on at the sametime.
There is a very good chance the X10 power line signals are not getting though your 220-120 volt converters.
Are they a transformer type?
When you got the four transceivers.
Where they also the American version? The CR14A will only work with transceivers from the USA as the European Transceivers are on a different RF transmit frequency. USA 310MHz and Europe 433.92MHz.
When you installed them where they also on the 120 volt side of the converter?
Also another factor maybe the power supplies are designed for 60 Hertz and your country is 50 Hertz power line frequency.
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this is an transformer
input: 220-240 VAC 50Hz
output: 110-120 VAC 60Hz
20W RMS
i test with all the 4 pan tilts, and put each in every rooms of my house, seaprately
but i set up the xm14a am selcet the house code ... the unit ... but all of them are working at the same time, and i don't know what to do
:((
i am very sad
- can i modify the remote control cr14a to have an lower wireless signal and not to get trough wall and so i can use 4 remote control to the each pan tilt
or
- can i modify power supply xm14a, i think there is the receiver no ?
please help me, i read all the topics, all the sites, and dind't find an solution
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Did you use a TM751 on each of the areas and is it on the 120 volt side of the transformer with the addressable power supply?
Set all four TM751s to A
Set one power supply to A1. One to A2. One to A3 and the last one to A4.
Try turning one of the four on and then see if the other three stay where they where.
What maybe confusing is the power to the Pan and Tilt is controlled by the power line and the actual pan and tilt by direct RF signals from the remote.
I am also slightly confused. The transformer is 220 volts 50Hz in while the output is 120 volts at 60Hz. A simple transformer can not change the line frequency. If the output is really 60Hz then you devices have electronics in them and we have to think on different terms.
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ok i put like this
tranceiver module TM751 to A and power suply to A1 and conect to first pantilt
tranceiver module TM751 to A and power suply to A2 and conect to pantilt nr 2
tranceiver module TM751 to A and power suply to A3 and conect to pantilt nr 3
tranceiver module TM751 to A and power suply to A4 and conect to pantilt nr 4
when i press on remote control the C1 only the first pantilt (A1) moved
when i press C2 (camera 2) the pantilt nr 2 moved ....
and all now are ok,
now for the all pantilt i must have an tranceiver module TM751
i think this is it, i think my problem is resolved
thanks allot for the help -:)
#:)
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i test again and put batteries on all remote controls but some times on c2 when i press to move the pantilt the other pan tilts move very slowly with pause , but the pantilt 2 move corectly
this is now happened every time, some time move only 2, or 3 with pause moving
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Sounds like the RF signal from some of the remotes. Is not getting to all the other TM751s controlling the other pan and tilt bases.
So when you turn the one on the others didn't turn off.
Are you using a pan and tilt base with a remote in each location?
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Sounds like the RF signal from some of the remotes. Is not getting to all the other TM751s controlling the other pan and tilt bases.
So when you turn the one on the others didn't turn off.
Are you using a pan and tilt base with a remote in each location?
i put all for in one room and sometimes work only 1 camera sometimes signal have interferance and move the other pan tilts
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i test today 2 pan tilt
First pan tilt have selected on TM751 house A and on remote controled xm14a House A and unit 1 and on remote have A
The pantilt nr 2 have selected on TM751 house A and on remote controled xm14a House A and unit 2 and on remote have A
ok now i have 2 remote controled in my hands
i press on first remote button C1 to control the pan tilt 1 ok is work
i press on remote controled button C2 to control pan tilt 2 ok is work
now when i press from remote 1 to control pan tilt 1, doens't work and when presset pantilt 2 moved and not the 1
how to work indepently, so i don't want everytime i want to move an pan tilt to select C1 or C2 ?
please help me
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Since both pan and tilt bases are on the same house code and same unit code group 1-4. Turning one on turns the other one off.
Normally only one base should be on at a time or both will move together.
I am not sure if the house code is sent as part of the pan and tilt commands.
You may want to set one to House Code B1 along with the TM751 and remote. Then see if both can be independently controlled. I don't have too much confidence on this working.
Let us know the results.
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ok i put like that
First pan tilt have selected on TM751 house A and on remote controled xm14a House A and unit 1 and on remote have A
The pantilt nr 2 have selected on TM751 house B and on remote controled xm14a House B and unit 1 and on remote have B
when i press on first remote all the pan tilt move
when i press of the remote 2 again all the pan tilt move
doesn't work
i test again and in put B2 but doesn't change the problem, when i press to all the pan tilt move and not independently
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Thank you for the tests.
It looks like the house code is not part of the pan and tilt commands from the remote.
So only one can be on at a time.
Looks like you will have to go back to A1 and A2 to prevent both moving.
You are going to have to select the one you want to use with the remote.
Either remote should control each camera. Pushing the C1 button on either one should control the A1 camera and C2 on either remote should control the A2 camera.
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Thank you for the tests.
It looks like the house code is not part of the pan and tilt commands from the remote.
So only one can be on at a time.
Looks like you will have to go back to A1 and A2 to prevent both moving.
You are going to have to select the one you want to use with the remote.
Either remote should control each camera. Pushing the C1 button on either one should control the A1 camera and C2 on either remote should control the A2 camera.
so example
i have 2 person
person 1 want to move pan tilt 1
and person 2 want to move pan tilt 2
they can't in the same time to control them independently ?
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this is an transformer
input: 220-240 VAC 50Hz
output: 110-120 VAC 60Hz
20W RMS
This thread is pretty convoluted and I am having a hard time following, but my impression is the Ninja power supplies are not being turned off, so they all track togeather. Having said that, I don't understand how a voltage converting transformer can also boost the frequency by 10Hz out of the secondary(?).
The following is assuming the transformer output is actually 50Hz:
Since the TM751 transmits the PLC at the zero cross point, I assume it and the Ninja power supplies are tolerant of the 10Hz difference since they only look at zero crossing...anyone else know?
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I believe most of the X10 modules can accept 50Hz. The timing is just slower timing.
This particular setup is unique as the X10 power line signals seemed not to get through the step down transformer.
If it is electronic and 60 Hz is coming out of it. We never got a real answer to that question.
Thus a TM751 on each bases transformer.
The problem seems to be one base can be on at a time or they all move.
So No you can not have two different users with remotes only control their base. As one is On and follow the common pan and tilt commands from either remote. If both where On like in one of the tests. Both would follow the commands.
The only exception would be if the bases where far enough apart to not receive the others RF commands. It sounds like yours are not that far from each other.
I am actually surprised this works as well as it does.
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I believe most of the X10 modules can accept 50Hz. The timing is just slower timing.
Thus a TM751 on each bases transformer.
I am actually surprised this even works at all.
Yes, I forgot eyeonu is using RF and four TM751's, one for each Ninja, not PLC, to control.
So each TM751 has to be on separate house code.
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The problem seems to be. The pan and tilt commands are not house code specific and when more than one base is on. They all move even when we tried different house codes; or so it looks.
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hmm yes very strange, but so why c10 came each pantilt with one remote ? if you buy 4 you can use only one remote no ?
another question if we put this pantilt for security, if a thief have an remote x10 remote control, he can move and control all the cameras away no ?
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The problem seems to be. The pan and tilt commands are not house code specific and when more than one base is on. They all move even when we tried different house codes; or so it looks.
yes the house code doesn''t resolve the problem, if i put one on A and other on B the same move together but if i put A1 and A2 they move individualy
some costumers that they have videochat studios ask me if they can use them, and the girls that have separate room to use individualy, but what answer to give them ? they cannot use this item ?
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We are not official X10 here but I would imagine each kit comes with a remote to complete the set.
Those that have more than one kit can use one remote to control them all or each remote can control all of them.
The control of which pan and tilt base is On is done with the addressable power supply. Using power line signals.
All the same house code and groups of four unit codes 1-4;5-8;9-12 and 13-16. Turn one in the group On the other three go Off so they don't follow the pan and tilt commands. If more than one is On they all move.
Larger numbers of bases need software running on a computer or a optional remote that can do up to 16 cameras or bases. Though that one can not do the pan and tilt commands.
Can a thief move the cameras. I guess it is possible, but any X10 remote could send an Off command and turn off the power supplies and cameras if they where X10 models. Though it may take a short time to go through the 256 combinations of house and unit codes.
The folks at the videochat studios maybe out of luck. One girl moves a camera and another one is On. Yes they both would move.
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hmmm i think to resolve the problem is to modify the remote control, someone know how can i modify to send a smaller signal, did this remote have an antena for wireless signal, so i can modify something to send an signal maximum of 5m
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The CR14A remote uses one tuned coil to do both the sending of the RF signal and tuning it to 310MHz. There is no separate antenna and modifying the original coil would make it stop sending.
I am not sure if you could reduce the voltage to the transmitter section enough to get a shorter distance.
Here is X10s information on finding the schematics and internal photos if you want to look at them.
http://kbase.x10.com/wiki/Schematics
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brian the link http://kbase.x10.com/wiki/Schematics did not show me some schematics
do i find something on ?
http://www.fcc.gov/oet/ea/fccid/ ?
there i need to insert some product code ?
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i find it
Grantee Code: b4s Product Code: cr14a
but i don't think it will help me much
i send today the product to an electronist to see if he can male something to the remote so make an lower signal
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If you go to the FCC web site and input the B4S and CR14A. You will find the schematics and internal photos of the unit in the details tab.
It maybe a help to your electronic technician see if it can be done.
X10 does not use any extra components in their designs. So there may not be much that can be done without effecting the transmitters frequency.