X10 Community Forum
🔌General Home Automation => Automating Your House => Topic started by: mboy on March 15, 2012, 07:24:13 PM
-
IBM Home Director 3 pin appliance modules.
2 bedroom lamps with identical CL bulbs (and already swapped with others). 1 lamp works fine (as does my living room). No matter which appliance module I plug in, I can not get the light to turn off. I have changed the address, etc. They all work fine with the other lamp.
-
A typical can't turn it Off but no problem On. Indicates the load maybe making lots of power line noise when On and the Off never gets to it.
If you try that location with a different load does it then work? Maybe an incandescent bulb for the test.
Also could be a poor power line signal to that area and the CFL maybe just enough extra noise or signal absorber to again stop an Off from working.
Are you using any Phase Coupling between the homes incoming power feed?
If the bedroom has different feed for the outlets. The problem one could be on the opposite phase of the power and not getting much of a signal.
Do you have any filters in use on possible noise makers or signal suckers?
http://jvde.us/x10_troubleshooting.htm
http://www.act-remote.com/PCC/uncle.htm
http://www.davehouston.net/
-
Thanx Brian. I will try a different lamp there. I have to go and buy a regular bulb to try as well.
No idea about the other stuff. It is a condo and I am not really up on wiring and electrical stuff :(
-
If the construction is fairly new. Bedrooms maybe powered by an Arc-Breaker for safety. Some are known to be X10 signal problem makers.
Do you know off hand. If your high power devices like an electric stove or dryer, are 220 or 208 volts? I have seen some larger condo complexes and housing developments. Being three phase and not split single phase.
-
Condo was built in 1988 I believe.
Stove and dryer are gas.
I really have no idea about the 220 or 208? How can I tell?
-
If you can't tell if it is 208 or 220. I would not worry about it.
It would have shown if the condo complex used three phase and each unit maybe alternating between two of the three lines.
Maybe the maintenance person may know.
X10 protocol should be able to work with a three phase feed.
-
Its the wierdest thing. So far it is the only outlet I am having trouble with. I may just have to run an extension to the outlet where the other end table lamp is plugged in and run it off of that. Is that possible?
-
Testing with an extension cord to the working outlet could give some clues.
The outlet is a standard one and not a GFCI is it?
-
It is standard and the other identical lamp plugged into it works fine with the appliance module.
-
It is standard and the other identical lamp plugged into it works fine with the appliance module.
My OGS is acting up (Old Geezer Syndrome) and I lost track of elements in this thread, but doesn't that pin point the problem to one specific CFL bulb?
-
No Dave. I have swapped the bulb. From other lamps that were working fine. I have not swapped the actual lamp yet, but I would have hard time beliveing it was the actual lamp itself.
-
The lamp doesn't have a built in dimmer or touch control does it?
-
Nope. and the lamp on the other night stand that is working fine is exactly the same as this one that isn't.
-
I believe you hadn't try swapping the troubled lamp and one that works positions.
Maybe that would be the next thing to try.
-
Exactly what I am going to do when I get home. I will let you know how it goes. I really appreciate your help.
Thank you.
-
Ok, it is def the outlet. The other lamp there did same thing. I moved it to another socket and all worked perfectly fine, so is def the outlet.
I did notice the utlet was cracked and loose, so maybe that is the problem?
I rent and know very little about wiring and stuff, but if this outlet is the prob, I am sure I can swap it out.
-
I doubt the outlet is the issue unless it's got some kind of arcing going on. If so, that would cause noise on the line and, much more importantly, would be a safety concern. If it's cracked, I'd seriously consider changing it. If you plug an appliance in and if it feels lose, then the contacts are bent (probably through wear), so I'd replace the outlet. If you can do it yourself, this is definitely a good first step, but probably not the ultimate solution IMO.
-
After all the tests. I do feel it is the outlet itself.
Cracked and loose contacts as pointed out could be a poor connection.
When On there maybe some arcing even from the small load a CFL presents or the CFLs electronics are reacting to the dirty AC from the Arc.
I would get the outlet changed.
-
I am going to take care of it.
-
When you have the cracked outlet changed.
With the breaker for that outlet is turned off does the other outlet in the room stays on? If it does then they are on different circuits and bkenobi's thought about signal issues maybe the problem. Since you also have signal issues to a Socket Rocket on your porch.
-
They are on same circuit for sure. Flipped the breaker and they both went out.
-
No Dave. I have swapped the bulb. From other lamps that were working fine. I have not swapped the actual lamp yet, but I would have hard time beliveing it was the actual lamp itself.
No, you are right. It isn't likely to be the lamp, unless it could be intermitent and momentarly open circuit when it gets warm. You would have caught that.No help here...sorry.
-
Thanks for the feedback on the outlets both using the same circuit.
-
Going to try and swap it out this weekend.
So, in regards to the socket rocket, what do I do if they are on different wiring or phases? What do I need to make it work with my cm15a?
-
What do I need to make it work with my cm15a?
Turn on the oven or dryer. They will provide a temporary bridge between phases. If the lights then work, you'll need a phase coupler for a more permanent solution (unless you want to do a lot of baking or take in laundry) but I'll let others more current on available hardware make recommendations.
You likely get just enough signal through to turn on the BR lamp but it then puts out just enough noise to block the weak OFF signal.
If the oven/dryer don't help, you need to track down whatever gear is attenuating the signal. It will be something between (electrically) the CM15A and this circuit. What else went off with the breaker? Leave them unplugged and test again, plugging them back in one-by-one until you find the culprit(s).
-
My computer room shut own completely when I flipped breaker off. Including the cm15a. I will turn dryer on now and test
-
Ok, so I turned dryer on an low n behold it worked :). Turned dryer off and still works. WEIRD
Now I just need to address the one outlet and I am golden. I would also like to report the cflbulbsdo work in my socket rocket.
-
Here is pic of outlet 3 wires?
What type should I get to replace this?
-
Now I just need to address the one outlet and I am golden.
Probably, not! You have marginal coupling between phases and/or have a noise-source/signal-attenuator and the gear in your computer room are the prime suspects. The problem is likely to reappear.
-
Looks like a standard duplex outlet. Any hardware or home improvement place should have one.
The original looks like it used the push in connection. You will find a slot where a small screwdriver can be pushed in to unlock the wires. Most of us just cut it off as close to the old body. Strip the wire and use the screw connection over the push in connection. Many replacement outlets have a screw and push in attachment.
I would say an X10 friendly filter on the computer equipment and do not have the CM15A on the filtered side with the other equipment.
A phase coupler maybe also needed.
-
I will swap the outlet tomorrow. My fluorescent kitchen fixture must be noisy because I noticed when it was on, the living room lamp and socket rocket on porch won't Turin on. As soon as I flip the switch they light up when the on command is sent.
-
Well, it isn't the outlet. My cpap machine was plugged into outlet and that must make a lot of noise. When I removed it, that lamp started to work. I miust need some kind of filter for it.
What do I need to block the noise from Cpap machine?
Thanks.
-
Oh we missed the question "is anything else in the outlet". B:(
Look at the problem devices label and see how much power it uses.
Then you can find a filter that is rated for the load.
An XPPF is fine for small loads but pushing it to its 5 amp limit may result in smelling hot.
The Smarthome 1626-10 FilterLinc is rated at up to 10 amps and has an unfiltered outlet on its front cover for another item. I have my UPS on a FilterLinc. The UPS is in the filtered outlet and my Insteon PLM is in the unfiltered outlet.
-
Looks like 4.16a?
-
We are interested in the 100-240 volt current. 1.2 Amps so I would say a XPPF would work fine. A 10 amp FilterLinc would also work if it was easier to find.
The 100-240 Volts is also a clue to it being a switching type power supply and probably has a nice big AC capacitor across its line input. Killing most of the X10 signals. Probably just marginal enough that the CFL when On was enough to stop it going back Off.
-
Just ordered the xppf. Thanks again for all your help. Looks like I am about there now :)