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[fefrie]

I have an old school electric blanket that doesn't have any electronics in it.  Saying that, I can hook it up to an appliance module and it can turn off and on using the appliance module.  Since the blanket doesn't have any electronics in it, everthing is mechanical, it works 'mostly' flawlessly.

I'm concerned about EMF and electric blankets, and I use the blanket strictly to warm up the bed.

My setup has a little of an electric glitch in that if I set the thermostat on the blanket to anything less than "MAX" sometimes, when using the appliance module, when I turn off the blanket, the blanket doesn't turn off 100%.  There seems to be some sort of mechanical glitch in that the thermostat setting for some reason hangs the appliance module from turning off, and the light in the thermostat module in the blanket remains '1/2' on.

When I have the blanket set to max however, there is no problem and it shuts of 100% in that the light turns completely off.  This is how I have the blanket set up now.  The blanket draws only 180 watts, so I don't think that there is too much load.  If you havent had a bed warmed up for a 1/2 hour at max and jump into it so that the bed is pretty dang warm, you're missing out!

When I talk to people about using electric blankets, we all mention in passing that to reduce the possibility of EMF exposure, it's recommended to unplug the blanket before going to be to ensure that there is no residual electricity running through the blanket.

My question is that if the appliance module is turned off, is there some sort of relay that completely disconnects ALL power to whatever is connected to the outlet in the module from the wall.  I've never seen the insides of an x10 module, but there is a loud enough 'thwack' that I would assume that some sort of switch is thrown simialr to a light switch that the connection is indeed terminated. 

My only one worry now is the electric current that is used as part of the sensing circuit to 'listen' to when the local switch is turned off/on to repower the module.

Thanks everybody. 

Asides from getting my lights to dim properly instead of going all the way on or off, everything about x10 works great!

[Brian H]

The Appliance Modules has what is called a local control sensing circuit. It senses if the switch on the appliance is toggled off them back on. When it see this switching it turns back on. This small sensing current maybe enough to keep the light on. Also there is a small amount of current from a circuit used to determine if the mechanical switch is on or off. That way if an on is seen and it is on already it does not toggle off by mistake. As a small test try the blanket and a small incandescent light on the appliance modules output. Maybe one of those power cubes would work. If the blankets light now stays off and you can crank down the heat dial. Local Control is most likely the cause.
Let us know what your test shows and we maybe able to give a more permanent solution.
The new appliance modules [sold as CFL friendly] are much better than the older ones on this respect.

[dave w]

I have an old school electric blanket that doesn't have any electronics in it.  Saying that, I can hook it up to an appliance module and it can turn off and on using the appliance module.  Since the blanket doesn't have any electronics in it, everthing is mechanical, it works 'mostly' flawlessly.

I'm concerned about EMF and electric blankets, and I use the blanket strictly to warm up the bed.

My setup has a little of an electric glitch in that if I set the thermostat on the blanket to anything less than "MAX" sometimes, when using the appliance module, when I turn off the blanket, the blanket doesn't turn off 100%.  There seems to be some sort of mechanical glitch in that the thermostat setting for some reason hangs the appliance module from turning off, and the light in the thermostat module in the blanket remains '1/2' on.

When I have the blanket set to max however, there is no problem and it shuts of 100% in that the light turns completely off.  This is how I have the blanket set up now.  The blanket draws only 180 watts, so I don't think that there is too much load.  If you havent had a bed warmed up for a 1/2 hour at max and jump into it so that the bed is pretty dang warm, you're missing out!

When I talk to people about using electric blankets, we all mention in passing that to reduce the possibility of EMF exposure, it's recommended to unplug the blanket before going to be to ensure that there is no residual electricity running through the blanket.

My question is that if the appliance module is turned off, is there some sort of relay that completely disconnects ALL power to whatever is connected to the outlet in the module from the wall.  I've never seen the insides of an x10 module, but there is a loud enough 'thwack' that I would assume that some sort of switch is thrown simialr to a light switch that the connection is indeed terminated. 

My only one worry now is the electric current that is used as part of the sensing circuit to 'listen' to when the local switch is turned off/on to repower the module.

Thanks everybody. 

Asides from getting my lights to dim properly instead of going all the way on or off, everything about x10 works great!

As Brian said, the amount of leakage for the local sensing is sooooo low, I wouldn't worry about. However Brian did some  testing a while back and found out the new Appliance Modules have much lower sensing current which probably would not make the blankets neon pilot light glow at all. Try purchasing a new module from X10. Also the Appliance modules from Smarthome.com can be programmed for no local sensing and I believe in that mode, all leakage current is turned off.

I keep a layer of aluminum foil between the sheet and blanket.

[Brian H]

No the Smarthome modules even when the Local Sensing is off. The current is still there. In fact the new Smarthome ApplianceLinc's that are less sensitive to noise also have a slightly higher current than the originals. 0.5 ma AC old; 0.7 ma AC new.
I believe all the local off does is tell the module to ignore any local devices switch being cycled.

[dave w]

No the Smarthome modules even when the Local Sensing is off. The current is still there. In fact the new Smarthome ApplianceLinc's that are less sensitive to noise also have a slightly higher current than the originals. 0.5 ma AC old; 0.7 ma AC new.
I believe all the local off does is tell the module to ignore any local devices switch being cycled.

Thanks Brian, I thought the leakage was disabled also.  What did you say the current sensing was on the new Appliance Modules?

[steven r]

...I'm concerned about EMF and electric blankets, and I use the blanket strictly to warm up the bed....

I'm not aware of any EMF research for electric blankets. I learned 30+ years ago that I don't sleep as well with an electric blanket. No idea if any EMF is different with current blankets. I find with a good quilt I can be completely comfortable even with the thermostat turned down to 55.

A "modern day brick" to carry to bed can easily be made by sewing rice into a cloth bag. Microwave for 3-5 minutes depending on the size of the bag you've made. Also great as a heating pad for sore muscles. 

[Brian H]

Old ApplianceLincV2 was about 0.5 ma AC. The new; more load friendly; was 0.7 ma AC. Yes my new one does not click and sputter on my known torture load.  An old inductive ballast under counter light.

[fefrie]

Hey everybody, thanks for being so resposive with my question.

I must clarify, that now with my proper configuration, the light on the electric blanket ALWAYS goes off.

I never quite did trust the residual amperage levels (although I have been sleeping with the blanket in the off position plugged in for years).

So tonight I decided to remove the electric blanket from the x10 appliance and physically unplug it off or on (or make an extension cord with a switch.)

I needed another unit anyways to controll some LED lights outside of my window, and when I plugged the lights in, in the x10 off position, there is enough residual current to have the LEDs dimmly lit.

When I x10 them on they glow bright like they are supposed to, but again when in the off position, there is a faint blow still.

Is this an electronics intereference issue, or is there infact enough amperage or voltage to power a string of 75 LED lights?

Saying that, I'm not going to use x10 units for an electirc blanket.  I"m going to manually plug it in the wall, or make and extension cord with a physical switch.

Geez, this polluted world is turning me into a hypochondriac

[Brian H]

LED Lights can be kept on by the small local control sensing current on the outlet of the appliance module.
The new ones that X10 sells for CFL bulbs has a much lower sensing current but may still keep them glowing dimly. Some have added a small incandescent night light to theirs, I have seen some have used a small wall wart and some use a resistor across the modules outlet. All are ways to load down the small sensing current ; so LED bulbs do not glow dimly when off.

[fefrie]

I'm not really sure how much electricity a string of 75 led lights consumes.  I read on the box that came with it that said that a string of 600 used 24? hours consumes about 63c of electricity a year?

If there is enough power in the sensing circuit to power the LEDs would 1/2 the amount of electricity be used? 1/4?

If I did use a resistor then i would assume that instead of powering the leds, that the resistor would be eating the electricity whenever the leds were"turned off"

So saying that, I'll be ok with leaving the leds 'on' in the x10 'off' position.  Now I can choose between superbright (which was too bright anyways) and low.

The only difference now that I know is that the leds will be on for 24 hours now.  Which is ok, because now I can 'choose' the brightness.  In fact, I think that the leds will last longer? because the leds aren't being over volted or over amped?  I'm not sure of the electrics since I don't have a degree in that, but I think that a large part of the brightness is determined by the voltage?

OT:  I don't see any resistors in the string at all.  I thought that most LEDS were 3v DCV units?? Is there such thing as 120VAC leds?

[Brian H]

The LEDs maybe in series so the voltages add up. There also could be some hidden electronics inside the plug that roughly controls the LEDs.
I have a 36 LED 120 Volt light and you can see small diodes and resistors inside the case.
Depending on the electronics used and how the current is regulated. It would be difficult to say when dim the % of full power used.