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[zguy]

Software: AHP 3.236
Also installed: Smart Macros, iWatchOut, MyHouse Online and OnAlert

Hardware:
AHPro PC USB interface CM15A, monitored HC: D, Transceived HC: A, B, D, O, P
Hawk Eye II Indoor motion sensor MS13A on HC D1-D2
Transceiver TM751 on HC D
Remote Controlled Chime SC546A on HC P1
Lamp module LM465 on HC P1

Macros (stored in interface CM15A):
Test Motion: Trigger: D1 ON, Action: P1 ON, Dim to 12%
Turn Light Off: Trigger: D1 OFF, Action: P1 OFF

Timers (stored in interface CM15A):
On the hour, every hour, every day, send P1 On (sound chime and turn light on)

Goals:

The original intention was to use the Hawk Eye to sound the Chime upon motion detection.  I hoped I was not asking too much trying to do this simple
task... Since it did not worked consistently, I added a few troubleshooting steps.

- Motion sensor D1 On triggers macro "Test Motion" via Transceiver TM751 on HC D which receives and transmit D1 On on the power line.
- Macro "Test Motion" receives D1 On, activates P1 On (the chime and test lamp) and dims P1 to 12%
- Macro "Turn Light Off" receives D1 Off and turns P1 Off.

Expectations:

- When D1 On (Motion detected from MS13A) is received, Chime (on P1) sounds and light Lamp Module (on P1) turns on and dim P1 to 12%
- When D1 Off (No motion detected from MS13A, default 1 minute) is received, run macro "Turn Light Off" which sends P1 Off to turn off the light.
- Every hour, interface timers activate P1 On (sound chime and turn light on)

Results without AHP intervention:

- When D1 On (Motion detected from MS13A) is received, light Lamp Module (on P1) turns on and dim P1 to 12%.  Chime on P1 does not sound.
- When D1 Off (No motion detected from MS13A, default 1 minute) is received, run macro "Turn Light Off" turns light Lamp Module (on P1) off.
- Every hour, interface timers activate P1 On (sound chime and turn light on)

Results using AHP intervention:

- When D1 On (Motion detected from MS13A) is received, light Lamp Module (on P1) turns on and dim P1 to 12%.  Chime on P1 does not sound.  AHP sees D1
On (it's the monitored code) and shows both macros running (Macro "Test Motion" AND Macro "Turn Light Off") as well as the Chime and the lamp turning
on.  The software sees both but only the light comes on.
- When D1 Off (No motion detected from MS13A, default 1 minute) is received, it runs macro "Turn Light Off" and turns light Lamp Module (on P1) off.
- When I turn either the P1 Lamp or the Chime on P1, both react.

Questions:

- When receiving D1 On, why the Chime on P1 does not sound when the light on P1 comes on? They are both on the same code and same electrical circuit
thus on the same phase.
- When receiving D1 On, why is the Macro "Turn Light Off" activated when it should only be when getting D1 Off?
- Within AHP, when turning on the TM751 transceiver, this sends the code D1 on the power line.  Doing this, again, both macros get triggered.  The
"Test Motion" turns on the light but does not sound the chime which are both on the same HC.  And why the "Turn Light Off" macro be acting when it
should only do so when receiving D1 Off?
- Why both devices on P1 don't react the same from within and outside AHP?

This should be a very simple setup to get working.  Yet, it does not.  I know the technology works.  I am simply not impressed with the way X10
implements it...  I plan to post my sad story with X10, but in the mean time, if anyone has suggestions, I'm listening.

[hawk1]

here are some things to try. the tm751 might be stepping on the cm15, since both are monitoring hc d. try removing the tm751 and try again.

put a 2 sec delay in between turning the lamp on and the chime, if the light is still dimming it might not be getting the signal to the chime.

you could put the lamp and chime on different hc and change the macro to reflect this.

i'm no expert but i believe these are just a few things to try. never know. hope this helps

[zguy]

Thanks Hawk1.  Removing the TM751 did not change anything.  However, when I went to add the timer you suggested to the macro which contained only the LM465 on HC P1, Action: P1 ON, Dim to 12%, I added the Chime SC546A to it as well. And it started to work as expected.

I then experimented to make sure the sensor would be caught by the CM15A at different locations.  I ended up re-adding the TM751 at the opposite end of the house to get the chime to sound from anywhere in the house.

I'm not sure if it is adding the chime or the timer that got it working though.  And eventually, the light will be removed any way...  The thing I'm still not getting is why the single P1 ON command did not consistently turn on both.  I mean if they are both listening for that code, one command should be enough to turn them on at the same time.

[Boiler]

zguy,

Welcome to the forum, and thank you for the detailed post.  It makes things far easier to troubleshoot with this type of information.

The basic problem is that your lamp module is dimmable and the chime module is not.  You can mix different types of modules (dimmer/appliance) on a given address, but you must be very careful.  The simplest way to correct this condition is to move your chime to another address.

Actually, hawk1's suggestion of adding a delay (can be a 0 second delay) is a good one and would probably work.  I'd like to take the opportunity to explain why, and offer a different suggestion.

The original intention was to use the Hawk Eye to sound the Chime upon motion detection.  I hoped I was not asking too much trying to do this simple
task... Since it did not worked consistently, I added a few troubleshooting steps.

- Motion sensor D1 On triggers macro "Test Motion" via Transceiver TM751 on HC D which receives and transmit D1 On on the power line.
- Macro "Test Motion" receives D1 On, activates P1 On (the chime and test lamp) and dims P1 to 12%
- Macro "Turn Light Off" receives D1 Off and turns P1 Off.

Expectations:

- When D1 On (Motion detected from MS13A) is received, Chime (on P1) sounds and light Lamp Module (on P1) turns on and dim P1 to 12%
- When D1 Off (No motion detected from MS13A, default 1 minute) is received, run macro "Turn Light Off" which sends P1 Off to turn off the light.
- Every hour, interface timers activate P1 On (sound chime and turn light on)

There are a number of different scenarios for the above.  You did not mention whether your Chime was actually part of the macro.  You may be expecting that sending a P1 ON to the lamp module would also activate the chime.  This may or may not work depending on a number of factors.  The Chime will only respond to a simple "ON" command.  The lamp dimmer will respond to ON, Bright/Dim, and extended code bright/dim commands.  Some of the ActiveHomePro setup options also affect how modules are communicated with.

Here's some examples.

Turn Lamp at P1 on and dim to 12%
Macro D1
Trigger on D1 On
Turn on P1 and dim to 12%

Activity Monitor
Macro  P1  (address the module)
Macro  P Bright 100% (Brighten the module to full on)
Macro  P Dim  88% (Dim the module to 88%)

The above will not activate the Chime since it uses only bright/dim commands (chime will not respond).

So lets add the chime module to the macro.

Turn Lamp at P1 on and dim to 12%, activate chime
Macro D1
Trigger on D1 On
Turn on P1 and dim to 12%
Turn on P1 (chime)


Activity Monitor
Macro  P1  (address the module)
Macro  P Bright 100% (Brighten the module to full on)
Macro  P Dim  88% (Dim the module to 88%)
Macro  P1  (address the module)
Macro P1 ON (turn on the chime)

Now the above gets weird.  The first commands to the lamp module work properly.  The second set of commands to chime do nothing (at least in my case).  Why?  Without going into a long dissertation on how bright/dim commands are a violation of the X10 protocol - let's just say I don't like them.  These are actually a long stream of commands that take many seconds to transmit.  They're hard for devices to decode, and easily interrupted.  In the case above, the Chime module doesn't see the P1 ON because of the Bright/dim sequence that occurred previously.

Here's where Hawks1's suggestion comes in - you can add a delay after the bright sequence to give your chime time to recover and receive the On information.

Turn Lamp at P1 on and dim to 12%, activate chime
Macro D1
Trigger on D1 On
Turn on P1 and dim to 12%
Delay 0 seconds
Turn on P1 (chime)


Activity Monitor
Macro  P1  (address the module)
Macro  P Bright 100% (Brighten the module to full on)
Macro  P Dim  88% (Dim the module to 88%)
Macro  P1  (address the module)
Macro P1 ON (turn on the chime)

With the above 0 second delay inserted, your chime now functions.  Notice however that you are sending a P1 On command out to activate the chime.  You Lamp module (if it is an older model) will respond by turning on at 100%.  If you were to reverse the above sequence (turn the chime on first, then dim the lamp) things would function properly.

In summary, while there are ways to use both of these units on the same house/unit code, I believe this would be a constant maintenance item for you.  The safe and easy way to handle this is to move one of the units to another unit code.

Past that, since you are just beginning your journey into HA, I suspect that you have one of the newer lamp modules with "soft start".  These units operate far better if they are defined as "LM14a 2-way Lamp Modules" within AHP.  This will force AHP to use extended code communication to the device (no more bright/dim sequences lasting 5 seconds).  Things will operate quicker and more reliably.

Boiler

[zguy]

Boiler:

The chime was not originally part of the macro.  I added it at the same I put the timer in. 

Original macro:
Turn on LM465 on P1 and dim to 12%

Current working macro:
Turn on SC546A on P1
Delay 2 seconds
Turn on LM465 on P1 and dim to 12%

Thanks for the explanation on commands stream.  I'll keep that in mind in the future.

By the way, although my forum status says newbie, I'm not.  I've been using X10 technology for about 10 years now...  Where I am a newbie though is getting re-acquainted with the questionable implementation of this technology by a certain supplier...

[Boiler]

By the way, although my forum status says newbie, I'm not.  I've been using X10 technology for about 10 years now...  Where I am a newbie though is getting re-acquainted with the questionable implementation of this technology by a certain supplier...

Zguy,

I suspected you had a bit of experience from the detail you put into your original post. 

As far as the "new technology" is concerned, if you are referring to the newer "soft start" modules, there are quite a few grey beards that are still coming to grips with these units.  The real travesty here is that the units themselves are very nice with arguably "high end" features.  Unfortunately, AHP has not been properly updated to use these features.  ...and the problems begin...

That's why this forum exists,

Boiler