X10 and the future

[Tuicemen]

Maybe I read dhoustons post wrong but I don't think he was implying your X10 setup would be less secure.
it is you online stuff that will suffer which many do now a days like online banking, shopping and such.
Hackers exist just to do harm for the fun of it.
Recently even my site was hit and many visitors most likely infected.
Did this kill anyones x10 setup maybe not but if infected and using the same pc for home automation I'm sure it didn't help.

[beelocks]

You can find scare stories about anything you want - the internet is a big scary place full of big scary stories.

At the end of the day almost no-one will...
a) hack into your wireless system,
2) decode your garage door opener, or
iii) hold you hostage and torture you until you give them the combination to your safe.

The OP was asking about the future of X10 and possible alternatives.

X10 works for some, Insteon woks for others and Z-wave, or UPB works for yet others - at my price point I use a mix of X10 and Insteon with the X10 being phased out as modules die.

Responding with scare stories is rarely helpful to anyone asking a simple question.

"I want to buy a gallon of milk, which brand do you like?" does not deserve a response of "you may get carjacked on the way to the store" or "HOOD once had a salmonella outbreak* so don't ever buy that" or "milk is taking food from the mouths of baby cows".

* this may or not be true, I use it simply as a reference to make a point.

Will you fine gentlemen now please stop, and give the OP some decent advice, or STFU and take your ball elsewhere

[HA Dave]

You can find scare stories about anything you want - the internet is a big scary place full of big scary stories.

And I know of nothing less productive than a scare story ether. (BTW.... I gave a pretty lengthy reply to the OP)

This MIGHT be a perfect opportunity for someone to step up to the plate and start a thread about how to keep a HA PC safe and secure. 

[dhouston]

Maybe I read dhoustons post wrong but I don't think he was implying your X10 setup would be less secure.

A couple of points and then I'll go away.

I did not speculate that anyone would want to control your HA. Some folks need a refresher course in reading and comprehension.

I posted my word of caution a day or two before the news stories about thingbots and spam hit the web. Of the links I posted, only the PC Magazine (another obscure scare-mongerer) article predated (by about a month) the thingbot/spam articles and it was more of a warning (from multiple security experts) that Attacks Are Coming.

The problem with WiFi is that source and destination MAC addresses are always in the clear in all the frames. This makes it easy to steal the identity of a router or other WiFi device via MAC spoofing. Even MAC address filtering will not pose any barrier to a bad guy joining your network. Once in the LAN many things are possible but toying with your lights and appliances are likely to be a very low priority given that there may be more interesting and possibly lucrative (or even terrifying) things to do. Anyway, if I wanted to futz with your lights, I'd just give your neighbors some CFLs.  

Bluetooth has similar vulnerabilities.

• http://www.nsa.gov/ia/_files/factsheets/I732-016R-07.pdf

Imagine what a bogus Bluetooth keyboard might do. I think wireless USB is more secure but I haven't dug too deeply.

Here are more links that provide additional detail about the thingbot/spam attack.

• http://www.technewsworld.com/story/79828.html?google_editors_picks=true
• http://www.proofpoint.com/products/targeted-attack-protection/internet-of-things.php
• http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/01/23/your-refrigerator-is-vulnerable-to-a-cyberattack.html

And, last but not least, here are more on topic links from those obscure Chicken Little scare-mongerers at PC Magazine...

• http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2410889,00.asp
• http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2427593,00.asp

I like the looks of Revolv but haven't a clue about how secure it might be. Many of these systems appear to have been designed by Dr. Pangloss and/or his lab assistant, Pollyanna.

[Noam]

Anyway, if I wanted to futz with your lights, I'd just give your neighbors some CFLs.  

Wait ... That was *YOU*!!??? 

[dhouston]

Here's an update about the security problems posed by web linked Home Automation devices. This time it's Belkin's WeMo system that has been exposed but similar issues are likely with most embedded systems.

• http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/02/19/wemo_home_automation_is_insecure_ioactive/
• http://www.kb.cert.org/vuls/id/656302

BTW, for those unfamiliar with CERT...

• https://www.cert.org/about/

There's a followup in today's Register that Belkin has released updates to address the flaws.

• http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/02/20/belkin_on_wemo_bug_get_the_patch/

And, so HA Dave and beelocks will have something to hyperventilate over...

• http://readwrite.com/2013/09/18/internet-of-things-security-disaster-terrorism-war
• http://www.wired.com/opinion/2014/01/theres-no-good-way-to-patch-the-internet-of-things-and-thats-a-huge-problem/
• http://www.darkreading.com/monitoring/cheap-monitoring-highlights-dangers-of-i/240159061

This issue is sure to be ongoing. There are even those who say that, in the near future, the Internet of Things will be renamed Skynet.  

• http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2014/02/skynet/
• http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/06/internet-of-things-ifttt/
• http://www.computerworld.com.au/article/464821/iot_aussies_prepare_ship_wi-fi_connected_lightbulbs/
• https://lockitron.com/
• http://www.cio.com/article/750242/Cybersecurity_Expert_and_CIO_Internet_of_Things_is_Scary_as_Hell_?page=1&taxonomyId=600013

IoT security probably deserves its own thread.

[dhouston]

Earlier in the thread I posted links to a  PC Magazine review of several HA systems that address the OP's question but did not identify them explicitly...

• http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2410889,00.asp
• http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2427593,00.asp

I like the looks of Revolv but haven't a clue about how secure it might be. It would be very easy for the manufacturer to include an X10 RF channel but, failing that, it might be possible for a third party to supply a module that would translate commands meant for some other (unused) system into X10 RF signals.

[beelocks]

You can find scare stories about anything you want - the internet is a big scary place full of big scary stories.

<sigh>

[dave w]

I think I am lost. I was looking for the man made global warming forum and was directed to this instead.

[HA Dave]

I think I am lost. I was looking for the man made global warming forum and was directed to this instead.

Haven't you heard? The President healed the planet and saved us from global warming. Apparently it was a combination of too low taxes and too high employment (percentage and wages) that caused the warming. A couple more years of the current progress.... and we may be looking at an upcoming ice age.

Please note: This IS in the general category/gen discussion area. And a little humor is a good thing.

[Tuicemen]

A couple more years of the current progress.... and we may be looking at an upcoming ice age.

I thought we were at the start of one now!

[beelocks]

I think I am lost. I was looking for the man made global warming forum and was directed to this instead.

It's always wise to remember the old adage...

Red sky at night, shepherd's delight.
Sheep drowned in the morning, global warming.

[jeremyt850]

Yep, this is definitely scary stuff.  My wife and I just purchased a smart refrigerator about a month ago.  Boy, I sure wish I had seen this page before we bought the frige.  I was able to find a story with some tips for those of us who already have the so-called  smart appliances.  

But even with this, it's still a bit spooky to think that someone else could gain control of your appliances.  And possibly even my personal information from our WI-FI network. Anyways, the story is here:http://www.accreditedappliance.net/news/could-your-smart-refrigerator-be-spreading-a-virus/

• http://zeenews.india.com/news/net-news/hackers-use-connected-home-appliances-to-launch-global-cyberattack_905067.html
• http://gadgets.ndtv.com/internet/news/large-botnet-traced-back-to-hacked-refrigerator-by-cyber-security-researchers-472608
  
• http://securitywatch.pcmag.com/security/319244-predictions-securing-protecting-the-internet-of-things

[dave w]

OH JUST GREAT! Not only does my refridgerator send out porn, but my ice cream melts at the same time.  

I'm forming "Dave's Revived Luddite Society". There will be a tweet with details soon.