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[blades]

Hi all,

This is my first post here - and it's a bit lengthy!  I am not a forum newbie, just new to this one.

I want to start by saying that I'm not interested in an x10 bashing session.  I really just want to get what seems like a pretty cool product working in a pretty basic way.  I've seen a lot of mud slinging around here and while I see the points on both sides, I simply don't have the time to debate the issues

Here are the basics of what I have:
3 B/W cameras (were supposed to be the low light kind, but they shipped me the normal ones.  Floodlights are providing enough light for my application)
3 ActiveEye motion sensors
1 wall-wart transceiver (the white box with an antenna)
1 USB PC transceiver (firecracker module, right? - looks like a small black turtle with a skinny wire coming off it)
1 USB Wireless video receiver
Multi-view software

Here are the basics of what is currently working:
1 The Muitiview software loads and does not crash - drivers seem to be correctly installed and updated to the latest available on the support site
2 When I jiggle the window after it has been made inactive, it shows the correct contents (for the most part)
3 The 3 cameras switch through the cycle like they are supposed to - live video portion changes to the correct camera
4 Pictures are taken if I choose the "always save pictures" for the camera.
5 I can use the "on-screen" version of the camerapad remote to choose which camera is currently selected

Here are where my problems are:
Minor problem #1:
Related to the above, #2 and #4.  The pictures are always "one off" from what they should be.  I believe this to simply be that the cameras are not switching quickly enough (they take about 1.5 seconds).  The software says "change cams...snap..." then the latency for camera startup passes and the correct camera is shown, but the picture is already saved incorrectly.

The major thing I need fixed ASAP
Motion detection is not causing multi-view to take the snapshots it's supposed to.

Here's what I can tell you: 
I tested the motion sensors before mounting them to the outside of the house.  Simple tests like going into the Firecracker setup and monitoring the commands being received.  They were correct.  Then I set a motion detector to the unit code I wanted, associated with one of the cameras, and made sure that it, when activated, would activate that camera and takes snaps.  It did.

We mounted the sensors.  Sensor A1 (triggering camera A1 for simplicity) was detecting motion.  I could tell this because the red LED on it would flash dimly.  At the computer, the live vid window would switch over to that camera - taking the software out of its cycle - this is a good sign.  Then it would take a snapshot or two, or none, but never what I asked it to do.  It got dark and we ran out of time.

I went back yesterday.  The motion detectors still flash when they "see" you, but nothing happens at the PC.  No video switching (actually it may have done this once or twice - it's just really hard to tell with trying to watch all of it and troubleshoot at the same time), definitely no image saving.

There are a number of smaller issues that I want to correct if I can get past this part, but I really need to get this going before Monday if at all possible.

I contacted support via phone and they passed me to second level support via email.  From them I have gotten a number of copy/pastes of knowledgebase articles from the regular site and commentary like "not enough details were provided to assist you.  Please supply more detail".  I think my verbosity is grossly apparent in this post alone.  All my emails to the techs have been similar in description and detail.  Then there is a several hour or several day turn around to get another email back.  It's quite frustrating, as I own a tech support company and am thusly aware of the level of detail usually needed to do any worthwhile troubleshooting.  I feel I've supplied that.

I have one idea as to what the problem with this may be, but my issue is the troubleshooting.  I can't tell if:
a.  the motion detector is sensing motion and just not sending that info out
b.  the motion detector in sensing motion, sending out that signal, but it's not being received at the computer and therefore the camera
c.  the motion detector is sensing motion, sending out the signal which is being received by the PC, but the software is not processing it correctly.

I'm leaning towards option "b".  Wondering if lengthening the skinny little wire with a small piece of phone cable would help here - as I saw another guy do to increase range of the wireless.  I suppose the most difficult part here is that I cannot tell what the problem is, so I feel like I'm just guessing at solutions and spending a bunch of time chasing the wrong rabbit down the wrong hole.  A diagram from x10 showing EXACTLY how the pieces talk to one another would be helpful, as would some sort of diagnostic tools or a phone call with an actual technician who could walk you through some of this.  I'm technical - I feel for the folks who aren't.

Anyone with any information to share will be greatly appreciated.

Blades

[al437la]

Hi blade,
The problem you are describing towards the end seems indeed to be related to a range limiting issue.
I am not sure what the circumstances are, but it appears that the RF connection between the motion sensors and the transceiver (whether it be the white box or the PC version) is sometimes shaky. Meaning it sometimes works and sometimes it doesn't
The only way to ensure a decent communication between the motion sensor and the transceiver is to shorten the distance.

Alternatively, you could try extending the antenna on the transceiver. The white box transceiver has en extendeable antenna and its length matches the 433 mHz carrier frequency for the RF communication. The PC transceiver does not. So extending this antenna to about 12.75 inches makes a lot of sense.

If the internal connection between the circuitry and the antenna wire is ok, adding a few inches of wire to the antenna will work as long as you can electrically couple them. The reason I mention the internal connection is that I have seen this broken when testing it with a multimeter.

I hope this helps

[Tuicemen]

I'm not exactly sure which transciever you have TM751?
Not sure if the usb fire cracker will work with out the transciver (don't own one) but if it doesn't  then try it without the tm751.
As al437la stated it is probly a RF issue. You can make a passive antena with a peice of coat hanger mounted just above or below the motion sensor only a small section is needed. (think it is 9 inches max)
Also take note as to the location of your wall transceiver ! Any large metal object close by will effect it ( filling cabnet, metal studing etc?)
I know just more questions then answers! but there is so much that can effect the system cordless phones on the 2 ghz band, micro waves, wireless routers,kids toys etc, etc....

[blades]

Hey...thanks for the replies thus far.  I'm going to attempt the lengthening of the antenna first - hopefully I can get the owner to do that today so I can attempt to see if it works this evening.

For what it's worth: I have a plug-in-the-wall transceiver - white - segmented pullout antenna.  I also have the USB version of the firecraker module.  I know that if I unplug the pluginthewall one, pushing buttons on the on-screen remote stops working.  So I feel that THIS transceiver is fine.  It does reliably change to the correct camera via the options I have to do so.

It seems that the only thing the firecracker is doing is detecting the motion detector's wireless signal and passing it on to be converted by the wall box to electrical signals.

I'll definitely update this posting with whatever we come to!

Blades

[WinS]

It's been a while since I used the MultiView software, but here's what I remember:  The motion sensor sends RF to the Firecracker (CM19A) which tells the program what HC and UC was received.  The program looks at the conversion settings input by the user during the setup procedure and tells the Firecracker to send the appropriate RF HC and UC to the transceiver (TM751).  The transceiver sends that HC and UC as PLC (house wiring) to the cameras.  X10 recommends that separate HC's be used for the motion sensors and the cameras, in groups of four, i.e., cams A1-A4 and sensors B1-B4 as an example.  The MultiView program must be set up to convert B1 from a sensor to trigger cam A1, etc. 

If the program is set up properly and the RF signal is getting to the firecracker - things should work.  If not, I would test with a sensor near the firecracker to determine if range is the problem.  Also, I think the firecracker program came along with the product, which allows you to monitor the signals received and transmitted - a helpful tool.  Hope my memory is accurate.

[blades]

Thanks WinS...That seems to describe what I thought should be the order of things and helps confirm.  Again, I'm going to try extension of antennas, as I know that the motions at least did SOME of the stuff they were supposed to do, so I believe it to be more range than a problem with the motions.

I recall reading that the HC and UCs don't have to be the same between the motions and the cams, but I didn't see anything that indicated that it was a requirement to set them to different house codes.  I will add this to my list of things to try in case the range/antenna ideas don't work.

Thanks again for the info.

Blades

[WinS]

Blades -You're probably right about the different HC's.  I think I used different HC's to prevent the 731 transceiver from acting on RF signals from both the motion sensors and the Multiview program.  This would add unneeded PLC traffic. 

Another thought - if you get tired of listening to the TM731 clicking, you could avoid using UC 1 for your cams.  As you probably know, the first UC for the HC used is for switching the TM 731 outlet on and off. 

[blades]

Good tip about the clicking.  After I get things stabalized, I'll probably change that, as they have mentioned the clicking and asked if it was supposed to/would continue to do that.

I did preliminary tests last night and what proved most beneficial was just moving the pc/usb transceiver closer to the motions.  I got one of the three to start firing commands off, so that's good.  I am getting an active USB extension cable (16') today.  I will drop that through the floor and across the room, sitting it above the downstairs dropped ceiling.  This will place it within about 20' of any of the three motions, each with only one outside wall between.  One of the three may be a challenge, but it's only seperated by a little more air (it's on a fencepost about 15' from the outside of the house).

Anyway, this will hopefully fix most of the large issue.  I'll update after the cable is put in (tonight/tomorrow).

I'm sure I'm going to want to address the other issues as well (wrong image in wrong square becasue of camera delay but not picture snapping delay and a few others) so if you have any ideas, they would be much appreciated as well.  I'm also going to want to get the emailing of pics as well, which will hopefully go smooth once the hardware is working dependably.

Blades

[blades]

Hey everyone...I have an update:

I changed around the locations of the trsnceivers and the motion detectors and I got all of them working.

But:  I still am having some issues.  Every time someone goes by a motion detector, I can see the motion trigger - the firecracker software shows A1 on, A2 off, whatever is appropriate - almost exactly at the right times, save a few times. 

So I know that the motions are working and the signals are getting to the computer.  I also know that multi-view is smart enough to start taking pics.  The probem is that, no matter what, the software never takes as many pics as I want it to.  Even if I just linger around the A1 cam (or whichever, they all act the same), motion is seen, and some pics are taken, but NEVER as many as i asked or at the interval I wanted.  Instead of 1 per second or 1 per 2 seconds or whatver, at best it might get 2 or 3 shots that are obviously seperated by at least 5 seconds, so you'll see someone entering the area and then maybe leaving the area, but not much of anything while they were there. 

I would really like it to be more depedable - more specifically, more predictable - where it does what the interface suggests it will.

Any thoughts, as usual, are welcome and appreciated.

Blades

[tom j]

"I want to start by saying that I'm not interested in an x10 bashing session.  I really just want to get what seems like a pretty cool product working in a pretty basic way.  I've seen a lot of mud slinging around here and while I see the points on both sides, I simply don't have the time to debate the issues"

Well I can understand how you feel, but if you continue to buy enough of this stuff you'll be bashing them to after a while. Take my case for example I've on my fifth VCR Commander II, fifth! I've spent a small fortune on all these cameras and right out of the box the VCR Commander II won't even learn the house codes let along the rest of the programing. I post these issues so that x10 will hopefully respond to some of these problems. I've spent more on postage the the actual cost of he unit. Best Of Luck With Yours.

Tcj

[WinS]

Blade....I've been trying to think of some positive spin regarding the remaining problems you describe.  I cannot.  I remember the same issues and countless hours of attempted workarounds.  Back then there were other, even more serious issues as well.  The best I could do for images was about a three second delay for saved images.  The wrong window captions was only corrected with a very long delay between cam switching.  With the iWitness plugin available with ActiveHome Pro, I doubt there will be much time spent by X10 on upgrades or fixes for MultiView.  Once the early bugs were out of MultiView, I was happy to have it working as well as you now say your system is working.  But I have to say that even the beta version of iWitness was better, and with many more options available.