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[merkelck]

I am experiencing some issues with my home system and would appreciate any thoughts on how to correct this issue. First of all, some background and details. I am using the current version of AHP software on a pc running WinXP Pro. The interface is the CM15A with the external antenna mod. The CM15A is plugged into an XTB which is connected to the circuit breaker panel via it’s own breaker. There are no other devices on that circuit. The breaker panel has a phase coupler installed. I have thoroughly mapped the house and know exactly which outlet goes to which breaker and which phase it is on. There is a separate breaker for the computer system and it is isolated with an inline filter. The wife’s computer and sewing machinery are isolated with plug in filters as is the tv/entertainment system. There is also a filter installed in a 4 tube fluorescent lamp that was causing noise. There are nine X10 devices  on one house code and I have an irrigation controller (Rain8) on  a separate house code.  Using the Elk meter, I know the signal level at each X10 device. I also used this meter to verify noise levels.  The monitored house code is the one that nine house devices are on. Of these nine device, two are controlled with motion sensors and the other seven are controlled by timers. I use two PalmPad  controls, one for the house units and one for the irrigation units. I use these pads when it is desired to control devices at odd times. The irrigation pad is used when I need to do maintenance on the system such as replace a head or just to make sure the system is functioning properly. I also have two stick on switch remotes that control several of the timer controlled devices. All of these remote devices work flawlessly. As does any command from the computer.
The problem I have is with two of the timer controlled units. Intermittently, of course, two of the timer controlled devices will not respond at the given times. I always download everything to the interface and only use the computer for troubleshooting or manual selections. When I examine the activity log, the command does not even appear to have been sent. If I use the mouse and command the module, it responds as it should and the command shows in the log. I have cleared and downloaded all timers several times as well as completely reinstalling AHP. I have also made sure that the device in use matches the device shown in the computer module unit settings. The X10 devices are the PLM01 and the lights are low wattage incandescent lamps. However, the problem still exists. It is very annoying because they seem to affect the lights that I use for security purposes.  Sometimes they will not go off at the set time and sometimes they will not come on. I have tried using the REPEAT selection on the timer set up page and I can’t say that has solved the problem. It is my understanding that using the REPEAT command  tells the system to repeat the command three times. Mine seems to send the command as many as 20 times as seen in the log.
I have another question regarding the log entries shown as “Status Request”. Is the computer sending this command or is it coming from the interface? I sometimes see as many as fifteen log entries. They all seem to happen in the evening hours. Is this polling the monitored units and reporting their status to the AHP program?
I am hoping someone out there has been there and done that. I have what seems to be great control of the installed devices from the computer and the remote pads but the response to the timers is really eroding my confidence in the system. I travel for extended periods and would sure like to regain my confidence. Two of the units turn on cameras which give me some level of security but I would sure like to be able to trust these security lights.

[Boiler]

merkelck,

Sounds like you've done your homework (yes that's a pun).  Seriously, you've done so many things correctly, but you're still having timer problems...

Let's break things down a bit -
1) You mentioned the PLM01 - the newer versions of these devices most likely use "soft start" and other features.  The correct AHP interface to use is the LM14a two way lamp module.  This interface uses "extended code" protocol. Unfortunately, I don't believe that the XTB has supported extended code transmissions until very recently (please check with Jeff Volp).  If you are using the LM14a interface, the XTB may not be amplifying the output.

2) You mentioned that you don't "see" timer log entries for the PLM01.  Depending on the AHP version you are running, Extended code transmissions from the CM15a will not show up in the log.  They do occur as scheduled, they just don't register in the log.  I know this was true of V3.204.  Not sure of the later version, nor can I recommend them.  Try running a short term test using your ESM1.  Set the timer to execute in 1 minute and watch the ELK.  If the ELK registers the extended code transmission and you don't get a log entry, it's SNAFU.

3) The status request is a Valid X10 transmission (requesting status of a 2-way capable device).  Is this a transmit (from the CM15a) or a receive (from something else)?  The only thing that you've mentioned that might be be capable of generating a status request is the Rain8 (I've no experience here).

Boiler

[merkelck]

Boiler,
Having done the homework makes these problems even more exasperating.

1. Yes the PLM01 does have the soft start feature. All of these units that I have timer issues with work perfectly when commanded from the computer or the remote control pad. My XTB is about two years old. And my AHP version is v3.236.

2. What I mean here is this, the actual event time will pass and there will be no log entry nor will I see a command on the ELK. If I send that command via the computer or a remote pad immediately after the event , it will show on the ELK and in the log.

3. The Rain8 responds to RF only from either the CM15a or a remote pad. I have a separate pad just for the irrigation. I really don't know that it could be sending that. Rain8 makes a unit that can be polled and the status report in real time I do not have the model.

More efforts.
Yesterday, (the weather is bad here so I have time to fool with this thing), I took three of the units that are involved in this weird timer operation and eliminated all of their timers. Then I created a macro to turn these three items on one minute apart from each other. These are security lights . Then I set a timer for the macro to come one at dusk. I then created a second macro with a timer to turn them off at 2200.
They turn off at one minute intervals . Of course, then work fine when commanded but I will give this a few days to see if they can work by themselves.
There is a another topic here about "bizarre operations". I can empathized totally with this guy because I see many of things he is seeing.
Another thing that I am concerned with is the external antenna on this CM15A. I wonder if it is making that device far too sensitive??
I don't know of any other folks nearby using this stuff but there is no reason why I would know that. Sometimes my "Find other Computers" page is just covered with yellow/red marks marks.  The problem is that there is no way to tell when they occurred. Once in a great while, I will see a wild "A" or "P" entry in my log.
I would just like to get this thing to where I can trust it. We travel six months of the year and it has been working fine for the past two years. But the way it going now, I am going to hate to leave. I guess I will just have to install a couple more cameras to see what is working and what is not. Fortunately, I can  access this computer via remote desktop whenever I have a hispeed internet connection.
Thank your taking the time to reply.

[JeffVolp]

Unfortunately, I don't believe that the XTB has supported extended code transmissions until very recently (please check with Jeff Volp).  If you are using the LM14a interface, the XTB may not be amplifying the output.

Actually, the simple XTB doesn't have the smarts to distinguish between normal and extended codes.  It simply boosts whatever is sent to it through the X10 Input receptacle.  As most of you know, the XTB is not a repeater, and will not boost signals seen on the powerline like its big brother.  The XTB-IIR always supported extended codes sent through either the X10 Input receptacle, or the digital port.  The most recent firmware added the ability to also repeat "doublet" extended codes sent by a remote CM15A.

Jeff

[merkelck]

Jeff,
Would there be any advantage or improvement in performance if I switched to the other XTB device?

[Boiler]

Boiler,
Having done the homework makes these problems even more exasperating.

1. Yes the PLM01 does have the soft start feature. All of these units that I have timer issues with work perfectly when commanded from the computer or the remote control pad. My XTB is about two years old. And my AHP version is v3.236.

2. What I mean here is this, the actual event time will pass and there will be no log entry nor will I see a command on the ELK. If I send that command via the computer or a remote pad immediately after the event , it will show on the ELK and in the log.

3. The Rain8 responds to RF only from either the CM15a or a remote pad. I have a separate pad just for the irrigation. I really don't know that it could be sending that. Rain8 makes a unit that can be polled and the status report in real time I do not have the model.

merkelck,
I tried V3.236 a number of months ago.  I encountered several problems including issues with timers.  If you are only using timers/motion activation (no cameras or security) I would recommend reverting to 3.204.

If you're interested, I tried to document some of the problems I encountered here: Software Problems Version 3.236

To be honest, I became rather disgusted with the software (major step backward in my opinion) and have switched to Insteon for most of my needs.

Jeff,
Sorry - I really fouled that post up.  What I was trying to refer to was the extended code "doublet" repeating feature that you have added to the XTB-IIR.  Instead I referred to the wrong device (XTB) and the wrong mode of operation (digital port).  Sorry for the mis-information.

Boiler

[JeffVolp]

Jeff,
Would there be any advantage or improvement in performance if I switched to the other XTB device?

Your configuration should work fine.  You have your CM15A plugged into the XTB near the distribution panel, and you already have a phase coupler installed.  While the big brother has some benefits, such as boosting commands sent from other controllers in your installation, and automatic shutdown in event of a "command storm", it may not have any impact on your current problem.

After thinking about this for awhile, I think the problem may be due to noise on the powerline.  I understand the CM15A is a polite device, and will not send a command if it thinks there is X10 activity on the powerline.  The return signal amplifer in the XTB makes up for losses in the coupling networks, and also provies some gain to help recover weak signals.  Powerline noise near the X10 band will also be amplified.  Some noise can mimic X10 signals, and the CM15A may be delaying transmission waiting for that noise to clear.  The fact that you see multiple copies of some commands leads me to believe the CM15A is reissuing commands because it thinks it is seeing collisions with other X10 signals.

Since this problem began recently, carefully look at any electrical devices you may have added about the time the problem started.  Even something as simple as a new cellphone charger can be the culprit:  http://jvde.us/x10/x10_cellet_noise.htm

Last year I experienced a noise problem here that was eventually tracked down to a 120V LED bulb that worked fine for several months, and then became a major noise source.  I added a bandpass filter in the XTB return signal amplifier, similar to that in the XTB-IIR, to help it deal with excessive powerline noise.  If you would like that upgrade made to yours, please contact me separately.  However, it will not help if the noise is near the X10 frequency.  Your best approach would be to try to track down the source.

Jeff

[merkelck]

Thanks to Boiler and Jeff,
Well, I have a couple of things to look at now. I am going to have to get a hold of X10 and see if they will send me the older software version as I can not seem to locate it on this computer. There is definitely  a place in time where these things started to go downhill.  Now I just have to think back and see if I can pin it to the software upgrade or to another device being introduced into the household. Of course, there are other strange things such as the fact that two other timers have never given me a single problem. I think another thing I will try is to reset the CM15 and then reload all the macros and timers and then disconnect it from the computer and watch it for a day or so. I guess the question is, in that mode will there be any activity log? I may even disconnect the antenna as there is nothing necessary via rf. At least for these units giving me the headaches.
Thanks both for your help
Kent

[Dan Lawrence]

Thanks to Boiler and Jeff,
Well, I have a couple of things to look at now. I am going to have to get a hold of X10 and see if they will send me the older software version as I can not seem to locate it on this computer. There is definitely  a place in time where these things started to go downhill.  Now I just have to think back and see if I can pin it to the software upgrade or to another device being introduced into the household. Of course, there are other strange things such as the fact that two other timers have never given me a single problem. I think another thing I will try is to reset the CM15 and then reload all the macros and timers and then disconnect it from the computer and watch it for a day or so. I guess the question is, in that mode will there be any activity log? I may even disconnect the antenna as there is nothing necessary via rf. At least for these units giving me the headaches.
Thanks both for your help
Kent

You don't have to get a hold of X10 to get an earlier version of AHP.  Just go to http://software.x10.com/pub/applications/activehome/ and look for 3.204.  Get that and install it over your current version.  Once 3.204 is installed, open AHP. Under Help, use the "check for update" link. That will install 3.228. Once 3.228 is installed, you can either check to be sure your .ahx file is loaded or load it and upload it to the CM15A.

[merkelck]

Dan, I went to that site and found a a lot of files. There is a group of them with ahp in the title but they all appear as updates. Are they just updates from the previous version? I downloaded the file marked "ahp_updt_204.exe". Somehow, I don't think running that over 3.236 is doing the right thing. Do I need to uninstall 3.236 first?

Since yesterday afternoon, I reinstalled the three troublesome units into macros instead of plain timers. I made a macro for "turn on" and one for "turn off" . I was surprised to learn that the timer actuation of the macro does not produce a activity log entry. However, the system worked for both the turn on and turn off. However, the internal timing of the turn on macros seemed  to be have a problem. The second light had a five minute delay but turned on after three minutes. Then it received a second on command at the original five minute time. I have no idea where that on command came from at  three minutes. The third light came on at it's five minute interval. But other than that, there were no unusual log entries except that right after the last device of the turn on macro completed, I got  121  entries like this  "DATE    TIME    RECEIVE    STATUS REQUEST" . The entries were spaced one second apart. And they all registered on the ELK meter as valid X10 signals. I have no idea where this stuff comes from.  This evening, I plan to disconnect the CM15 from the computer and see what happen over this four hour period.

[Dan Lawrence]

I had 3.236 for a while, and began to notice timers weren't running or were early or late.  This became acute at Christmas time when outdoor displays that are on X10 failed to shut off when the timers told them to.

So off to the X10 software site, got 3.204 and installed that over 3.236.  When the install was complete, I opened AHP, cleared the CM15A, used the update link in AHP to get 3.228 and that install ran.  Then I reopened AHP (now 3.228), uploaded all the timers and the single macro to the CM15A and everything worked the way it was supposed to and has through this day.

If you got 3.204 from the software site, run it, then do what I posted here.

[merkelck]

Dan,
I did exactly as you described. Then using the same .ahx file, I gave the thing one test opportunity last night. At the ON cycle, all three lights came on as directed by the macro. However, at the OFF cycle, only two of the lights turned off. I watched the ELK meter and all commands appear to have been sent. The log sows they were all sent right on time. But the one lamp did not respond. There was also a mystery line in the log. I have no idea where it came from.  "date-time =-TRANSMIT- M10- extended code 3.3b"  M10 is one of my irrigation system appliance modules that turns on the main power to the system but it was not on when I physically checked it. I turned the offending lamp off with the keyboard and then the log was blasted with a string of "STATUS REQUEST" entries (45 of them). I still can't find out what causes those....
I guess I am going to have to hook up a scope to the offending outlet and see if there is noise there that the Elk meter does not show. One of the things that I did not check is new a HVAC unit in the attic that may be producing noise or sucking signal. It will be easy to turn off. AS you can tell, I am just grasping at straws. 

[Dan Lawrence]

Try creating a totally new .ahx file and upload that (clear the interface first) to the CM15A.  Your current one may be corrupt.

[bugby]

Thought I would put my 2 cents in here as well.  Had similar problems with macros and timers not working.  Also had other "weird and unexplainable" things happening, with endless repeating signals and looping of commands.  Tried various programs and read through the forums, which were VERY HELPFUL.  Had a perfectly working system with my older HouseLinc unit but went to the AHP and CM15A when the Houselinc began to have clock problems. When I went to the "new system" of software and controller, everything became unstable and unreliable.

Bottom line, I installed AHP version 3.204 over the top of version 3.236, cleared the interface memory, downloaded the program again without making any changes and instantly all my problems disappeared! In my humble opinion, version 3.236 should be pulled or updated since there seems to have been so many problems with it.

So for those of you that are completely baffled with intermittent and strange things happening and you've done your homework and still can't find the problem, I suggest doing what has been explained earlier in this string.  It worked for me.

[merkelck]

I have done some more checking and have located another problem that is intermittent. I put the ELK at the outlet of one of the flaky units and discovered that the previously mentioned offending florescent light fixture would cause a one bar indication when turned on. So last evening, I begged my wife to turn that light off during the period of the security light shutdown sequence. (now separate timers). Everything worked  as advertised. So now I have to find a solution to that problem. It may be as simple as installing the in line hash choke as described by Jeff. Or I may try to find the Leviton 6287 filter. The dismantled XPPF does not do the job. But I am in agreement with dumping v3.236. I have version installed as described by Dan and that is way I am leaving it.
Thanks for all the comments. The real solutions come from this forum!!!!!
Kent