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[Septi]

I'm setting up a light security system for a local gent. He doesn't want anything complicated; just a few motion sensors in his building that, when tripped, will turn on a blaring alarm that he can hear from his house a little ways away.
So, I was wondering what exactly I'd need. My original idea was:

3 MS14As that, when triggered would transmit to
TM751 Transceiver, which would then switch on the
AM466 Appliance Module, connected to the siren.

Simple, right? Then I realized that, though a remote could be used to turn the alarm off, there would still be no way to switch the sensors off. It would be kind of embarrassing to enter his own place and have the alarm go off, and once switched off have it turn right back on again every time he moved.

So, I got looking at the Protector Plus. It seems good, given that it's a security console and all. But, unless I'm missing something it can't be configured to turn on an AM466 in the event of an alarm trip, right? It only flashes Lamp Modules, an Appliance Module would turn on once and shut right off (or so I've read). Further, the remote only has buttons for the alarm and lights, so there would be no way to switch the AM466 off. Nevermind, was looking at the wrong remote; the SH624 has dual-purpose buttons.

Which brings us to the ActiveHome Pro. Like a plain old Transceiver, it'll pass through the signal from the motion sensors and turn on the alarm, but also like the Transceiver, there's no way to disable the sensors, correct?
And so, I would have to also get the OnAlert plugin and configure it all as a security system, so that the sensors could be "disarmed" when the system is in Home mode, yes?

He's wanting to do this as cheaply as possible, and that last one is the only way I can see of doing it; and it seems a little overly complicated and expensive. Then again, I'm completely new in the X10 scene, so I'm hoping someone can point out a simpler way :\

Thanks!

[Brian H]

Though the Protector Plus can trigger a PowerHorn Siren Accessory.
It would have to be placed where it could be heard by the building owner.
http://www.x10.com/security/x10_ph508.htm
http://www.x10.com/security/x10_sh10a.htm

X10 sometimes has deals and you can get the PowerHorns cheaper than the price in the above links.

[Septi]

I don't think the Powerhorn would be loud enough. I've seen it described as "being loud enough to scare people away within a few rooms", which...isn't nearly loud enough. This has to be something that can be heard well from a half a block away in another building; which is why I was planning on using something....bigger.

Guess I could always dissect a Powerhorn and hook its output up to a loudspeaker.

Hmm...

[Brian H]

You can't hook a speaker to the Powerhorns. They do not use speakers. They use a Piezo Sounder that is very high impedance and the drive is a of a high voltage nature.

[HA Dave]

The DS7000 would be the best choice. If you want an added... [say 10watt] external siren... you could use a SocketRocket (SocketRockets are not recommended for anything other than regular lightbulbs) with an adapter and a small wallwart power supply. That should drive a small siren till it is turned off (or the police shut it down).

However... if the "building" is on the same powerline as the "gents home".... you can merely put the X10 sirens or module in his HOME. The X10 powerline signal would send the signal.

[Charles Sullivan]

 <snip>
Which brings us to the ActiveHome Pro. Like a plain old Transceiver, it'll pass through the signal from the motion sensors and turn on the alarm, but also like the Transceiver, there's no way to disable the sensors, correct?
  <snip>

With AHP and a CM15A, a Flag can be used to inhibit the actions resulting from the motion sensor signals.

The motion sensors could trigger a CM15A macro which would turn the AM486 ON, but only if a Flag is not set.  A remote could trigger another pair of macros which would either set or reset the Flag (and probably also turn OFF the AM486 if the Flag is being set).  Finally, in case the gent forgets to do it with the remote, a timed macro could reset the Flag once (or a few times) daily during unoccupied hours, or maybe just reset the Flag a couple of hours after it's been set, depending on his usage of the building.

There are lots of possibilities like this when the hardware has some built-in smarts.  The above won't require that a computer be running after the macros are programmed into the CM15A.  (OnAlert requires a running computer for operation.)

[nybuck]

Alright, Alright!   

I've heard all you X10 Gurus talk about the "right" way to do it, and the "advanced" way to do it, but he was looking for "as cheaply as possible".

How about 2 TM751 modules on 2 different house codes, the motion sensors and a palm pad.
You plug one module to the wall on House code D1. 
You plug another TM751 module into that [code D1] module, on house code A1. 
You plug a 12v power supply and a really loud siren into the [code A1] TM751 module.
Set all motion sensors for house code A1.

Now, turn on D1 with your palm pad.  Alarm activated. 
Motion will trip the TM751 on code A, supplying power to the 12v transformer, and the 12v siren.  Want it loud?  Mount one inside and one outside.  If you can find a 120v siren, even better! 
Turn D1 off with the palm pad.  Power is interrupted to the Code A1 module, effectively shutting off your "alarm system", silencing your siren, and rendering building entrance without blowing out your ears.   

You say you want a visual indicator when the alarm is active, so you won't accidentally trip it?  Plug a 3-way extension cord into the D1 module.  Plug a lamp and the A1 module in together.  Now, when the power is active to the A1 module (alarm active), the lamp is also on.  When you deactivate the alarm, the lamp goes off.

Not high-tech, but cheap and dirty....  Just like the X10 ads!   

[Brian H]

AH Cheap and Dirty. Creative use of X10. 

[Septi]

Haha, I'd actually considered what you said nybuck, only using one AM466 on top of another instead; discarded it because I didn't think X10 signals went through the AM466, so the second one would be "blind". Didn't even think of doing it with two TM751s, for some reason. 

I might still recommend ActiveHome Pro for the added functions, but something tells me shaving ~$100 off the system is going to be very appealing to him, and I'm liking the simplicity of stacking TM751s like that.


Then, with that, I shall revise the shopping list and present it to him. Thanks guys!

Edit: only one problem I can see...the TM751's unit code can't be changed, only the house code. Unless I'm missing something, that means that he would have to carry around two remotes, since each remote can only be programmed for a single house code (correct me if I'm wrong).
The PAT01 appears to support changing of the unit code, however...wouldn't making it the second unit and setting it to A2 enable very easy control via one of the 6-button keychain remotes?

[Brian H]

The TM751s can only be controlled by an RF signal.
So if you go with the AHP and CM15A it will have to send the RF signals [it has a transmitter in it] to the TM751s
An X10 power line signal should go through an appliance module to a second one in its outlet when On. Off would kill the AC to the second one. I believe some here have used tandem modules for added control over things like garage door controls.

[Brian H]

Thoughts.
The PAT01 [X10 RR501] has a choice of two unit codes set by a switch. Unit 1 and Unit 9.
The TM751 is hard wired to Unit 1. Both units will still receive all 16 unit codes for one house code and pass them to the power line. It is just the internal controlled outlet that is Unit 1 or 9 on the PAT01 and Unit 1 on the TM751.

Motion sensors have a Dusk Dawn feature. It is the Address plus 1. So motion on A1 [default as shipped or after new batteries installed] would send an A2 On at dusk and an A2 Off at Dawn. They also send an off after a set time of no motion. So after the sensor times out. The siren will go back off with the off signal. The MS16 Active Eye can be programmed for a timeout of 256 minutes and to not do the Dusk Dawn sensing.
http://kbase.x10.com/wiki/Comparison_of_All_Motion_Sensors

One thing that is better with the PAT01 is it also has a power line receiver in it. So the controlled outlet on it could be turned on and off by both RF or power line signals.

[Brian H]

Not quite as easy, but I tried a TM751 and an appliance module.
TM751 on A1
Appliance module on A2; A3 or A4 Connected to the outlet on the TM751. PAT01 would also work.
Motion sensor address to match appliance module.
TM751 turns on and off the power to the system. From remote A1 button
Motion sensor triggers appliance module only if system power is on.
Button 3 0r 4 on remote can turn off appliance module if power is on from TM751.
Button 1 can then turn of power to system.

Thoughts:
Motion off can still turn alarm off after timeout.
Motion address is not the default after battery change settings.
Dusk dawn signal on motion address +1

I also tried an appliance module in the controlled outlet on a second appliance module. That also worked but you would still need a transceiver to receive the motion sensor and keychain remote RF signals.

[nybuck]

Edit: only one problem I can see...the TM751's unit code can't be changed, only the house code. Unless I'm missing something, that means that he would have to carry around two remotes, since each remote can only be programmed for a single house code (correct me if I'm wrong).
The PAT01 appears to support changing of the unit code, however...wouldn't making it the second unit and setting it to A2 enable very easy control via one of the 6-button keychain remotes?

I don't really see the need to carry 2 remotes, as the D1 (in my example) turns it on and off, and the motion sensors would trip the second A1 module directly.  You could shut the second module manually if you use a TM751.  You shouldn't need to worry about signal because it receives the RF directly through the antenna.

I like Brian H's idea as well - I used A1 in my example because that is the default for the motion sensors.

Good Luck!   

[Brian H]

The two TM751s is another good way to go. I tried it with two spare TM751s and it was fine.

[Septi]

Sorry about my not replying, been pretty busy with other projects the last week.

Yea, I'm not sure why I thought I'd need two remotes...simply turning off the whole system would shut the alarm off. For some reason I had it in my head that even if the whole thing was shut off, the module powering the alarm itself would still need to be deactivated if it had been tripped.
I guess the fact that no power = no alarm didn't occur to me, for some reason. *cough*

So, right. A TM751 as the main power, and an App. Module OR another TM751 plugged into it to run the siren.
or
BrianH's method for increased control over the whole thing. In light of the above, it might not be necessary...but I'm a fan of keeping everything under fine control, and it wouldn't be any more expensive than the simple setup, nor all that harder to get running. Hmm, decisions decisions...


Well, I'll decide sometime in the two more weeks before he needs it.
I can't thank you guys enough for your help on this. Now I have a game plan and know a bit more about how X10 stuff works. Maybe next time, I won't have to bug you guys for information 

So again, and despite it being inadequate: Thanks everyone!