Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length

Author Topic: New Vanguard User Review  (Read 19697 times)

wmac

  • Newbie
  • Helpful Post Rating: 1
  • Posts: 7
New Vanguard User Review
« on: February 12, 2009, 05:08:50 PM »

I ordered a package deal from the X10 website, the package included the following equipment:

Vanguard ICC
Ninja pan/tilt base
Ninja remote control
Xcam2 camera
Video only receiver
Motion sensor
"Firecracker" USB transceiver
"Hi-Res" USB video adapter

Equipment arrived quickly, 2 days after the order.

My plan was to install the Vanguard software on to a single computer, Intel dual core, Windows XP, 4 meg memory.

I have slooooow dialup, but the download went okay.

I had no intention of ever using the Internet for control or monitoring functions in VICC - I wanted to used it as a DVR, recording video to my hard drive, based on motion detection in the room where the camera was. About 25 feet from the computer that would be running the software.

Got the camera and Ninja base up and running first. Plugged the receiver into my TV for testing purposes.
Plugged in the camera and Ninja base, aligned the antennas on the camera and receiver. Got a picture...

Quite a poor picture, fuzzy and pixellated, but OK, I guess... I was expecting better image quality, given the images shown on the website (which is nasty, but I'll leave that discussion alone). But it will do.
Ninja Base worked well from the remote.
I can receive video quite reliably this way from 100 feet away. The Ninja remote is good for about half that distance.

Disconnected receiver from TV, hooked it up to the "Hi-Res" USB adapter, and plugged it into my computer. Plugged in the "Firecracker".
Started computer, then began the installation of VICC.
The installation seemed to go alright, initially... I assumed it would need some tweaking, I read some of the posts on this forum regarding issues with VICC on this forum... but I know my way around my computer, and was not afraid to deal with setup/configuration problems later. The install seemed to find the attached equipment and load the appropriate drivers.

After installation, Started VICC form the screen icon.
Added my camera/base from the menu - and bang! I have a picture. Again, pretty poor picture... but there it was...
I'm able to pan/tilt using the controls in VICC on the screen.

So far so good...

Can't record video. Get the well-documented dll failure, program closes. Video recording funtion is useless.
Still picture recording works fine.

Set up motion detection. Motion detector itself seems to detect motion from up to around 25 feet - but the motion sensor needs to be within five feet of the transciever in order for the signal to be received to turn on mtion-detected image recording by VICC. Motion sensor is useless in this application - the range is far too short to be of any real use, unless the camera is in the same room as the computer doing the recording.

I don't discover the most problematic thing about this software until I try to use a USB flash drive in the computer to do some real work. It seems the drivers in the VICC software have taken control of all 8 hubs on my computer, and will not recognize anything I plug into them until I unplug the transciever and HiRes adapter, turn off the computer, and restart it. Since I had plugged these in to the USB ports on the rear of my computer and put the whole installation back into my computer desk where they are quite difficult to get at, this is a deal breaker.

Another piece of the software loads on startup - you can see it in Task Manager - x10nets.exe - and this stops my wireless 3G internet modem from functioning. Had to disable that in Component services to get back on the internet... and VICC will not start without it. Again, this is a deal breaker - this software is useless to me until I can solve these 2 issues. I can work on the motion detection and video recording later, but I have to be able to use the computer for other things than VICC!

So - I am non-plussed with the VICC software. It seems rudimentary at best, poorly designed, and conflicts with my hardware and computer setup. It won't record video for me. I'll use it for stills only, if I continue to use it at all. But I knew it had issues before I purchased it, I was just hoping it would work better for me.

The cameras, Ninja pan/tilt base, Ninja remote, Video reciever work well, if you can live with the poor image quality. I'll use them some other way - perhaps with a VCR setup.

The "Hi-Res" USB video adapter does nothing for the quality of the camera view. I checked with a video capture card on another computer, fed in just the straight video from the RCA-type jack on the receiver. I detect no difference in image quality. It's not "Hi-Res", it's just a USB video adapter, as far as I can tell.
 
The motion detector - either the software portion, the transceiver, or the detector itself - is useless in this configuration. The motion detector signal will not "shoot" through a glass door 3 feet from the transceiver, but it is detected from about 5 feet away, shooting through the wall above the door. Weird.

So - that's my initial quickie experience. I haven't called customer service yet, I read here and tried what I found here first. I may call them, I'll keep trying to figure it out.

If anyone has any insight on what product may do a better job for me, or how I can use the pieces I have more efficiently, or has some advice on solving some of the issues stated, I'd certainly like to hear it. I'm not trying to be negative - I fully expect to get the system up and running at some point. But I'm an optimist.

Just thought my experience might be of interest.

 If you have concerns about how VICC will work with your setup, given some of the common problems stated here in the forum, and whether you have the ability and the patience to sort them out, this software may not be for you... in my case, it certainly isn't plug 'n play...

(I've come back and modified this post to correct a couple of spelling and grammar errors. The message body remains the same.)


« Last Edit: February 13, 2009, 04:56:26 PM by wmac »
Logged

wmac

  • Newbie
  • Helpful Post Rating: 1
  • Posts: 7
Re: New Vanguard User Review
« Reply #1 on: February 13, 2009, 11:30:53 AM »

I've now read everything in this section of the forum regarding this VICC problem:

"Run a DLL as an App has encountered a problem and needs to close."

Unless I missed it, I can't find more than a couple of users who reported this problem that ever returned to the forum to say that they were able to resolve it. I did try what one had to say in this thread - http://forums.x10.com/index.php?topic=9296.0 - but it didn't work for me. And in my opinion, that procedure shouldn't be necessary. This procedure assumes that a user has a fairly high level of confidence and experience with computers... not many would be willing to take this on as an average home user.

There's also plenty of problems mentioned regarding motion sensor operation and not being able to record video.

Has to be something fundamental. I'm surprised it hasn't been addressed or resolved given that the problems I described in my thread have been reported in this forum for a while now. Perhaps some software or OS setups interfere with VICC and cause problems for some users, and not others.

It would be helpful to hear from other users who were able to either overcome these issues, or never had them to begin with - we could at least compare setups, this might help those with issues.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2009, 01:25:50 PM by wmac »
Logged

wmac

  • Newbie
  • Helpful Post Rating: 1
  • Posts: 7
Re: New Vanguard User Review
« Reply #2 on: February 18, 2009, 09:04:09 PM »

So - I've "cleaned" my registry. There were 6 problems, all invalid pathways, none had anything to do with rundll.exe. 
I've uninstalled/reinstalled Vanguard.
I've re-named the folders, as recommended, and directed Vanguard to record in different folders.

Vanguard still gives me the error rundlll error if I try to record video, then the program shuts down.

In order to run the program at all, I have to go in to Component services and re-enable x10net.exe, shut down the computer, plug in my video reciever and "Firecracker" transceiver, then restart the computer. VICC will work, it just won't record video. Or connect to the internet - x10net.exe locks out my USB ports and stops my USB 3G internet modem from functioning.

When I'm done with VICC, I have to go in and disable x10net.exe, shut down the computer, disconnect the vid rcvr/firecracker, then restart the computer.

I'm thinking I should give up on the whole thing, and go with a VCR-based system, and scrap using VICC - but I'm still left with a questio:

If I use a motion detector to activate my VCR system, how far away from a plug-in X10 transceiver (like a TM751, or a VCR activator) can a motion sensor be located - and still work?
Logged

wmac

  • Newbie
  • Helpful Post Rating: 1
  • Posts: 7
Re: New Vanguard User Review
« Reply #3 on: August 29, 2009, 07:22:59 PM »

After all this time, Vangaurd continues to give customers grief.

I've not been able to solve my problems with Vangaurd. It just doesn't record video, and it causes all sorts of configuration problems with my setup. The "Nightwatch" cameras are poor, hardly low-light capable, as they are advertised...

Sad. Oh well, I'll be wary of purchasing in the future.
Logged

Videonut

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Helpful Post Rating: 0
  • Posts: 32
Re: New Vanguard User Review
« Reply #4 on: August 30, 2009, 04:43:01 PM »

I had real problems recording video at 1st, can't remember if I was using Vanguard or had swiched to AHP with plugins. What I did on suggestions I read from here was installed a different codec and all problems are gone. I used a divx codec.
Can't hurt to try.

Sorry, after starting Vangaurd I see there is no setting for codecs so it must have been in the AHP software iWitness plugin.
« Last Edit: August 30, 2009, 04:45:48 PM by Videonut »
Logged

easymoney

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Helpful Post Rating: 1
  • Posts: 16
Re: New Vanguard User Review
« Reply #5 on: October 14, 2009, 07:43:42 PM »

Sorry, to hear you fell victim to x10's flashy "non" relevant ads as well.  Never liked them, but thought the quality they show on website of camera images is all simulated images, so one really expects a good picture.  Had nothing but problems with x10 camera's right out of the box.

1st... some of the camera's I ordered in two batches.  So the most recent cameras I ordered had the white "wash out" picture even in low light.  The would show a "normal" image for a few seconds, then the image just washes out into whiteness making the camera literally blind like its looking at the sun. This problem is documented here, soon discovered that the receiver firmware had issues with the newer cameras and adjustment of the iris letting in to much light.  So I had to order another receiver as well since this stuff was setting on my work bench for a few months until I had time to use it.

2nd... I did want to view my camera's online and upload images to a off-site server.  Initially, the the gate.x10.com web server feed images as expexted. Poor quality, but images none the less.  The pan/tilt worked, but of course you can only see one camera at a time.   Not sure they mention that in those flashy multiple camera system specials on the web site... but oh well.

3rd... Really have to do all the tech support on your own.  Phone tech support is poor, and tier 2 support is a joke.  After initial phone support, you will get a response two or three days alter telling you to do things that most have already tried by researching this site and the FAQ's etc. To help speed things up, I gave detailed info in the first email about ports I tested, CPU/Ram specs, OS system, hardware setup, internet specs, even the gate.x10.com login info and remote access to the machine along with permission for support to access the machine.  The response I got after three days was a standard boiler-plate template support email telling me to check the ports, what CPU, OS, etc... all information I included in the first email.  It's like tier 2 support did not even read the original email, just sent the standard "90% of all connection problems are port related" email.  So then I wait another 4 days for a response after sending the same info I sent in the first email that they apparently never read.  Finally after two weeks of patiently waiting and playing, the tech actually did log in using the remote access I had setup for him.  I seen the logs, he was on over 30 mins but never admitted he logged in and couldn't get the working either, just sent an email stating I would have to wait patiently because of high volume of support calls and he need to discuss things with the developers.  I waited another two weeks, sent another email checking the status, then another email.  After over a year, still no response.  So I called and started over again, sending the same details including port tests, hardware, etc... I get the same boiler-plate email I got a year earlier.... "90% of all connections problems are port related" jargon.  Again, tier 2 never even took the time to skim thought the email and just asked the same info I already provided to help speed things along.

The software has no built in HTTP server, has no options to specify ports in case your ISP blocks or filters these ports.  If so that leaves you with the options of using remote access to control or view video, looking for third party software which is hard to find and more then just simple video streaming and PTZ control, or changing ISP's.

People here will tell you that this is not a support site, just a group of users and fans of x10 just like you and me that are trying to help,  Another sign that x10 support and development is almost zero.  I appreciate what users here have helped with, I still would be stuck on the white out problem.  But some uses seem to get a little insulted when you speak the truth about about x10 products. 

But the truth is that if you need porn style ads to sell a product, its a sign that maybe the product is not that good.  If they are always running limited time specials, get it now, it's becasue the product doesn't sell itself, they need hype to push it.

The only things x10 has going for it, is the wireless control system over electrical lines in your home for home automation. It is a neat trick, and useful for some things, but not for camera systems.  The same can be done via other means with less hardware and better quality.  The support is slow, because the developers will not create a solid product and the support teams are helpless to fix the issues that have exsisted from day one.  They just create workarounds, not update or revisions.

The only people I have seen that are happy with x10 stuff are people who just really like the challenge of hooking up lots of hardware, and constantly researching problems fixing issues.. ie someone who wants a hobby, or people so paranoid they just want to see if the cops are at the front door, or people who want to catch the babysitter undressing in the bedroom before a swim in the pool.  The last two fit the advertising scheme just right. 

So, I know the people here are the ones that like the challenge and want to help others, but I just wanted to speak the truth.  Thanks everyone here for there help, its been fun, but I will be tossing the x10 in the trash, not even worth selling on ebay, I would do that to my customers.

I bought a few night vision usb webcams, a wireless ip camera, a few usb to cat5 extenders, and on day one I could view all 3 camera's on one screen at the same time, broadcast all three cameras via private HTTP server to the web, actually see who watching the feeds.  The usb camera are powered though the usb cat 5 extender, so no power adapters to plug in to each camera, the video feed and the power sent over the same cable.  Even a wireless camera is not really wireless if you have to wire it to an outlet.  So if you run a wire, why not secure it where some can't unplug it, just send video and power through same wire.

If video is all you are looking for, there really are better and more cost/time effective soultions out there.  This is not the 90's anymore.... Thanks for listening...
Logged

wmac

  • Newbie
  • Helpful Post Rating: 1
  • Posts: 7
Re: New Vanguard User Review
« Reply #6 on: January 22, 2010, 02:53:35 PM »

Couldn't have said it better. This x10 equipment that I have is little better than toy quality, and the software is useless.

Good for watching the birdfeeder in winter on your TV, in the comfort of the inside of your house! Of course, one could just look out the window, and save the cash...

Live and learn...  B:(
Logged

nybuck

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Helpful Post Rating: 17
  • Posts: 405
Re: New Vanguard User Review
« Reply #7 on: March 12, 2010, 10:40:15 AM »

Easy Money, Easymoney...  And ON THE MONEY.


Logged
>!

electrobrad

  • Newbie
  • Helpful Post Rating: 0
  • Posts: 1
Re: New Vanguard User Review
« Reply #8 on: April 08, 2010, 06:12:45 PM »

#:)

Hugely beneficial thread, gentlemen!  Thank you!
Logged

guitard00d

  • Newbie
  • Helpful Post Rating: 0
  • Posts: 7
Re: New Vanguard User Review
« Reply #9 on: January 17, 2011, 03:58:32 AM »

If I could find some specs on the X10 protocol and communicating with the USB video capture and transceiver interfaces, I would simply write my own software. I definitely have more than enough programming experience to do so (over 22 years), but this really isn't necessary with all the other video capture and recording packages out there.

If remote viewing isn't of any importance to you, there are many other options out there you can use. You can always use anybody else's video capture interface and software to record on your hard drive. Motion detectors would just talk to the camera power supplies directly and turn them on and off as needed. Remember, you still have your handheld remotes that you can do your manual camera switching with.

Many of these other systems know what video noise it and won't record it, they work just like a noise gate in the audio world. Also, there are many out there that have their own web server and ability to email snapshots. So, honestly, the Vanguard software is easily disposable and replaceable, and with any other video capture device your system could also work fine with Linux or Macintosh instead of just WindBlows.

Now, for X10's price on their stuff, you kinda have to expect the shoddy quality of the cameras. However, basic LED infrared spotlights (get em from Amazon as low as $30 each) really make the low light cameras work perfectly at night. The color cameras are only good in broad daylight or with a good source of bright white light. Not much else you can do about those things, they're all just basic little cheap cheap cheap webcams.

So here's the way I look at it...Vanguard software is a turd, X10 needs to sh!tcan their software developer(s) and get some adept programmers on board. The software is a throw away piece of unnecessary garbage. I say piece your own bundle of X10 hardware together, get anybody else's video capture interface that comes with it's own web enabled software and go that route. If I can find specs on the the X10 protocol and how to at least communicate with their USB transceiver, I can easily make a cross platform compatible interface for switching the cameras as well as pan/tilt/zoom functions.

If the X10 software developers can't or won't fix their turd, I'll build something that does work. All it takes is somebody to provide me with the specs I need. If you're reading this and know where I can get this information, please let me know and I'll get the ball rolling.
Logged
 

X10.com | About X10 | X10 Security Systems | Cameras| Package Deals
© Copyright 2014-2016 X10.com All rights reserved.