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[Boogy]

Greetings X10 experts,

I am having problems getting my Socket Rockets (LM15A) and EagleEye Sensors (MS14A) to operate the way I hoped they would.      Basically, my goal is to have the light come on when someone triggers the sensor and automatically shut off after a predetermined time.  Please correct me if I have the wrong modules to achieve this.  I'll try to put into words as best as I can my setup and explain the problems I'm having.  Please forgive me if any of my terminology is off as I am brand new to home automation and know really little about this stuff.

1.)  Font Porch (H6).  There is an overhead here that houses a recessed light fixture.  If you picture standing about 1-2 feet in front of the door and look up, that is where it is located and that is where the Socket rocket is screwed in.  The EagleEye is mounted on a post about 4 feet high and is facing the direction of the door/light.  This is the only location that I could cover someone walking up to the door and also not constantly trigger due to blowing trees and shrubs.  I also have a Sensor Chime (SC546) connected to this same UC.  My goal here is to have the porch light turn on and the chime go off when someone walks up to the front door.  The light turns off after one minute.  During my testing today, it worked flawless (once I was able to position the sensor to miss the blowing trees).  Now that it's dark out, the light still comes on and the chime goes off, but the light does not turn off after one minute.  Is it possible that the light is so bright on the sensor that it is not allowing it to turn off?  I have to actually go to my Security Console (SC1200) and type in "6" followed by "off" to turn the light off.  This EagleEye is set to transmit every time it sees motion, even during the day since I have the chime connected to it. 

2.)  Side Porch (H10).  Pretty much the same setup as the Front Porch minus the chime.  This light fixture is mounted on the wall to the left of the door.  The sensor is about 6-7 feet away mounted on the fence but facing the direction of the door/light.  Same problem here...the light turns on when the sensor is triggered but it will not turn off after one minute, like it did today during my tests.  This light is very bright because with the addition of the Socket Rocket, the bulb actually protrudes out of the fixture about an inch or so on the bottom.  So again, is it possible that it is so bright on the sensor that it's not allowing the light to turn off?  This EagleEye is set to transmit only at night.  To test this earlier in the day, I put the EagleEye in a drawer and whenever I opened the drawer, the light would come on.  And it always turned off after one minute.  Typing "10" and "off" in my Security Console will turn the light off.

3.)  Back Porch (H8).  I actually have two EagleEye Sensors here, each facing opposite directions and one Socket Rocket all set to H8.  This setup actually still works like it did during the daylight.  The sensors are mounted on the base of a bar/table and the top of the bar actually covers these sensors from the light above.  This is what leads me to believe that the other two are being affected by the bright light.  The problem with this one is that this Socket Rocket does not respond to the commands from my Security Console.  Typing "8" "on" does nothing, nor does "8" "off".  These EagleEye's are also set to transmit only at night.

I hope I explained it well enough, and hopefully didn't overkill with boring details.  Thanks in advance for any help.

[Brian H]

First your tests and provided data is not overkill. It will help in finding your solution.

#2 It could be the Night Only setting is being influenced by the light. The drawer test seems to point in that direction. You may want to test it in the desired location and set it to send all the time. If it then works we know the cause.

#3 Sounds like you have a power line signal problem from the security consoles location and where the #3 socket rocket is located. Since the socket rocket does respond to the motion sensors.
Are you using a TM751 or RR501 to receive the motion sensors RF command and not the security consoles RF receiver?

http://jvde.us/x10_troubleshooting.htm
http://www.act-remote.com/PCC/uncle.htm
http://www.davehouston.net/

[Boogy]

Brian,

Thank You for your reply!  I'm not really sure I understand your last question, but here goes.  At first, I only had the Security Console.  With that, the Back Porch light did not work at all.  The other two (Front and Side), are actually farther away from the Security Console than the Back Porch is.  I then plugged in a TM751 in an outlet closer to the Back Porch and now the Back Porch light works although typing a security command into the Security Console has no effect as I mentioned earlier.  Not sure if the TM751 had anything to do with getting the light to work, or if it was just coincidence.  I don't know, like I said I really don't understand most of this stuff. 

[Brian H]

You have a power line signal problem between the back porch and the security console.
The TM751 is getting the motion sensors command to the back porch socket rocket. Since the consoles position has a power line signal problem to the back porch. It still can not control it.

The TM751 is not polite as it has no power line receiver in it. I don't think the security consoles are polite either. So some of the motion sensors maybe received by both the security console and the TM751. Steping on each other.

You may want to look at some of the links I gave you.

Do you have any power line couplers or repeaters between the homes two AC line inputs?
It could be the porch lights are on one line to neutral and the security console on the other line to neutral. Signal have a hard time getting from line to line. If you have a electric stove or dryer. Try turning it On with the TM751 disconnected and see if the console then controlls the porch lights. You could also try the console where the TM751 is and see if it can control them from that location.

[Boogy]

You have a power line signal problem between the back porch and the security console.
The TM751 is getting the motion sensors command to the back porch socket rocket. Since the consoles position has a power line signal problem to the back porch. It still can not control it.

The TM751 is not polite as it has no power line receiver in it. I don't think the security consoles are polite either. So some of the motion sensors maybe received by both the security console and the TM751. Steping on each other. 

You may want to look at some of the links I gave you.  Will do, thanks.

Do you have any power line couplers or repeaters between the homes two AC line inputs?  Not sure what these even are, but I haven't installed any of these.  How would I check if there are any?
It could be the porch lights are on one line to neutral and the security console on the other line to neutral. Signal have a hard time getting from line to line. If you have a electric stove or dryer. Try turning it On with the TM751 disconnected and see if the console then controlls the porch lights. You could also try the console where the TM751 is and see if it can control them from that location.  I ran the dryer but the Security Controller still could not control the lights.  However, when I moved the console to the outlet where the TM571 is, it does allow control of the Back Porch lights.  Unfortunately this location is not feasible because I need a phone line connected to my Security Controller and there isn't one near here.  Also, using this outlet also caused me to lose full control of my kitchenette lights.  For example, pressing "3" "on" turns the lights on, but pressing "3" "off" doesn't work.

[dave w]

Read the links, they will explain the problems.

From description it sounds like a phase coupling issue and Brian H is already pointing you in that direction. The solution is a repeater which will couple the two phases of power in your home and may help with noise issues.

IF you are thinking of home automation with control of lights and appliances, my repeaters of choice, in order, is: 1. XTBIIR from JV Digital Engineering. 2. CR234 from ACT. and at the bottum of the list is: 3. XPCR from X10 Pro.
The XPCR is least costly, can be found on eBay for $20. It is not a first choice if you are interested in adding home automation down the road but will solve phase coupling issues.

[Brian H]

All the indications of power line signal issues.
dave w covered the most common things to correct it.

[Boogy]

Wow, I checked out the repeaters and I must say that they seem a bit intimidating.  Don't get me wrong, I'm pretty good at following installation instructions and what not but anything that deals with the safety of my family (like causing a fire for messing around with the electrical panel) causes me to have second thoughts.  Is this something that is pretty straight forward to install.  If not, is this a common piece of equipment that an electrician would be familiar with even if they aren't familiar with X10?

[dave w]

Yes an electrician will have no trouble installing but will charge arm and leg.  However here is a more simple one which will plug in to a dryer outlet if you have a dryer with four pin plug.

http://www.smarthome.com/4826A/SignaLinc-4-Pin-Plug-in-Coupler-Repeater/p.aspx

Smarthome used to carry the more common three pin unit also, but I do not find it any more..

They still carry the dryer three pin passive coupler.

http://www.smarthome.com/4816B2/SignaLinc-trade-Plug-In-Phase-Coupler/p.aspx

I don't like the passive coupler because does not boost the X10 signal which will increase the signal's noise immunity, in fact the passive coupler attenuates the X10 signal somewhat in the process of coupling it over to the other phase.

[Boogy]

Dave,

What's the verdict on the first link you posted.  Do those actually work?  I did a test earlier suggested by Brian to run my dryer and try to control the lights and it didn't work.  So, is that an indication that this plug won't help me or does that test really have nothing to do with this plug?  Sorry for being such a newb and THANKS guys for all your help. 

[Brian H]

The dryer not helping. May indicate the second link, a passive coupler, dave w gave you. May not help.
The first link, an active repeater may help.

I had the three pin version of both the Smarthome passive coupler and active repeater.
As pointed out. The passive one can't pass a stronger, than what is received, signal back to the other lines circuits and was no help for me.
The active repeater did amplify the signal back to the power lines but gave me problems with the AHP CM15A and occasional signal firestorms.

I have moved on to a JV Engineering XTB-IIR.
It sends a very strong power line signal back to the houses circuits.

If you have a severe signal sucker {device that absorbs X10 power line signals} or power line noise maker. A X10 type filter maybe needed on the offender.

[Boogy]

If you have a severe signal sucker {device that absorbs X10 power line signals} or power line noise maker. A X10 type filter maybe needed on the offender.

Brian, how can I test if I have any of these?

[Brian H]

If you have a power line signal meter. Like a ESM1,TesterLinc or XTBM.
You can selectively unplug electrical devices that have a reputation for signal problems. Watching the signal strength and noise levels.

Most users, with no meter, can unplug devices and see if intermittent or non working X10 modules now work.
Some common problem things are. Computer power supplies, cell phone chargers, TVs and entertainment components, electronically controlled appliances. X10 style filters can be used if needed on some offenders.

You may want to look at Jeff's Troubleshooting Tutorials.
http://jvde.us/x10_troubleshooting.htm

[Boogy]

Guys, thanks again for your help and thanks for the links.  I spent a lot of time reading through the different tutorials on Jeff's sight and while I can't say that I completely understand everything, I do feel like I have a better understanding of it all.  From what I read, and please correct me if I'm wrong, my problems could result from one of two (or both) things.  One being the overall signal strength and the other being problems with the signal jumping from one phase to the other.  From your suggestions, the best solution for me would be the XTBIIR.  The cons of that would be that it's probably not something that I should install myself and according to Dave having an electrician install it would be quite costly.  So I checked out the XTBR, which looks to me to be a plug-in type unit that requires no installation....more on that later.  I also checked out the SignaLinc Repeater 4-Wire Dryer (Dave's first link) but unfortunately I can not use this as my dryer has a three prong plug.  So looking at the SignaLinc Plug-In Phase Coupler (Dave's second link), it says that its purpose is to pass X10 signals from one phase to the other.  The problem with it is that it does not amplify your signal.  So if my problems were the result of weak signals, this would do no good.  So my question is, could I use the SignaLinc Plug-In Phase Coupler AND an XTBR?  The benefits for me would be that they are both plug-in units so no installation would be required.  Please let me know if this is way out in left field, but my thinking is that the SignaLinc would help join the two phases together while the XTBR would boost the signal.     

[JeffVolp]

Yes, the plug-in SignaLinc can be used to pass the XTBR signal over to the opposite phase.

If you are not using an electric dryer, a 3-prong plug can be wired to the XTB-IIR so it can also plug into the dryer receptacle.

Jeff