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[Ivy-Cat]

Testing some new devices brought up a problem?  I have a FireCracker Model CM17A, a Model TM751 Transceiver, and three Model AM486 appliance modules.  In testing these today everything appeared to work very well.  That was until I tested one of the AM486's with my Christmas tree lights connected to it.  Came on just fine.  Turned off also or did it?  Well, there was a light glow from the bulbs.  That tells me there is voltage there.  So I connected a volt meter to the AM486.  On, they show line voltage.  When turned off they registered 62 to 67 volts!  That is not off, that is about 1/2 power.  What is going on here?  I can't think 1/2 voltage leaking into a motor is going to be good for the motor.

I.C.

[dave w]

That tells me there is voltage there.  So I connected a volt meter to the AM486.  On, they show line voltage.  When turned off they registered 62 to 67 volts!  That is not off, that is about 1/2 power.  What is going on here?  I can't think 1/2 voltage leaking into a motor is going to be good for the motor.

Normal.
The current is very, very, low. The glowing lights must be LED. The leakage is either from the "Local Control" circuit.

Local Control is a feature on the Appliance Modules and Lamp Modules  where if the module is in the "OFF" state, you can turn the lamp or appliance plugged in to the module off and back on, and the module will then switch to the ON state, applying power to the lamp. The feature requires a small amount of power to be continually run therough the lamp or appliance to sense the toggle of the switch.

Plug a "three - way tap" in the module and an incandesent lamp (or motor) and re-measure on the open socket, I doubt you will see much voltage with a load. LEDs require so little current that they will glow from the sensing voltage.

[Ivy-Cat]

Normal.
The current is very, very, low. The glowing lights must be LED. The leakage is either from the "Local Control" circuit.

Local Control is a feature on the Appliance Modules and Lamp Modules  where if the module is in the "OFF" state, you can turn the lamp or appliance plugged in to the module off and back on, and the module will then switch to the ON state, applying power to the lamp. The feature requires a small amount of power to be continually run therough the lamp or appliance to sense the toggle of the switch.

Plug a "three - way tap" in the module and an incandesent lamp (or motor) and re-measure on the open socket, I doubt you will see much voltage with a load. LEDs require so little current that they will glow from the sensing voltage.

Interesting.  Yes, the tree lights are LED's.  Just received some of these from Ebay/Flea-bay so they could be old.  Did the three way tap check and volts on a light bulb dropped to 2.5.  I think I read something on that "Local control" feature.

Thanks for the info.

I.C.

[Brian H]

If it has both an AC and a DC voltage one the outlet. It is the older before CFL friendly version appliance module. If it is strictly AC it is the newer CFL friendly appliance module.
Either one may make low current LEDs glow but the older ones have a greater current available.

[Ivy-Cat]

Local Control is a feature on the Appliance Modules and Lamp Modules  where if the module is in the "OFF" state, you can turn the lamp or appliance plugged in to the module off and back on, and the module will then switch to the ON state, applying power to the lamp. The feature requires a small amount of power to be continually run therough the lamp or appliance to sense the toggle of the switch.

So if I checked this "Local Control" operation and it does not work, would that tell me I have some "old" AM486 modules?
I.C.

[Brian H]

The older before CFL friendly will go On. If the module is Off and you toggle the lamps local switch from On to Off to On again.
The CFL friendly ones will not turn On most times. I have found some may rarely go On if there was enough noise generated by the local switch of the lamp.

So if you can reliably turn your appliance module On by toggling the loads local switch. You have old ones.
Date Code on the small white sticker also may give us a clue to type.

[Ivy-Cat]

Date sticker on all three AM486's is 10L49
On the TM751 it is 11G30
I.C.

[Brian H]

The AM486's should be the new design CFL friendly as I have some 08A02 that are.
The TM751 is also the new design with improved RF receiver and surface mounted parts. I don't have any information on what was changed in the output area, but may do a few tests and get back on that.

[Ivy-Cat]

Well that looks good.  At least the seller did not provide me with some old stuff.
I.C.

[Dan Lawrence]

The AM486's should be the new design CFL friendly as I have some 08A02 that are.
The TM751 is also the new design with improved RF receiver and surface mounted parts. I don't have any information on what was changed in the output area, but may do a few tests and get back on that.

Did they make the same change to the RR501 as was done to the TM751?

[dhouston]

Did they make the same change to the RR501 as was done to the TM751?

The TM751 had a small daughterboard with a superregenerative RF receiver (of X10 design) that was replaced by a daughterboard with a single chip HiMark superheterodyne receiver. Whether that's an improvement is debatable as the latter has fairly narrow bandwidth which doesn't always match well with X10's LC controlled transmitters. It was probably done for economic reasons as the same daughterboard is used in the CM15A.

The RR501 has no daughterboard. It has a superregenerative receiver built-in to the main (only) circuit board. It has not changed in any significant way for about 12 years or longer.

[Brian H]

May not be a conclusive test for everybody. I can say my new version TM751s receive farther than my older designed ones.

[dhouston]

And others have found replacing the HiMark receiver with a wideband superregenerative one was an improvement.

• http://forums.x10.com/index.php?topic=21000.0

I think it will depend on how accurately tuned one's transmitters are. But, in either case, improving the antenna may be the best way to go and I'll have a safe way to do that in a few weeks.