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[tlisaacs]

Thanks for your help in advance.

I have been a x10 customer for about 6 years if not more and love the products due to my physical disability. My question is this: I recently purchased new appliance modules one of which I have on a low energy under cabinet light, which uses 6 watts of power.  My appliance module won't turn off after only having it a couple weeks.  In my email with tech support they claim that one must have at least a 60 watt bulb equivalent for the module to function properly.  I don't believe this is so because I have the same light set same appliance module with no issues. Besides that my desk lamp that has a 40 watt equivalent LED bulb functions fine. In the top outlet where the module in question is plugged in there is a power strip which contains my laptop and television power so I am suspecting electrical noise as my culprit. None of the cords are able to be relocated to a different outlet. Anyone have any experience with this issue? Should I purchase the XPF 20A noise filter? Do I possibly have a bad module?  Thanks.

[HA Dave]

Working backwards....

Yes.. even a new module could be bad... you should test it (different plug, different light.... maybe where the desk lamp works)

Yes... you could have noise interfering with your PLC's. Again testing will confirm either way.

I can't imagine an appliance module working correctly with such a low-wattage LED. I would expect the current sensing to keep the LED light running 24/7 although maybe slightly dimmed when off.

[bkenobi]

I have non-x10 moron sensors that won't work unless they have a 40w resistive load plugged in so 60w is certainly reasonable imo.

[Brian H]

If you unplug the load on the AM486. Can you hear the internal ratchet switch CLUNK turning On and turning Off?
If you can turn it On but then not Off. The load is probably making noise or is a signal sucker and the power line signal is marginal.
I would also suspect all the electronic gear in the top of the outlet making noise or are signal suckers. A filter maybe needed.

An 20 amp wire in type XPF filter. Would have to be wired in such a way. To filter the electronics but not the AM486 or it would not receive any X10 power line signals.
There are plug in filters. Like the ACT AF120 fifteen amp one. The Smathome FilterLinc is a 10 amp one and has a unfiltered pass through outlet on the front. Where a automation module can be connected. JV Digital Engineering makes both a 10 and 15 amp plug in filter.
http://jvde.us/xtb-f10.htm

As for a 40 watt load. I believe that is a hold over from the early before CFL Friendly ones where designed by 10WTI and had Local Control Sensing. Newer ones should be much better and the 40 watt load may not be a hard requirement now.
40 watts would apply for the Lamp Modules. As they have a minimum current requirement for the triac to conduct properly.

The newer CFL friendly AM486 module have almost no sensing current on the output. The most that will happen is a real small load may glow dimly.
The older ones with Local Control Sensing did have more sensing current on the output and would make small loads do strange things.

[tlisaacs]

Thanks everyone for your input.

Last night after writing my post, I shut down my laptop and then shut down the lights in question successfully! Leading me to believe there is electrical noise coming from the electronics that are in the top outlet.  That being said and after further evaluation of my setup at my desk, the lamp on the other side that functions properly, the top outlet there is a surge protector that just happens to have a noise filter built in. My thought is seeing that that seems to work well in this and other applications. There is not really room to plug in the plug in type noise filter AND the appliance module in the same outlet. So, my solution is to replace my cheap old power strip with a new surge protector that has a noise filter built in (same make/model that is on the other outlet) Thoughts?

As to answer your question if unplugging the lights turns the module off, the answer is yes.

 

If you unplug the load on the AM486. Can you hear the internal ratchet switch CLUNK turning On and turning Off?
If you can turn it On but then not Off. The load is probably making noise and the power line signal is marginal.
I would also suspect all the electronic gear in the top of the outlet making noise or are signal suckers. A filter maybe needed.

An 20 amp wire in type XPF filter. Would have to be wired in such a way. To filter the electronics but not the AM486 or it would not receive any X10 power line signals.
There are plug in filters. Like the ACT AF120 fifteen amp one. The Smathome FilterLinc is a 10 amp one and has a unfiltered pass through outlet on the front. Where a automation module can be connected. JV Digital Engineering makes both a 10 and 15 amp plug in filter.
http://jvde.us/xtb-f10.htm

As for a 40 watt load. I believe that is a hold over from the early before CFL Friendly ones where designed by 10WTI and had Local Control Sensing. Newer ones should be much better and the 40 watt load may not be a hard requirement now.

The newer CFL friendly AM486 module have almost no sensing current on the output. The most that will happen is a real small load may glow dimly.
The older ones with Local Control Sensing did have more sensing current on the output and would make small loads do strange things.

[Brian H]

Sounds like the electronics are signal sucking or making noise and the LED lights maybe also absorbing some of the power line signals. With the LED lights disconnected the power line signals are marginal but strong enough to control the module.

Use some care with a filtered surge strip. They may have some power line noise conditioning that will absorb X10 signal as noise.

If the electronics are not over 10 amps. The Smarthome Filterlinc could be used as an alternative. The electronics can be plugged into the bottom filtered outlet and the appliance module in the unfiltered front outlet. As the filter does cover the outlets.
That is how I have my Insteon 2413S PLM with ISY994i controller and computer UPS connected. UPS on bottom filtered outlet. 2413S in the front unfiltered outlet.
http://www.smarthome.com/filterlinc-10-amp-plug-in-noise-filter.html

[bkenobi]

Most of my power strips caused signal degradation issues and forced me to obtain noise filters.  I opted for the SmartHomes brand FilterLinc due to price among other things.  I found a bunch on eBay at one point for ~$10 shipped (used) but they are typically much more.  Once installed, I've had no issues with those devices causing any issues.

[tlisaacs]

The electronics are laptop, LCD TV, printer, and the last one I think is my DVD VCR combo.

Sounds like the electronics are signal sucking or making noise and the LED lights maybe also absorbing some of the power line signals. With the LED lights disconnected the power line signals are marginal but strong enough to control the module.

Use some care with a filtered surge strip. They may have some power line noise conditioning that will absorb X10 signal as noise.

If the electronics are not over 10 amps. The Smarthome Filterlinc could be used as an alternative. The electronics can be plugged into the bottom filtered outlet and the appliance module in the unfiltered front outlet. As the filter does cover the outlets.
That is how I have my Insteon 2413S PLM with ISY994i controller and computer UPS connected. UPS on bottom filtered outlet. 2413S in the front unfiltered outlet.
http://www.smarthome.com/filterlinc-10-amp-plug-in-noise-filter.html

[JeffVolp]

I opted for the SmartHomes brand FilterLinc due to price among other things.  I found a bunch on eBay at one point for ~$10 shipped (used)

That's an incredible deal.  Components alone for the XTB-F10 and F15 cost over $20.

Jeff

[Brian H]

Just passing this on if someone gets an intermittent FilterLinc from an auction site or private sale.

Over on the UDI Forums.
There is a member that bought a quantity of the FilterLincs on eBay and some free from owners that said they died.
Some where intermittent and they posted photos of the PCB. It was found the soldering in them was poor on the heavy coil leads or the leads where trimmed too close to the PCB with cracks around them. Some had the hard wired 10 amp fuse was blown. As far as we could see. The 5 amp version has the same components just a different fuse.

[bkenobi]

I can confirm this.  I had 2 that were DOA and I actually was refunded for them.  I replaced the 10A fuse on them and they worked like new.  I also have some 5A versions that I opened to see if those statements were true.  There are 2 differences between the 10A and 5A version.

1) 10A vs 5A fuse
2) different part numbers on the outside sticker

That's it...