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[Esgelrothion]

Hello, everyone! Let me start by saying how grateful I am that this forum exists! I’ve found the answers to so many questions here! I started in HA last year when I bought my first house! I found an old Homeminder at goodwill for only $15 and have been hooked on X-10 ever since. It’s dead simple to use, and the thrill of my lights turning on automatically and motion sensors detecting my presence never gets old. Plus I am a big fan of not incorporating any more Wi-Fi devices into my home than is strictly necessary. I’m soon to incorporate two automatic roller-shades into the system, and I am very excited for that!

While digging through the forums I came across the thread about Bill’s BVC program, and I’m absolutely gobsmacked! I never knew such things were possible with X-10! It seems like something I’ve just got to try for myself! The “Star Trek factor” alone is incentive enough! It seems like the program is no longer in development, however, and Bill seems to have been absent lo these 15 or so years since that thread was last active. Bill’s forums also seem to be defunct as well. So, before I go out and purchase a PC (I’m a Mac user) and try and download Windows XP, go out and buy microphones and speakers for each room, etc., I figured it was best to check in here. I’m leery of sending Bill a donation on PayPal through his website for the full version, not because it’s not worth it of course, but because I’m not sure if it’s still available. Would anyone have any insights? I’d love to embark on this next stage of my HA journey, but I’m worried I’ve missed the boat by a decade or more. Thanks in advance for any help and guidance!

[Brian H]

Welcome to the X10 Forums.
Can't say about Bill but if he or anone that knows more will probably chime in.
If you have not found it yet. JV Digital made some very good accessories. A few may still be available.
I have a few of their devices myself. Like the XTB-IIR coupler repeater. Hits my system with >10V X10 signals and my lowest area is still about 1V, Too bad it is one of the modules no longer made.
His troubleshooting tutorials have given me lots of help over the years. https://jvde.us/x10-troubleshooting/

[Tuicemen]

Welcome aboard Esgelrothion,
You could always reach out to Bill via email.through his site. Most users have moved to Alexa or Google for voice control. Some like myself have moved away from using a PC altogether for x10.

[Esgelrothion]

Thank you both very much for your responses!

@Brian H - I’ve looked at those tangentially but need to look deeper. I do have a SignaLinc coupler/repeater that I’ve had good results with. Really the only trouble I’ve had is with the SS13A wireless wall switches - with some lights it takes a few tries, despite the TM751 being very close to the switches. But that’s not a major issues in the long run. I’ve ordered some RSS18 switches and will be interested to see if there’s any difference (I expect not). I’ll definitely take a look at those troubleshooting tutorials!

@Tuicemen - Yours is a name I recognize well from the BVC thread! I sent an email to Bill through his website but shortly afterwards discovered his forums are defunct and parts of his website no-longer in operation. That led me to wonder if he checked that email, so I figured I’d post here. Would be great to hear from him if he is still around! I know I’m in the minority, but I’m not a fan of Alexa and Google and would not choose to have one of those devices in my home. I know my cellphone is already listening to me all the time but I don’t need anything else like that, haha. I know that makes me sound a bit crazy, but one of the things I love about the Homeminder is that it doesn’t require an internet connection or an app or anything like that. It would be fun to incorporate BVC into the mix without relying on a constant internet connection. I guess I just like things old school! Thanks so much for the response!

[Brian H]

So you have a Smarthome 4826A 4 pin or 4826B 3 pin coupler repeater.
They did work in my signal tests. Memory here maybe ~ 3 volts X10 signals on both phases. On an XTBM X10 signal meter. Though one of mine (I had 2) lost output on one phase but the Transmit LED indicated it did send a signal back to its phase. The LED patterns can sometimes give you added information. Like did the TM751 get to the 4826 and was it resent.

Look for signal suckers on the TM751 and controlled receive circuits. The SS13A maybe received by the TM751 but not reliably getting to the modules you want to control. I have some LED TVs. That have a capacitor across the power lines to stop its internal electrical noise from getting back on to the power lines. That capacitor absorbs X10 signals as noise. I have one outlet with a .2V X10 signal when the TV is connected and about 7.5V X10 with it disconnected. An XPPF fixed that. Though .2V X10 is way better than the minimum signal to reliably control a module.

I do have a few X10 devices in use with an Insteon system. As the earlier modules also accepted an X10 address added to them. I can still control them with an HR12A. One house code sixteen unit code remotes.

[Tuicemen]

I understand not wishing to use a device such as Alexa for voice control. I played with several voice control softwares including BVC and even incorporated into  my own creations like PC Companion. In order to use any of these for x10 you'll need a x10 computer interface that the software supports. You also do not need to run a old Windows version like XP.
 If it is the animated face of BVC that appeals to you then X10 software is limited to just a few old unsupported options.
 I had even used Windows included voice (Cortana) for X10 control and had success with it, however I never attempted timers or macros with it.

[brobin]

Make sure you keep that GE Hominder on a UPS or you'll be reprogramming it after every power failure! I had one about 40 years ago and thought it was great but quickly moved on when the CP-290 came out.

[Esgelrothion]

@Brian H - Yes, that's correct - I had forgotten the brand name. It's a 3-pin model, which I have it plugged in to the dryer outlet in my laundry room. That signal meter sounds very helpful! I'll have to keep an eye out for one. I don't think I have terribly many signal suckers - one TV that's only used for the HomeMinder, my laptop that's always plugged into the wall, and the usual assortment of major kitchen appliances. I have some keyboards and other gear in the music studio downstairs plugged into a beefy powerstrip, but they're always turned off when not in use. I might look into an XPPF for the TV and music studio just to see if that helps. I appreciate your technical insights - it's hard to come across that level of detailed information about such an "old" protocol these days!

@Tuiceman - I think I'll let the HomeMinder continue to handle the timers, so Cortana could work. Though it would be nice to be able to set the exterior lights to turn on at dusk and off at dawn, which I think I remember reading one person was able to do with BVC. Correct me if I'm wrong, but BVC was never updated to run on Windows 7, was it? I was thinking I could run a virtual machine with XP so I can run ActiveHome and BVC with an X-10 computer interface. This particular branch of technology starts to get more complicated than I'm used to, but I'd be ok with a challenge! I like the idea of BVC because it's like pushing X-10 to it's boundaries in an interesting way; and I've always enjoyed "older" technologies. I didn't even know BVC had an animated face! I haven't seen any images of the program, and Dave's youtube channel/fan site looks to be defunct. I like the idea of the animated face, though! Could be either cool or a little creepy, but 'tis the season for creepiness!

@brobin - I had that thought too, but I can't find a UPS that I like the looks of that's not ridiculously expensive. Maybe I've just not looked hard enough! I've lost power several times over the past year I've been using the HomeMinder, but only once did I have to reprogram the whole system. I think there's an internal battery that keeps it going during a power outage, for a little while at least.

[Brian H]

Off but not disconnected can still have a signal sucker. As most things these days have some  sort of standby condition. So the supply is always connected with the power lines.
Depending on your equipment. Most of the later model computers have a power correction type power supply. They frequently don't like the modified or stepped sine wave output of an UPS. When on battery backup. I have a pure sine wave UPS with its AC input on a Smarthome 10 amp FilterLinc. As most UPS units have a AC power conditioning input that can also signal suck X10 and other power line protocol signals as noise. The unfiltered AC output on the front has my 2413S PLM for my Insteon and X10 controller.
We do see things like Laptop power supplies effecting X10 signals.
Some things we may not think of. Are the newer appliances with electronic controls. Also effecting X10 and Insteon power line signals.

The XPPF is rated for five amps. I can not say if they have improved it lately {mine are old} the internal inductors get hot when running close to five amps and the plastic forms start to get soft. So they may get deformed.
One reason I have a few 5 or 10 amp FilterLincs in use. Hint the 10 amp where more costly but all the components inside are the same except a 5 or 10 amp fuse.
I see that JV Digital is still showing in stock. Their XTB-F15+ 15 amp filters.

[Tuicemen]

@Tuiceman - I think I'll let the HomeMinder continue to handle the timers, so Cortana could work. Though it would be nice to be able to set the exterior lights to turn on at dusk and off at dawn, which I think I remember reading one person was able to do with BVC. Correct me if I'm wrong, but BVC was never updated to run on Windows 7, was it? I was thinking I could run a virtual machine with XP so I can run ActiveHome and BVC with an X-10 computer interface. This particular branch of technology starts to get more complicated than I'm used to, but I'd be ok with a challenge! I like the idea of BVC because it's like pushing X-10 to it's boundaries in an interesting way; and I've always enjoyed "older" technologies. I didn't even know BVC had an animated face! I haven't seen any images of the program, and Dave's youtube channel/fan site looks to be defunct. I like the idea of the animated face, though! Could be either cool or a little creepy, but 'tis the season for creepiness!

BVC didn't require AHP just the SDK.
I'm pretty sure BVC would run on Win7  I know my voice programs with faces would.
AHP will do dusk dawn timers and macros however it only worked with a CM11, CM15A or CM19 if memory serves me right.
I created several face sets one of which Bill included in BVC the one Bill included can be seen here https://www.angelfire.com/in2/ontkoi/X10AHP/PcCompanion.html

[petera]

At the risk of sounding repetitive it is not advised to use Windows 7 or below these days and certainly not one that is connected to the outside world. However there is a method of installing Windows XP on a Windows 10 computer in what’s known as a virtual machine or VM as it’s better known.

Not being either a Windows user or an AHP user, from what I can gather support for AHP evaporated around the time of Windows XP. Well what better OS to install AHP on if that’s the case in the knowledge that it will be completely isolated from the outside world, or sandboxed as it’s also referred to.

For anyone interested in this route here’s one of many links on how to achieve this. Do be warned though not to install anything directly onto a Windows 7 or below machine that has any possible contact with the outside world. Maybe this will help AHP users clinging on to the last vestiges of AHP and possibly X10.

https://www.how2shout.com/how-to/how-to-install-windows-xp-iso-on-windows-10-virtualbox.html

[JeffVolp]

JV Digital made some very good accessories. A few may still be available.
I have a few of their devices myself. Like the XTB-IIR coupler repeater. Hits my system with >10V X10 signals and my lowest area is still about 1V, Too bad it is one of the modules no longer made.
His troubleshooting tutorials have given me lots of help over the years. https://jvde.us/x10-troubleshooting/

The XTBR, XTB-523, and XTB-ANR are still available.  The XTBR is a little brother to the XTB-IIR, and runs essentially the same code.  It has a smaller power supply, and doesn't deliver quite as much punch as the IIR, but it is still way more than normal X10 transmitters.  You just need a 2-component coupling network across the phases.

Regarding the power supply, all XTB transmitters used transformer power supplies.  They are bigger and certainly heavier than switching supplies, but they generate no noise and can handle brief overloads.  The X10 signal has a very low duty cycle, and that transformer is overloaded during transmission.  The XTBR delivers over 20Vpp into a 5 ohm load, which represents over 10 watts of signal power pulled from a 2.4VA transformer at a 6% duty cycle.  (1mS burst every 16.6mS)

Jeff

[Esgelrothion]

Sorry for the delay in responding - work and home things tend to get in the way of much more fun HA things!

I appreciate all your responses! Looks like I’ll definitely want to get a couple filters for some of my passive electronics even if they’re not on. That should hopefully alleviate some of the issues with the wireless switches! By and large they work great but there are just a few that are touchy.

If I am able to learn if BVC is still available (I found some free downloads on other websites but I’m always leery about that) then I will definitely use a virtual machine to sequester it from harm.

I’ll definitely check out the devices from JV Digital Engineering - they definitely look really interesting - thanks for the info!!

I’ve still not received a response to the email I sent to Bill just over two weeks ago. I’m hoping I’ll get a response. I’m just leery of sending a PayPal payment through that I’m not sure will be received for a product that I’m not sure will be delivered. So, we’ll see how things progress. In the meantime I still have to put up the roller shade motors, and the motion sensors never fail to be awesome. Can’t wait until I can hopefully soon incorporate voice control via BVC!

[Brian H]

The wireless switches problems could be two things.
X10 RF devices are not the most robust signal wise.
May depend on the distance from the sender to the receiver.
Something between the sender and the receiver. Like a wall or orientation of the sender and receiver antenna.
I have seen construction projects to add antennas to X10 modules safely.
As most have hot chassis and Line as a common.
If the receiver sending the power line signals. Has a signal issue to the module being controlled.
X10WTI and present owners. Do have their transmitting modules in the FCC Database.
Many have the schematic of the module released. Not like most have them being confidential.
Also internal photos. So you can see things like component location, antenna location and orientation, push button operation.
X10 Grantee Code is B4S.
Product Code is the remaining numbers and letters.
https://apps.fcc.gov/oetcf/eas/reports/GenericSearch.cfm

[glacier991]

I am a little late to the party, but I was very much involved in the early days of voice control you reference. it was a ton of fun.

I have a free module offered in the General Discussion forum at the top of this Board, you might otherwise enjoy that.

That said, in truth Alexa or Google can do everything you want, and more, easier, cheaper and better.

I did my own Voice control with Bill John's stuff, but now, I woul dnot go back.

Play with my free module and 32 pre-recorded voice messages, save yourself some time and angst, then move to Alexa or Gooogle is my advice... albeit late.