Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[medvampire]

I come again seeking words of wisdom from the forum.
I have had the X10 up and running for a few days to find I lack control in some of the house. After searching the forums here I am certain I will need a phase coupler. I am not too whoopee about popping open my breaker panel to install one there but would like to get the type that is in line with my dryer.
I have a manufactured home 2006 model built by Norris homes. I have to install  the pahse coupler in the external box because my internal breaker box is full.
I also noted as spoken here in the forums that the labeling of the breaker box is way off when I was mapping circuits for the X10 system. You would figure that it being a factory build they would be able to get that right. I love the home but would like to strangle the dealer but that is for a difftent forum.
So here are the questions.

Would the dryer type of passive phase coupler work for this application?
Do I need a repeater in this size of home 2000 sq foot?
Does X10 work well in manufactured housing?

What will become of Captain Coupling? “Uncle Phill” didn’t ever answer that burning question in his articles.
Thanks
Steve

[KDR]

medvampire,
What are your troubled area's? I would not be surprised if you say bedrooms since the house was built in 2006. Did you try the "Turn Dryer On" trick to see if the troubled area's improved? Maybe toss in some detail about what area's that are problem and where the computer that runs AHP and the CM15A are located.

I had a dryer type repeater/coupler that would mess up AHP and macros due to the delay and repeated signal. I did go out and install a passive coupler in the dryer plug and it worked great. I have around 1700 sq ft home built in 1921.

[medvampire]

Thanks for the reply
You are right about the bed rooms.
I was going to try a passive first.
They say a pic is worth a 1000 words.

I tried the dryer trick and no joy.
As soon as I get home from work this morning I am going to move the CM15A around with a test lamp module to see what happens.
Thanks
Steve

[Brian H]

I understand many new homes have what is called an Arc Breaker type outlet. Many in bedrooms, Some are known X10 problem makers.

[Oldtimer]

I understand many new homes have what is called an Arc Breaker type outlet. Many in bedrooms, Some are known X10 problem makers.

If you're like me and weren't aware of these check here:

Ask The Builder: New Arc Fault Breakers

[TTA Edit: Added description to LINK.]

[medvampire]

Just got home and looked at the breaker box and I do have arc fault breakers except the whirl pool.
I also took the CM15A and moved to one of the bedrooms and tested with lamp module and wolla I have control in the other bed rooms and bath rooms. I will be ordering a phase coupler soon. Per advice from you good folks I will get a passive coupler.
For those following my question in the other thread ... The boys were happy about me not having control in their room but they will be sadly disappointed now.
Thanks again
Steve

[Dan Lawrence]

Pigs Electronics in Baltimore, MD (www.pigselectronics.com) sells a 0.1 uF 250 VAC Capacitor for $0.99. If you have an electric stove., you can attach it between the main wires in the box the stove is plugged into. it will bridge the phases and not detract from the stove's perfomance at all. If you have a local electronics store, get one there. If that's not what you want, get either the XPCP Passive Coupler or the XPCR Coupler/Repeater which are made specifically to solve this problem.

Good Luck!!  When all your X10 modules can be addresses, timers and macros work the way they are supposed to.

[Brian H]

Just remember that a passive coupler only passes the signal at the level it is at the coupler. So if the CM15A sends 5 VPP and it is 1VPP at the coupler. Only 1 VPP gets to go back the other phase. Also you still may have a signal sucker or noise generator. So selective unplugging things may show more information. If the phase coupler doesn't do the whole thing.

[KDR]

Most ARC breakers have problems with X10... some brands of breakers are worse then others. On Jan 1 2002 National Electrical Code says all residential bedrooms had to have ARC Fault breakers. Some states have already revised that stating that all rooms in residential has to have them.

Coupling sounds like its going to help you but in the long run you may need to get something to boost the signal to a higher voltage. I wonder if X10 is going to do anything to make there products better as more and more ARC breakers populate the market. At some point I will consider installing a new main with all ARC breakers.

[TakeTheActive]

Pigs Electronics in Baltimore, MD (www.pigselectronics.com) sells a 0.1 uF 250 VAC Capacitor for $0.99. If you have an electric stove., you can attach it between the main wires in the box the stove is plugged into. it will bridge the phases and not detract from the stove's perfomance at all. If you have a local electronics store, get one there...

Stay away from the capactor thingy unless you want to risk voiding you home insurance policy or you know what you are doing.   Whenever you do your own wiring ask yourself first can I do it well enough so an electrical inspector can say it's safe?   Finding a burnt capactor next to a electrical fire is not good.

...I have some good working knowledge and have had experiance building filters so I am comfortable with the "how"...but since this is all on the mains I need to stay with CSA and ESA approved stuff to not risk a home owners insurance issue...

[vhoang]

--------
Starting Aug. 1, when the 2004 California Electrical Codes automatically take effect, residents will have to apply for a city building permits to replace or add wall, porch and ceiling lamps, light switches, electric receptacles, and other common do-it-yourself chores.

So changing that noisy electrical switch with a quieter mercury switch will cost a lot more. Besides the costs of the new switch, there’ll be the $81 basic permit fee plus an additional surcharge of $2.15 for each receptacle, outlet or switch and—if you want to add more—$21.50 for altering or changing wiring.

Under the current city code, such small changes can be made without permits and inspections; starting Aug. 1, not so.

The exemptions are currently allowed under Chapter 19.30.080 of the city electrical code. City Building Officer Joan McQuarrie said there’s a question about whether or not the exemptions could be incorporated into the new code.

“We’re looking into that,” said Deputy City Attorney Zach Cowan. “Generally cities are allowed to adopt more restrictive findings based on local conditions, but not less restrictive. But it never hurts to ask.”

-------

  - Light switch replacement is listed there....  Most cities will allow changing things that already exist, and already inside an enclosure.   You have more flexibility when it's in your own house to I beleive.   But it doesn't hurt to call your
local city official to see if you have concerns about it.   They may just tell you "What are you talking about."  "Of course you can change your own light switch"  or they may add a disclamer.   

That's california for you.

[medvampire]

I didn't plan to use a cap in the fuse box. I know the ideal may work but I like my home just the way it is with insurance. I just wont take the risk with my family. I live in rural Tennessee and have very little to worry about in the way way of building permits or code. The county here looks at like this" If you put shingles on you must have a permit" . Part of the reason I bought a manufactured home is due to the building codes here. HUD codes are much more stringent than local building codes. I am going to order a dryer type passive coupler and give it a try.
Thanks
Steve

[dave w]

--------
Starting Aug. 1, when the 2004 California Electrical Codes automatically take effect, residents will have to apply for a city building permits to replace or add wall, porch and ceiling lamps, light switches, electric receptacles, and other common do-it-yourself chores.

So changing that noisy electrical switch with a quieter mercury switch will cost a lot more. Besides the costs of the new switch, there’ll be the $81 basic permit fee plus an additional surcharge of $2.15 for each receptacle, outlet or switch and—if you want to add more—$21.50 for altering or changing wiring.

That's california for you.

Wow....+$82 to change a busted outlet. How do they detect and enforce....monitor wall switch sales at Home Depot? Makes me wanna pack bags and move to the left coast! Their next move will be a permit required to change toilet paper roll.

[steven r]

Starting Aug. 1, when the 2004 California Electrical Codes automatically take effect, residents will have to apply for a city building permits to replace or add wall, porch and ceiling lamps, light switches, electric receptacles, and other common do-it-yourself chores.

So changing that noisy electrical switch with a quieter mercury switch will cost a lot more. Besides the costs of the new switch, there’ll be the $81 basic permit fee plus an additional surcharge of $2.15 for each receptacle, outlet or switch and—if you want to add more—$21.50 for altering or changing wiring....

Sounds like some politicians got some big donations from the electrical unions lobbies.

[Puck]

I tried the dryer trick and no joy.

medvampire: Seeing that you have tried this and it didn't work, plus from reading posts about the Arc Breakers not being X-10 friendly. The phase coupler alone may not solve your problem with controlling modules in your bedrooms. It's definately good to have and it should help with the other areas you are having problems with, but for the bedrooms, you may have to use individual Transceivers on the circuits that have Arc Breakers just to bypass them.

Just a thought after reading through this thread... but here's hoping the coupler does solve all your problem areas.