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[watson524]

Hi all,

I have a mini timer as my controller and then a mix of plug in lamplincs and actual outlets for various things. We have candles in the windows and in some rooms they're controlled by the plug in units (vs the outlets). We got the system last year at this time. I've noticed in the past, but didn't think much of it, that our candles come on if there's a power flicker though it's not time for them to come on. This morning, with the snow/mix storm here in the northeast, we had a lot of power flickers (sometimes going completely off but mostly flickers). I would hit the all off button on the mini timer and all would go off but as soon as it flickered again, the candles/inside decorations on the plug in units would come on and stay on.

Is there anything I can do about this? It's almost like the outlets have a default state of "off" until told otherwise but the plug in modules have a default state of "on".....

This makes for a real annoyance when it's 3am and all the candles in your bedroom light up.

thanks!

[dave w]

Older X10 Lamp Modules may trigger to ON when the power flickers. I have older modules that do it but I alway thought X10 did a pretty good job of fixing that un-wanted "feature" when they added MOVs (surge protectors) to the Lamp and Appliance Modules. In the case of the old X10 modules, no there was nothing to be done about the problem.

However you say your Smarthome Lamplincs are also doing it, but LampLincs are not the same animal. You might try reprogramming the Lamplincs so they do not have the "Local Control" feature turned ON and see if they still do it. If so, try calling Smarthome customer service, they may have a fix.

[watson524]

Older X10 Lamp Modules may trigger to ON when the power flickers. I have older modules that do it but I alway thought X10 did a pretty good job of fixing that un-wanted "feature" when they added MOVs (surge protectors) to the Lamp and Appliance Modules. In the case of the old X10 modules, no there was nothing to be done about the problem.

However you say your Smarthome Lamplincs are also doing it, but LampLincs are not the same animal. You might try reprogramming the Lamplincs so they do not have the "Local Control" feature turned ON and see if they still do it. If so, try calling Smarthome customer service, they may have a fix.

Not sure if they are smarthome lamplincs... they say "x10 powerhouse" on the front. When you say "older" how old? I got these on eBay last year at this time. Do you know to turn off the "local control"? I didn't even know that feature was an option until you just mentioned it and I did a quick search to see what it is.

thanks!

[Brian H]

X10 Powerhouse is a module from X10. LampLinc is a Smarthome Module and is completely different.

Easy way to tell if your LM465s are older or newer style.
When you turn them on and off. Is the change instant or do they slowly go on and off?
Fast is the old design.
Slow [called slow start] are the new design.
You may also get a clue from the date code on the small white round sticker on the module.

In my tests both the new and older Lamp Modules have Local Control and it can not be defeated. I tried both types and both do not go on when power is applied. Though simulating a small power drop test was inconclusive. I don't have any of the real old modules  dave w mentioned.

What type lights are they and what wattage?

[watson524]

Easy way to tell if your LM465s are older or newer style.
When you turn them on and off. Is the change instant or do they slowly go on and off?
Fast is the old design.
Slow [called slow start] are the new design.

Mine are the newer ones then, because they ramp up and down when coming on and off vs a sudden on/off like my outlets.

In my tests both the new and old Lamp Modules have Local Control and it can not be defeated. I tried both types and both do not go on when power is applied. Though simulating a small power drop test was inconclusive.

Seems like mine do the exact opposite then since they do go on when the power flickers/comes back on. I did find this which seems to indicate that you can cut a diode to override local control http://idobartana.com/hakb/modifying_lamp_module.htm

What type lights are they and what wattage?

Candles are just the regular candle incandescent bulbs, 7w each Also have some mini string lights (non LED) being powered on a Christmas tree and also some garland strings on banisters and above the mantle.

thanks!
[/quote]

[dave w]

Not sure if they are smarthome lamplincs... they say "x10 powerhouse" on the front. When you say "older" how old? I got these on eBay last year at this time. Do you know to turn off the "local control"? I didn't even know that feature was an option until you just mentioned it and I did a quick search to see what it is.

thanks!

If they say "X10 Powerhouse" then they are X10 and the Local Control can not be disabled through programming.

By "old" X10 coming on when the power flickered, I mean 1980's product. I am not sure when X10 added the MOV's but believe it was late 80s or early 90s. Like I said I have some that will come ON after a power fail, but they are all close to 20 years old.

You have new Lamp Modules so your problem seems unique. Coming ON after power fail is not a big complaint/issue on the forum.  Maybe X10 will exchange them.

[watson524]

I bought them through eBay so I think I'm out of luck. I just ordered another one as part of another order from an eBay store with a switch and an appliance module so perhaps I'll see if that one behaves differently.

Would flipping the breaker on / off in the panel be sufficient to replicate and power flicker from say a storm?

[Charles Sullivan]

I bought them through eBay so I think I'm out of luck. I just ordered another one as part of another order from an eBay store with a switch and an appliance module so perhaps I'll see if that one behaves differently.

Would flipping the breaker on / off in the panel be sufficient to replicate and power flicker from say a storm?

X10 modules are susceptable to being turned on by voltage spikes or arcing on the power line.  A good solid "ON" from a switch will usually not do it unless the switch contacts are corroded or they bounce.

[coasterdude]

I have the same issue. Just got on the forum to see if there was a solution. When I get a power flicker, ALL my lamp modules come on and stay on. This is all a new set up and ordered from X10 last year. I have the new modules since they slowly power on the lamps and then dim down when I turn them off.

This is very annoying at nights when I have a power glitch in the spring and I have to get up and turn all my lights off manually so it doesnt keep doing it through out the night.

So I understand there is no solution?

[Brian H]

To clarify my no easy way to disable Local Control Sensing. There is no user setting that can be done on the X10 modules. There where mods that could do it but the X10 warranty was then void. Local control sensing was settable on some other manufacturers modules.That where not re-branded X10 modules.

The cut the diode thing is for the older lamp modules Local Control Sensing. I have not seen an data on the soft start models.
I may disassemble a soft start model and see what it looks like.

Disabling local control may or may not fix the power flicker problem. As Charles pointed out. Voltage Spikes and arcing still may turn them on. My Insteon LampLinc Dimmers and ApplianceLincs also have been scrambled by flickering power.

[dave w]

I may disassemble a soft start model and see what it looks like.

Disabling local control may or may not fix the power flicker problem.

Brian, I don't have any of the soft start Lamp Modules. If you disect one, look to see if X10 still have the MOV on the board. Since this suddenly is becoming an issue after having been semi fixed a decade or two ago,  I am wondering if they did not take the MOV out as a cost reduction when they went to the LM14 controller chip.

Be a great way for X10 to shoot them selves in the foot, which they seem to enjoy doing to save a penny.

[HA Dave]

Be a great way for X10 to shoot them selves in the foot, which they seem to enjoy doing to save a penny.

I don't think it's fair to say X10 shoots themselves in the foot to save money. I think they just enjoy the pain.

[Brian H]

My Date Code: 08A01 has a MOV across the Line to Neutral. VDR PN:07D221K
It is now almost the end of 09 so things could have changed again. As X10 posts no revision data.

Microcontroller Sonix PN:SN8P501B
I believe the sticker on the PCB P10820C is the X10 controller part number including the revision.

I found what maybe the Local Control Sensor parts but no tests or guarantees. R14 and D4. R14 may disconnect the whole circuit.

One other difference between a SS LM465 and a LM14A. The LM14A remembers the dim level it was at and an On command goes back to the dim it was set to. The SS LM465 goes back full On.

[dave w]

I don't think it's fair to say X10 shoots themselves in the foot to save money. I think they just enjoy the pain.

 

Oh gee whiz, I laughed so hard I had to take a nitro. 

[dave w]

My Date Code: 08A01 has a MOV across the Line to Neutral. VDR PN:07D221K

OK I take back my verbal abuse. X10 did not try and save a dime by removing the MOV, but I wonder what is causing what appears to be an upswing in ON after Power Fail or OAPF!