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[dbemowsk]

I wasn't sure where to put this topic.  I figured since it had something to do with the software I am writing using the SDK, that I'd put it here even though the question does not directly relate to the SDK.

I am wondering if there is a xml or other type of file that AHP uses to identify module properties to identify to tell which modules are dimmable.  I am working on an addition to my software that will allow me to dim lights.  This will require that I determine which modules are dimmable modules.  I have a section of the program that imports from .ahx files, and in an .ahx file, the module type is defined (e.g. type="LM465"), and I want to determine from that which modules have dimming capabilities.  Somehow AHP knows from the module type selected whether or not a module is dimmable.  I could have the user check a box if a module is dimmable or not, but the less the user has to do the better.

Any input is appreciated.

[Dan Lawrence]

You should know by now that Lamp Modules dim, Appliance Modules don't.   A list isn't really needed.
 

[dbemowsk]

You should know by now that Lamp Modules dim, Appliance Modules don't.   A list isn't really needed.
 

This I do know, but I want a way to programatically determine this for the software.  There are different types and models of dimmable modules.  I want the software to be able to look at the module type in the .ahx file and know that it is a dimmable module when someone does the import.  In the AHP software, when you set up your modules and choose a dimmable module, the software knows that when you are viewing that module that it needs to put a slider control for dimming.  It also knows that if the module is a two way module that it needs to put a polling button to poll the status.  At this point I would only need to know if modules are dimable, but if there is a list somewhere that shows other features of the modules, I could possibly use that to expand the software in the future.  If someone knows of a website that has a table with this information, that would work too.
 

[-Bill- (of wgjohns.com)]

It would appear from my exploration that the module properties that AHP uses to figure out what specific modules can do is hard-coded into the AHP software, and not in an easily accessable .ahx, .xml, or other easily readable file.   

 

[dbemowsk]

I decided to use the xlinks.xml file as a base to create my own XML file that lists the properties of each of the modules listed.  Once done, I will post the file for others that may want to use it.

In response to Dan Lawrence's comment that lamp modules dim and appliance modules don't, for the most part that is true.  Take for instance the LM15A socket rocket.  The LM would indicate that it is a lamp module, but it is not a dimmable module.  This is part of the reason for this research.

[Brian H]

You may also have to take into consideration. The age of the module.
When X10 went to soft start in the lamp and wall switch modules. They act differently than the older ones.
To make things even more muddy. I found a 2008 Soft Start Lamp Module and a 2009 version act differently to the same commands.

[dbemowsk]

You may also have to take into consideration. The age of the module.
When X10 went to soft start in the lamp and wall switch modules. They act differently than the older ones.

I didn't realize that the soft starts acted differently other than the fact that most if not all of them have a resume dim when turned on, and of course the ramp up to brightness.  Are you saying that if I issue a bright/dim command that they respond to the bright/dim differently than a standard lamp module?  If so, how is it different? 

To make things even more muddy. I found a 2008 Soft Start Lamp Module and a 2009 version act differently to the same commands.

Did the 2008 and 2009 modules have the same model number?

[Dan Lawrence]

X10 has not changed the model numbers of Soft Start modules which muddys the water.  What helps is to mark a "SS" in permanent marker on the case when you find one in your inventory or purchase.  Also, assume (remember the old joke about it) that all new purchases are Soft Start unless proved not to be.  I ordered 5 Lamp Modules from Automated Outlet a couple of months ago, of the 5, 2 were Soft Start ones, which promptly got SS on the cases.

[Brian H]

Dan basically covered it. X10 has not changed the model numbers between old; newer and newest lamp modules or any other module. Like the new CFL friendly appliance module or the soft start wall switches. I have not seen a date code list either.

I will see if I can find some threads where I posted the differences I found between them.

[dbemowsk]

Well, I have compiled an XML file of a number of the modules with attributes for each.  I am not sure if all the information is correct.  As Dan L. and Brian H. have pointed out with the soft start modules, some of the modules I have listed as soft start may or may not in fact be soft start.
here is the list http://www.phpwebscripting.com/downloads/modules.xml

Any corrections/updates/additions to this list are greatly appreciated.  I hope this information helps some of you.

I am still curious if the soft start modules respond to bright and dim commands differently than standard modules and how.

[Brian H]

Will take a look at you files.
Here is some findings on the LM465 but there maybe a more detailed one. Though I believe the data maybe spread in a few threads.
http://forums.x10.com/index.php?PHPSESSID=bv170h4vserv2m5dmrki555jv4&topic=20367.0
http://forums.x10.com/index.php?PHPSESSID=bv170h4vserv2m5dmrki555jv4&topic=13006.0

[Brian H]

I downloaded your file.

You may want to look at the X10Pro web site.
http://www.x10pro.com/

In the Instruction manuals section is where the soft start notes are.
The XPDF;XPD3;PLW01 and PLW02 are listed as Soft Start for 08. That could also mean the X10 WS4777 may now also be soft start.

I will see what I can find on your Bright Dim question on soft start Lamp Modules. I know one of my soft start ones will not dim to 0% like the old ones did.

[dbemowsk]

It just blows my mind that they did not put some kind of indicator on their model numbers like XPDFSS and PLW01SS.  What I may end up doing is in the program, use the list I have to determine if the module is dimmable, and have a user check box so they can indicate this as a soft start module.  But the only reason I would need that is if the commands for dimming a soft start module are different than dimming a regular lamp module.

Most of the information I used for the XML file was taken from the X10 knowledge base pages.  I looked up each module.

All this information is for is so that when someone imports their ahx file into the software I have a way of making the modules act like they would if controlled from AHP. 

[Brian H]

Old LM465 Date Code sticker fell off:
If off dim causes full on then dims down to 0%.
If off bright causes 100% on.
Responds to All Lights On; All Lights Off and All Units Off.

New soft start Date Code 08A01
If off dim causes fast on to 100% then dims down to maybe 15-20% minimum.
If off bright causes a fast on to 100%
Responds to All Lights On; All Lights off and All Units Off. Ramps on and off. Was a problem with security consoles flashing the lights when triggered.
Sequence of on and off commands ramps up and down.

New Soft Start Date Code 09J44
If off dim causes fast on to 100% then dims down to maybe 15-20% minimum
If off bright causes fast on to 100%
Responds to All Lights On; All Lights Off and All Units Off. Fast on and off. Should flash with a security console alarm.
One set of on and off commands and it would ramp on and off.
A sequence of on and off commands would do one ramp on and off then revert to fast on and off actions.

I believe there where comments that the Soft Start modules could also be sent bright and dim commands in extended format. That I have not been able to test myself. I believe the calling the soft start modules a LM14A gave you added things.

http://kbase.x10.com/wiki/Newer_Wall_Switches_and_Preset_Dim
http://kbase.x10.com/wiki/SoftStart

[Brian H]

The above tests where done with a Smarthome 1132CU X10 controller issuing standard X10 commands and a HR12A Palm Pad through a TM751 on a test use House Code.

I fired up my CM15A and AHP. Defined a new test module as an LM14A and was able to use the brightness slider to vary both Soft Start lamp modules from about 20% to 99%. On and Off went to 0% and 100%. So there are some X10 commands that can vary the new soft start Lamp Modules brightness directly and not the old On full then dim down the old ones used. Though the soft start one did follow the original on 100% then dim down routine also.