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[JJtech]

Hi,

I read the other post about the PalmPad issue but mine is slightly different.

I have a UM506 connected to a, believe it or not, garage door opener that open raises and lowers all the blinds in my home.  It works fine most of the time via a timer setting within the AHP.  It’s very simple, “turn on” 10 minutes after dusk, off at 10pm.

But, there’s always but, now and again, consistently for the last couple of weeks, when the blinds go down, a second later they go back up.  The garage door opener is only trigger on a “on” signal from the UM506.

I have 1 CM15A connected to the computer and another CM15A in the kitchen merely controlling a light via a active eye via a little macro.

Keep in mind, it takes maybe 14 seconds for the blinds to either raise of lower so I don’t think this is an issue of “immediate multiple commands” issued.

I have checked the reports and this timer is the only thing that effects this module.

Attached is a screen print of this timer.  Any ideas?

One other question:

If your CM15A is connected to the PC, does it make any difference if the AHP is running on the PC in any way?

Thanks!

JJ

[dave w]

Is the UM506 still in "Momentary" mode?
Are UM contacts opening (very high resistance) completely?
Is the UM getting a second trigger?

[JJtech]

Yes for "Momentary" mode.

Yes for opening completely.

No, no secondary trigger that I am generating in AHP.

[dave w]

Yes for "Momentary" mode.

Yes for opening completely.

No, no secondary trigger that I am generating in AHP.

Well is the UM clicking when the blinds go down?
Is anything binding that would cause the garage door motor reverse?

In other words: you are saying no second trigger is coming from AHP, and that the activity monitor is not recording any outside X10 commands for the UM. So it seems you have only two areas to troubleshoot. The UM and the lifter....what is left?

[Brian H]

If the opener uses a sensor to detect all the way open or closed. You may want to make sure it has not gotten out of adjustment.

[JJtech]

Dave:

Well is the UM clicking when the blinds go down?

>>>>>>>>>  Yes, both up and down.  The GDO responses to a momentary close of the circuit.

Is anything binding that would cause the garage door motor reverse?

>>>>>>>>>  Definitely not.  I have the two electric eyes pointed at each other.

In other words: you are saying no second trigger is coming from AHP, and that the activity monitor is not recording any outside X10 commands for the UM. So it seems you have only two areas to troubleshoot. The UM and the lifter....what is left?

>>>>>>>>>  I have only looked at the activity monitor tonight and tonight it just took the blinds down as it is supposed to, not back up.  Tonight, unlike most nights, I had the AHP running.  Should that make a difference?  Should there be any difference when the CM15A is connected to the PC if AHP is actually running or not???

Is there any way to search or copy the log of the activity monitor to a spreadsheet?  Overwhelming to try to find a particular point within the dozens of screens.

Brian:

If the opener uses a sensor to detect all the way open or closed. You may want to make sure it has not gotten out of adjustment.

>>>>>>>>>  Nope, it is performing as it should.  The problem is somehow coming from X10.

[Dan Lawrence]

Why use 2 CM15A's?  There are other ways to control X10 modules than 2 CM15A's.

[JJtech]

I had 2 CM15As on hand and a lamp to control on a different circuit.  Cheap and easy way to do it as the signal wasn’t always making the “jump” across the circuit from the 1st CM15A.

[dave w]

Dave:

Well is the UM clicking when the blinds go down?

Yes, both up and down. 
Tonight, unlike most nights, I had the AHP running.  Should that make a difference?  Should there be any difference when the CM15A is connected to the PC if AHP is actually running or not???

OK, summarize: The UM clicks and the blinds lower, so it appears the UM is being told to activate a few seconds after you raise the blinds. But everything works correct if computer/AHP is running the show, and not the autonomous CM15A. You changed the CM15A but blinds still go down a few seconds after raise.  It was working, now it does not from the CM15A.

Have you modified any macros between the time it worked and now does not? (past couple of weeks in your OP).

AFA does things work different if PC is connected to CM15A and running AHP. Yeah there is big difference, CM15A memory is minuscule, so you are limited in the number of Flags, Monitored House Codes, when running from CM15A, you can not have Conditional Logic, when running from CM15A.

[JJtech]

Dave,

Goal:  AHP via a timer is supposed to lower the blinds 10 minutes after dusk.  (see screen shot that was included in the first post). 

Problem:  For the last couple of weeks, immediately after the blinds lower, they go back up.  I have not had AHP running for a couple of weeks.


OK, summarize: The UM clicks and the blinds lower,
>>>>>>>>>>>>  Yes


so it appears the UM is being told to activate a few seconds after you “raise the blinds.“
>>>>>>>>>>>>  no, “after the blinds lower”

But everything works correct if computer/AHP is running the show, and not the autonomous CM15A. You changed the CM15A but blinds still go down a few seconds after raise. It was working, now it does not from the CM15A.

>>>>>>>>>>>>  The CM15A is always connect to the PC.  Tonight for the first time in a while, I happened to have the AHP running and the blinds just went down once and stayed down like they are supposed to (see screen shot that was included in the first post).  I don’t know yet if that was just coincidental or not.

Have you modified any macros between the time it worked and now does not? (past couple of weeks in your OP).

>>>>>>>>>>>>  No, but I don’t know what “OP” means.

AFA does things work different if PC is connected to CM15A and running AHP. Yeah there is big difference, CM15A memory is minuscule, so you are limited in the number of Flags, Monitored House Codes, when running from CM15A, you cannot have Conditional Logic, when running from CM15A.

>>>>>>>>>>>>  I am only using 20% of my CM15A memory.  Does that mean that I am restricted in ANY WAY?  On top of that, what do you mean by “you cannot have Conditional Logic ?”  Can you give me a specific example?


>>>>>>>>>>>>Is there any way to search or copy the log of the activity monitor to a spreadsheet? Overwhelming to try to find a particular point within the dozens of screens.

[Dan Lawrence]

I had 2 CM15As on hand and a lamp to control on a different circuit.  Cheap and easy way to do it as the signal wasn’t always making the “jump” across the circuit from the 1st CM15A.

I would get a phase coupler, that will allow one CM15A to reach all the phases.  Search here for "phase couplers". 

[JJtech]

Dan,

I live in a 6 unit Victorian.  Two problems with that.  There are 6 different panels and even if there was one, I cannot put a phase coupler in any of them as I rent.

On top of that, this scenario seems to be working.  I won't think that the 2nd CM12A is causing the blind problem.  I think it may have something to do with whether or not the AHP is running.

JJ

[Dan Lawrence]

Dan,

I live in a 6 unit Victorian.  Two problems with that.  There are 6 different panels and even if there was one, I cannot put a phase coupler in any of them as I rent.

On top of that, this scenario seems to be working.  I won't think that the 2nd CM12A is causing the blind problem.  I think it may have something to do with whether or not the AHP is running.

JJ

I presume you pay your own electric bill.   Are the breakers labeled?  They should be.  There's another way to join the phases if you have an electric stove.  A .25 capacitor between the contacts of the outlet (usually behind the stove) will link the two phases and it does not affect the stove.  X10 signals get to cross the phases and the stove doesn't know it's there. 

[Noam]

You said the problem happens only when AHP is NOT running, right?

There is a bug (on the user-maintained Bug List) that causes timers and macros to execute TWICE under certain circumstances.
In my testing, I found this to be the case from the time the X10Nets service is started or restarted (usually at a system boot or reboot, but the user can stop/start/restart it manually, too), until AHP is opened. Once AHP is opened, even if it is closed again right away, the double-running of the timers and macros stops happening.

I wonder if this is what you are seeing. If you have a macro, perhaps double-triggering of it is causing the issue you have.
Are you seeing the commands twice in the Activity Monitor? If not, what ARE you seeing when this is happening?

Another possibility (although remote - and it may have already been mentioned here) is that there is a problem with the motor unit's limit switch detecting a problem, and reversing. Although, I can't think of a scenario where that would be caused or prevented by AHP being open.

One last thought - what happens if you manually short the "down" switch, and then short it again while the blinds are going down. Does it reverse immediately, or wait till it gets to the bottom to reverse? Perhaps the macro is running twice, but the motor delays the second action until it completes a cycle.

[dave w]

You said the problem happens only when AHP is NOT running, right?

There is a bug (on the user-maintained Bug List) that causes timers and macros to execute TWICE under certain circumstances.

Since this would cause the UM to again activate the GDO, It sounds like Noam has nailed your problem. 

BTW "OP" means "original post".

Now I gotta ask: You have a GDO raising/lowering "all the blinds in your home " (!) that has to be impressive, but how do you accomplish that?, run all the blind cords up in your attic and have the GDO mounted up there? That must have been a mechanical design feat! I am impressed, but what if something binds? Does it cause damage?