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[dave w]

..... isolating it from all other circuits?

One circuit being isolated from all other circuits may be explainable by something written years ago by a X10 industry insider (might be a Phil Kingery, Dave Houston, etc...I can't remember).

It goes like this: Oxidation occuring between the disimilar metal of the circuit breaker buss clips and the panel's buss bar can act as a 100kHz attenuator. High current 60Hz gets readily coupled, but high frequency does not. "Stranger than science"... I don't know if it really happens or not. If it really can happen, wiggling the breaker or or disconnecting from the buss and then re-inserting will solve. FWIW back in 1990s in another home, I removed all breakers and sprayed the buss with Cramolin Red..that did indeed improve X10 communications throughout the home. So maybe there is something to it.

However even if that were happening, it would not stop X10 communications within the branch.

It is beyond any more guess work from me, but we all would like to hear if you solve this.

[Brian H]

So with nothing in any of the outlets and the lights Off.
You can't even get a module to respond to a controller also in the same outlet?

If you can find an AM radio. Does it make all kinds of noise if is near that branch circuit?

[Phinnay]

So with nothing in any of the outlets and the lights Off.
You can't even get a module to respond to a controller also in the same outlet?

That is correct... Good idea with the AM radio, I will try that when I get home today...

Oxidation occurring between the dissimilar metal of the circuit breaker buss clips and the panel's buss bar can act as a 100kHz attenuator.

Hrmm, The circuit in question does appear to be one of the original in the home - if it's been there that long i'd bet on some oxidation forming. Would it make sense that the breaker itself was creating the interference and isolating this circuit from the rest of them?

A friend of mine has a sillyscope I can borrow, I'm going to look into how to hook it up and see what is going on. I hate the guessing game but I'm not sure how to troubleshoot this stuff once it's isolated to one branch...

[dhouston]

Tune the radio around a low AM station ~600kHz. If there is 75-200kHz on that branch, you'll hear the harmonics. Ground loops can cause a wire to act like an antenna, picking up RF from the air.

Is it copper or aluminum wire?

For the oscilloscope, you need isolation - I recommend a 120:25VAC step-down transformer. While this will reduce the amplitude of any noise, it's far safer, especially for the inexperienced.

[dave w]

Would it make sense that the breaker itself was creating the interference and isolating this circuit from the rest of them?

Unless it is a GFI or Arc Fault interrupter, a breaker is a passive device. Unlikely to be a noise generator. Also if you cycle the breaker several times, the breaker body movement and internal parts movement should eliminate any signal blocking phenomenon (he says with confidence and authority as if he knows for sure     ).

[dave w]

I hate the guessing game but I'm not sure how to troubleshoot this stuff once it's isolated to one branch...

Boomer. I think you are in uncharted territory. A single branch circuit, with nothing plugged in it or turned on, yet is totally dead to X10 communications. (?)

I suppose you swap a couple of breakers to see if it is coming from your breaker.

[Noam]

I stopped guessing when I read about the fabric-covered, non-grounded wiring.
Sounds like a dangerous situation to me, perhaps you should have the landlord call in an electrician to make sure it is fixed properly.

[Knightrider]

I also once had a loose neutral on a circuit do that to me.  Might be worth checking.

[Phinnay]

I also once had a loose neutral on a circuit do that to me.  Might be worth checking.

Innnnteresttinggg.... Was loose on the back of one of your outlets?


I did not get a chance to work on this last night, will check all outlets and I'm thinking of pulling the outside light off to check the connections - I can definitely see a situation like Dave W mentioned about water getting in there to cause some arc's

[Dan Lawrence]

Could it be the breaker is failing?  If you have a spare breaker on hand, swap them out.  If not, get a new breaker and install it.   

[Knightrider]

I also once had a loose neutral on a circuit do that to me.  Might be worth checking.

Innnnteresttinggg.... Was loose on the back of one of your outlets?


I did not get a chance to work on this last night, will check all outlets and I'm thinking of pulling the outside light off to check the connections - I can definitely see a situation like Dave W mentioned about water getting in there to cause some arc's

Was loose at the bar in the panel.  Dead givaway was the lights had a slight flicker.